Chronic pain patient recently has had a reduction in medication. I have questions

[Prescottdave]

I doubt there is a reduction law and again the Dr is lying to save his own ass. We can't discuss that here though as it's legal discussion and against the rules.

As others said opana sucks orally and only the old ER ones had any use nasally. The IRs are good IV giving long term relief without any feindish IV rush especially the Roxanne brand genetics, but I don't recommend switching to IV. Tell your Dr that you want the morphine as it was more efficient and got through between appointments. You have very real legitimate pain and to take you off the medication while probably not illegal is beyond immoral and against the better judgement of your health care needs, which should be their only concern not whether or not the doctor should worry about the amounts your scripted coming into question as there should be acceptable answers to those questions.

In the meantime try poppy seed tea I'm sincerely nuts about a brand I just picked up, which is a lot better than the red Baron easy to find at a whole chain of stores that is still worthwhile to use in lbs rather than 1/4 that amount with the first brand. Trust me it will help a lot to make poppy seed tea. You throw them in something like a 2 liter or water bottle and shake them with lukewarm water and the cap shut. Then drain the tea by screwing the lid open just a bit, but not enough to come off and flip the bottle upsidedown and squeeze to get all the water out while holding the cap so it doesn't open and let the seeds out. You should probably filter truth a coffee filter too, but is not necessary. You want clean unwashed, untreated, and organic seeds that at higher potencies need a cup of seeds for a good batch while a bad brand need near a lb of seeds.

Keep us updated and I wish you the best. Kratom is also another option, but I think poppy seed tea would work best for you especially as morphine is the best for you

https://www.dea.gov/press-releases/...se-significant-opioid-manufacturing-reduction

 

[tacodude]

That's a reduction of the amount the country can import from manufactures or manufacture themselves... That has nothing to do with regulations regarding what a doctor is aloud to do as far as prescriptions.

 

[Prescottdave]

To my knowledge, they supported their findings but theyre not necessarily implementing the CDC prescribing strategy. The FDA has been relatively conservative.

However, I do want to point out the the DEA has increased the restrictions on total opioid pain medications that can be manufactured, so significantly less opioid pain medication will be available overall. Therefore, the doctor isn't necessarily wrong, and he might be thinking about rationing pain meds in the bigger picture.

Slow mobius stated this specifying the doc may be thinking about rationing because of reduction laws passed by the DEA. He never stated the doctor was restricted by law due to the reduction laws. In response to that you stated, " I doubt there is a reduction law". Well now you know what people are referring to. Now you can instead reframe your response. If you want you can raise the point to others that these reduction laws deal with overall production and do not require doctors to prescribe less. You can respond in that manner instead of the generalized idea that there is no reduction law.

I just thought you may have been unaware of the changes given your response to that post. Not to side track to much I just think some doctors may throw out statements about these reduction laws as if they now have to abide by them in some form. If posters are informed about what these reduction laws really mean they may be able to advocate for themselves in a clearer manner.

 

[tacodude]

Oh no trust me I'm very aware from the involuntary manslaughter lawsuit that scared off the doctors from prescribing anything to Prince and his death bringing even more media attention to the situation. I'm just saying doctors are lying their assess off to cover themselves as they abandon many patients where the stigma prevents anyone from arguing that choice is neglectful to a patients needs as it's accepted that it's okay to cut anyone off cold turkey expecting it not to kill them when I'm sure you know that's only the case with proper medical care where in severe cases it can easily trigger underlying conditions, lead to dehydration, and many other issues. It's just wrong what's happening and it's only making things worse.

 

[DoctorMolecule]

The patient in this case would have to sue their doctor for malpractice, in essence; not providing adequate care by not providing the needed drugs.
Murky legal ground IMO, liability/tort law etc

 

[Gurlbytz]

Doctor lied about a slow titration and cut by more than 50%!!!

The patient in this case would have to sue their doctor for malpractice, in essence; not providing adequate care by not providing the needed drugs.
Murky legal ground IMO, liability/tort law etc

Yeah if only that were possible! These doctors deserve to be sued!

My partner has been seeing the same neurologist/pain management specialist for nearly 15 years. Never once had any problems, passed all urine tests, never ?lost? medicine etc. About 5 years ago she was switched from OxyContin to MS Contin. The morphine equivalent calculation led to a dosage of 640 mg morphine Er a day (320mg twice a day) She gets 120 100 mg and 120 60mg monthly. Then 120 10mg Norco for break-though pain. They took away her Norco in Oct and discussed titration of her meds in the new year as she had a prior-authorization thru end of Jan 2019. Of course doctor is doing the usual BS and using the new CDC guidelines as an excuse and lying to her.

Then in Nov he said he would start early with no more that a 10% reduction. The 120 100mg morphine Er would we changed to 90mg Er capsules. Of course the substitution was rejected by insurance and the doctors office was supposed to appeal. Of course they never did. So November she got her usual 120 100mg and 120 60mg. For her appt last week, it was a nurse?s appt and she?s a real anti-optiate Nazi b-word. She led her to believe that the 90mg capsules were approved and she left her appt confident that what would be awaiting her at the pharmacy was an escript for 120 90mg capsules and the usual 120 60mg Er tablets. Well no such thing!

I picked up her meds and thought there must?ve been some mistake. She got her 120 60mg and in place of her usual 120 100mg Er pills were NOT the 90 mg Er capsules but a new substitution of only qty 60 30mg morphine Er tablets??? I quickly did the math. Instead of a less than 10% reduction it?s over 50% with no warning nothing! Her doctor took away 120 100mg Er morphine and replaced it with 60 30mg er morphine?? So from 640mgs (320mg every 12 hours) she?s down to only 300mg (150mg every 12 hours) she phone the doctor?s office and he was ?unavailable? The nurse ratchet told her thats right basically that?s all you?re getting and was very insulting, short and rude! It was almost like she was pleased to be delivering tbe bad news!

When we got home and I explained the math and what the true dosage reduction percentage was she called once more. She treated her even worse. She told her to be quiet and that it was not a more than 50% reduction due to some ?morphine equivalencies chart? and she was wrong and the doctor was right and was like yes you?re going to have a horrible month haa haa and I?m sure you?re going to keep calling and bugging and begging me for medication! Just a total B- or rather C-word! She can say anything she wants but if you take 200mg of morphine off a daily dosage and replace it with 60mg of morphine there is no morphine equivalency to figure out! I can see if she was swapped to oxycodone or fentanyl or hydromorphine.

Her doctor has always been compassionate and understanding these last 15 years!. Nurses have come and gone but this new one seems to have it out for my wife! I don?t know what to do. I?ll have no choice but to ask a nephew to buy meds of the street to get her though the month. Then I have no clue what he might do to her next appt. At least the little p&ssy will have to face her and not hide behind his bulldog nurse! She?s treating my wife like an addict and I?m afraid I?ll want to slap the smile of her smug face. I?ve ordered a kilo of red Bali Kratom and am reading frantically everyday all that I can. I even bought some test strips on EBay just to make sure whatever illicit meds I buy aren?t going to be some counterfeit fentanyl-laced death pills! This stupid War on Opiates is hurting those that really need them and turning good caring doctors into cold unsympathetic cowards.

Of of course I can try and find a new doctor for her but amid this national witch-hunt, it?s better the devil you know. How are people coping? I?m terrified for her health and safety!

 

[kinkyjohn]

Oh no trust me I'm very aware from the involuntary manslaughter lawsuit that scared off the doctors from prescribing anything to Prince and his death bringing even more media attention to the situation. I'm just saying doctors are lying their assess off to cover themselves as they abandon many patients where the stigma prevents anyone from arguing that choice is neglectful to a patients needs as it's accepted that it's okay to cut anyone off cold turkey expecting it not to kill them when I'm sure you know that's only the case with proper medical care where in severe cases it can easily trigger underlying conditions, lead to dehydration, and many other issues. It's just wrong what's happening and it's only making things worse.

I remember about 10 years ago when I had a super high powered ridiculously well paid job I used to go to Harley Street (where Prince probably went) and buy dexamphetamine / meth (desoxyn) so I could get it through customs when I travelled (nothing makes a powerpoint nightmare work like meth). It cost a lot of money and I had to pretend I had narcolepsy but I bet you can still get whatever you want there if you've got the money. As far as I can tell .. high cost healthcare generally gives you whatever you want which is why people are on a lot of pain killers in the US and all the kids are munching amps. The odd doctor goes over the top and gets busted as with Prince / Michael Jackson but there's just too much money in it.

Wonder what happened to the OP .. sounded like a nasty reduction. The WDs from that would be crazy even without the pain .. hope they were ok. Some people really do need that level of pain control, especially in palliative care. Knocking yourself out is after all a legitimate use of the fentanyl lolly.

 

[LucidSDreamr]

Op: there are no laws limiting the amount a doctor can prescribe. While doctors are being prosecuted, there is no law specifying amounts that can be given to a patient

 

[Keif' Richards]

Can you ask your doctor for some comfort meds like pregabalin or benzos?

I agree with James Brown. Those were huge doses. If you really need that much pain medication, you should still be able to get an equianalgesic dose from a more potent opioid

Seconded.

 

[buttershots21]

I believe every word. As a chronic pain patient, the same thing happened to me and is happening to thousands of others. Suicide is skyrocketing in the CPP community because too many who need it and depend on it for any quality of life are being cut off. Now hospitals are doing major surgery like open heart, amputation, and severe burns, car accidents and other catastrophic events and not prescribing anything but ibuprofen. No more getting any pain meds for chronic conditions at a hospital, even if you are on pallative care. Please don't dismiss these stories. I was never an addict in the traditional sense, but when my doctor cut me off and I couldn't find another, I spent a couple years living the same life an addict lives in scoring off the streets, putting myself in financial difficulty, the search and chasing down whatever I could find consuming my every waking moment or being consumed by dope sickness when I couldn't find anything.
So now I've been at the closet methadone clinic for 2+ years now and I am so angry that I now have to lie and claim to be an IV using addict to receive the only thing that could help me live any kind of life. It's not the best route, I'm still misusing because now that I only go once a week, I split my doses up three times a day instead of taking it all at once, and I can't be honest with my counselor or anyone else there about my medical issues because if they hear the words chronic pain from me they will kick me out because they aren't a pain clinic!!!
The sad part is this ride started for me back in 2014-15 and I saw all of this coming for all of us. Unfortunately addicts dying didn't wake up the masses to common sense and realize that the war on drugs is a failure and ending prohibition would save the most lives. Instead they are doubling down on their policies and the result is that more people are dying than ever before, in record numbers. Not from prescription pills though and that's the only statistic they care about. Not the addicts dying from carafent laced H, not the CPP committing suicide,vor overdosing on purpose before they get cut off. Not the increase in hep c and HIV because you can't buy rigs anywhere in my town so everyone is sharing.
Sorry for the rant, but this is a very real problem. Check Google, Facebook groups, watch the news, it's coming to light that the CDC and deal have made a huge mistake. The pond is starting to ripple, we need to make it roar!!!

 

[LucidSDreamr]

AMEN to the above.

Please check out FOX news three part special on what is happening to chronic pain patients as a result of this fake epidemic that the CDC falsified with fake data.

Meanwhile CNN is reporting that opioids have no benefit for chronic pain and make it worse.

 

[kleinerkiffer]

Meanwhile CNN is reporting that opioids have no benefit for chronic pain and make it worse.

Afaik that's sadly the truth, it's called opioid-induced hyperalgesia

 

[Felonious Monk]

Now hospitals are doing major surgery like open heart, amputation, and severe burns, car accidents and other catastrophic events and not prescribing anything but ibuprofen.

No they're not.

Please check out FOX news three part special on what is happening to chronic pain patients as a result of this fake epidemic that the CDC falsified with fake data.

What fake epidemic? You mean blaming prescription drugs vs fentanyl? Cause a lot of people are dying, there is absolutely an epidemic.

And which data are you accusing the CDC of falsifying? Do you have any sources for that?

 

[Ganjcat]

I thretaned suicide when my doctor thretained to cut me I actually started crying and looking like I was going unstable it wasn't really an act but it worked different countries different laws but same bulshit

 

[Archeun1981]

That's a reduction of the amount the country can import from manufactures or manufacture themselves... That has nothing to do with regulations regarding what a doctor is aloud to do as far as prescriptions.

The reduction I believe was 10% from the DEA. 10% is nothing against the billions of pills created each year. They aren't going to hurt the manufacturers and pharmaceutical companies. While the company that makes Oxycontin may end up getting hit hard; the rest will hide behind other things.

 

[fairnymph]

Afaik that's sadly the truth, it's called opioid-induced hyperalgesia

I developed hyperalgesia (only in response to morphine so far), despite only taking it every 3rd day for 6 months, 60mg max daily. I actually suspect taking it that way may have induced it. I took high dose hydrocodone for 1-3 days a month for over 10yrs (severe menstrual cramps) & never had issues. Took hydromorphone daily for several years & heroin daily for 10yrs, never any problems, except when the latter turned to morphine due to being in solution (nasal use).

As for CPPs...I second the AMEN. In the US it was a huge problem getting even my most needed med, diazepam for muscle tension & spasms, let alone strong opiates. I was treated like a junkie bc I'm naturally thin. And being young was the worst. I get much better care here in Germany, but the available meds are fewer which is unfortunate. I feel for you Americans! I can believe the OP...I fall asleep before I can even reduce my pain by 50%, though. But oxy is more stimulating.