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Health ADHD & ASD - Testing Psychedelics to replace conventional medication [includes also meditation & internal arts]

I'm on Strattera, it doesn't work for everyone but if it does it's a huge step and way nicer to be on daily than amphetamine/methylphenidate.

I follow this thread with interest, do share future findings as well. I've only recently discovered that I actually have ADHD-C, I never connected the dots before. Microdosing was never an option for me as it tended to induce (hypo)mania.
 
do some research on myself
^ this also.

It really is about this, finding what you need to grow, gain knowledge, insight, and understanding about you.

I approach it with a scientific methodology with respects to compounds, however when you look at concepts like special and general relativity, quantum mechanics, particle physics, ancient chinese philosophies of Confucianism and Taoism, the use of these compounds are just tools to unlock our life long conditioning to process reality and 'me' with certain frameworks.
 
@emkee_reinvented
If meditation is not allowing you to relax and fall asleep you are not doing it effectively.
whether seated or lying down
whether eyes open or closed
whether tantric, zen, or vipassana
you need to establish calm and stop being restless and do your thing, usually awareness with regular breathing.
if you are not calm and if you become restless, drop whatever protocol you have in mind and get this part right.
relax, keep it simple and regular.

appreciation for phenethylamines is great, dependency not so much
 
@emkee_reinvented
If meditation is not allowing you to relax and fall asleep you are not doing it effectively.
whether seated or lying down
whether eyes open or closed
whether tantric, zen, or vipassana
you need to establish calm and stop being restless and do your thing, usually awareness with regular breathing.
if you are not calm and if you become restless, drop whatever protocol you have in mind and get this part right.
relax, keep it simple and regular.

appreciation for phenethylamines is great, dependency not so much
The meditation I used was from Bhuddism. A mantra aimed at compassion.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Om_mani_padme_hum

'Om Mani Padme Hum (eh Ghi)'

The meaning is a bit unclear:
the original meaning of the mantra could in fact be an invocation of "she of the lotus jewel".
So it could invoke a female deity, nice as i like girl's. A lot.

eyes half open aimed at the point in the middle without looking cross-eyed. Breathing through the nose with the mouth slightly openend. No thoughts that stay.

Sometime a chain with beed's is used. But i did do the mediation while being over the top stressed out. What could have caused the sleepless effect's
 
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What could have caused the sleepless effect's

I was having issues with unbalanced energy, as I had not yet discovered a certain breathing technique

I'm not entirely sure which traditions my practices have evolved from exactly, I was taught by my Shifu, or I should say pointed toward a direction to find my own path.

It's only discovery that I look to find what it maybe or what description is given by other cultures or practices.

The breathing techniques I've discovered, I've found reference to them in Taoist practice, which has helped me grow in these practices and also reduce the internal energy imbalance and reduce my overly energetic biomechanics before sleep.
  • Reverse breathing
  • Circular breathing

It may or may not help, descriptions no doubt can be found in other cultures or practices, it may be knowledge you have and sleeplessness is caused by something else.

There are other techniques, that I use for other situations or that I think are understood more when reading Taoist description by having knowledge of shaolin martial arts / Qi Gong / Taijiquan etc, obviously due to the cross overs and evolution of these arts.

  • Qi breathing
  • Spinal breathing
As well as knowledge seen through a lens or framework taught through these practices / philosophies.
  • Yin Yang
  • Fire & water
  • Jing & Shen
I particularly found the knowledge of fire of the chest and water of the abdomen helpful alongside the breathing techniques, however I think this maybe unhelpful unless one has knowledge through this particular culture or area of practice.
 
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I'm on Strattera, it doesn't work for everyone but if it does it's a huge step and way nicer to be on daily than amphetamine/methylphenidate.

I follow this thread with interest, do share future findings as well. I've only recently discovered that I actually have ADHD-C, I never connected the dots before. Microdosing was never an option for me as it tended to induce (hypo)mania.

I will certainly look into Strattera, thank you!
 
I was having issues with unbalanced energy, as I had not yet discovered a certain breathing technique

I'm not entirely sure which traditions my practices have evolved from exactly, I was taught by my Shifu, or I should say pointed toward a direction to find my own path.

It's only discovery that I look to find what it maybe or what description is given by other cultures or practices.

The breathing techniques I've discovered, I've found reference to them in Taoist practice, which has helped me grow in these practices and also reduce the internal energy imbalance and reduce my overly energetic biomechanics before sleep.
  • Reverse breathing
  • Circular breathing

It may or may not help, descriptions no doubt can be found in other cultures or practices, it may be knowledge you have and sleeplessness is caused by something else.

There are other techniques, that I use for other situations or that I think are understood more when reading Taoist description by having knowledge of shaolin martial arts / Qi Gong / Taijiquan etc, obviously due to the cross overs and evolution of these arts.

  • Qi breathing
  • Spinal breathing
As well as knowledge seen through a lens or framework taught through these practices / philosophies.
  • Yin Yang
  • Fire & water
  • Jing & Shen
I particularly found the knowledge of fire of the chest and water of the abdomen helpful alongside the breathing techniques, however I think this maybe unhelpful unless one has knowledge through this particular culture or area of practice.
Shifu, please explain no clue what a shifu is.

Circular breathing I am practiced in, playing Didgeridoo involves that.

But
-Reverse breathing
-Qi breathing
-Spinal breathing

No clue what that involves? Please eleborate d4nk0st0rm.
 
I will certainly look into Strattera, thank you!
I love Strattera, it's almost fully transparent, works 24/7 and you're never dealing with comedowns.
It kills much of my hyperactivity and I can do things that I pretty much couldn't do before. It's given a major boost in executive functioning, less impulsive, able to organize better and just do things right NOW without getting overwhelmed. I first noticed it started working when I could cook with like 3 pans, that would've been impossible before lol, also the amount of daily steps has drastically decreased which is a good thing as I would run around like a maniac all day. It's not a complete "cure" but stimulants aren't either, I get Ritalin prescribed as well which I can take on top if I need it.

It took about 5 weeks for it to really take effect and I recently switched to a lower dosage (1x60mg) because of excessive stuttering (I was born with it but Strattera made it much worse). Many people experience unwelcome side effects like nausea in the beginning but I'd try it for at least a month before deciding against it.

It's a fantastic medication tbh, you'll probably find many negative reviews on it but I think that's because of wrong expectations and because it's so subtle and takes a while to get going.
 
Shifu, please explain no clue what a shifu is.

In this context it means teacher, tutor, master. I believe direct translation is teacher or father.

My Shifu is the person that teaches me / guides me through my Shaolin Martial Arts practice.

But
-Reverse breathing
-Qi breathing
-Spinal breathing

My words will not go far to explain, and as most energy based arts, discovery is the only way to truely understand. In fact my Shifu suggested when I started not to read about anything online or to watch other instructors videos as he understood that in doing so I may have built expectations and directed toward my interperation rather than his guidence for me to discover for myself.

My descriptions will be mechanical in nature, there are deeper and more detailed ways that people with far more experience and mastery of this area could explain.

First, the meaning of Qi. This has multiple meanings in its interperation, I will simplistically describe it as 'life energy', which all is made, it also means breath, being that in language terms, we breath inwards for life, so we pull in Qi, the energy of life through breath (which is one aspect).

I mentioned Jing & Shen, which are different forms of Qi, the Ying Yang being the balance of forms of Qi. Again, I know this is described from a point of minimal knowledge, and I am sure there are much more concise descriptions from those that know more than I.

In my scientific mind, the concept of Qi from the early Taoism interperations reconciles inside my mind with my small understanding of physics (I studied at BSc level).
  • Reverse breathing
    • In general, people breath with an inhale expanding the chest, an exhale deflating the chest
    • In my learning, the dantien, more specifically the lower dantien can be very loosely described as the Qi center
    • Breathing into and out of the lower dantien, or I think its called diaphragmatic breathing, is something to learn, most people do not breath this way
    • In reverse breathing, rather than the breath inward raising the lower abdomen, the lower abdomen falls / deflates, and the outward breath raises out the abdomen.
  • Qi Breathing
    • Loosely described, a part of Qi Gong is learning to bring in Qi into all parts of the body, because all is Qi, and we are Qi, then we can pull in Qi.
    • Again loosely, in breathing we draw in air that we convert to internal Qi
    • Qi breathing I guess you could describe as more a state.
    • The breath is so light and unnoticable, there is no consious recognition that you are breathing in and out
    • However you are aware that the body is expanding and contracting as it pulls in and pushes out 'breath' or Qi
  • Spinal breathing
    • Again, this may be described in part as a state of awareness and consiousness.
    • With the 'diaphragmatic breathing', rather than awareness of the breath inwards and outwards and the abdomen and chest expanding / contracting, the focus / awareness is on your spine.
    • You draw in breath / Qi into the spine, you can draw upwards towards your head, and also propagate it outwards from the spinal cord.
I hope this helps and makes some sense, I am trying to describe assuming no prior knowledge.

edit: spelling
edit to add:


There was a passage I read in an ancient chinese text (translated) that said "after enlightenment, one understands that the 'six classics' contain not even a word". The six classics being the writing of 6 Taoist masters, for me this describes how in this area of concepts, understanding can not be gained from reading the words, we already have the knowledge, and I use what tools I can to discover and explore these concepts.

edit: formatting
 
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I find it quite interesting how a thread on 'ADHD & ASD - Testing Psychedelics to replace conventional medication' has moved and covered areas of (IMHO valuable) concepts that are less related to the medication and using of compounds.

Just wanted to note. I have also updated the thread title to take this into account.
 
@d4nk0st0rm

from wikepedia:
Anapanasati is described in detail in the Anapanasati Sutta:


Breathing in long, he discerns, 'I am breathing in long'; or breathing out long, he discerns, 'I am breathing out long.' Or breathing in short, he discerns, 'I am breathing in short'; or breathing out short, he discerns, 'I am breathing out short.' He trains himself, 'I will breathe in sensitive to the entire body.' He trains himself, 'I will breathe out sensitive to the entire body.' He trains himself, 'I will breathe in calming bodily fabrication.' He trains himself, 'I will breathe out calming bodily fabrication.'[8]

I have described it several times on the shroomery using simple terms:

Essentially, for a period of time (20 - 40 minutes - I set a timer for 43 mins so I have time to adjust my position) one relaxes and becomes the focus of attention in front of the nose and yokes the mind to the changing stages of breathing in and out, (beginning middle end). As attention wanders it is gently
returned, whatever mental contents arise are observed without becoming a side trip, and if it does become a trip, one recovers by beginning again until the time is up.



these days I have been setting a timer for 43 minutes and sitting half lotus - it is most stable, but it took a fe2w weeks until my hips stopped complaining - however it was not much easier at 16 years of age either.

this practice does not prevent sleep

here is an interesting twist I should have added above:
 
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In this context it means teacher, tutor, master. I believe direct translation is teacher or father.

My Shifu is the person that teaches me / guides me through my Shaolin Martial Arts practice.



My words will not go far to explain, and as most energy based arts, discovery is the only way to truely understand. In fact my Shifu suggested when I started not to read about anything online or to watch other instructors videos as he understood that in doing so I may have built expectations and directed toward my interperation rather than his guidence for me to discover for myself.

My descriptions will be mechanical in nature, there are deeper and more detailed ways that people with far more experience and mastery of this area could explain.

First, the meaning of Qi. This has multiple meanings in its interperation, I will simplistically describe it as 'life energy', which all is made, it also means breath, being that in language terms, we breath inwards for life, so we pull in Qi, the energy of life through breath (which is one aspect).

I mentioned Jing & Shen, which are different forms of Qi, the Ying Yang being the balance of forms of Qi. Again, I know this is described from a point of minimal knowledge, and I am sure there are much more concise descriptions from those that know more than I.

In my scientific mind, the concept of Qi from the early Taoism interperations reconciles inside my mind with my small understanding of physics (I studied at BSc level).
  • Reverse breathing
    • In general, people breath with an inhale expanding the chest, an exhale deflating the chest
    • In my learning, the dantien, more specifically the lower dantien can be very loosely described as the Qi center
    • Breathing into and out of the lower dantien, or I think its called diaphragmatic breathing, is something to learn, most people do not breath this way
    • In reverse breathing, rather than the breath inward raising the lower abdomen, the lower abdomen falls / deflates, and the outward breath raises out the abdomen.
  • Qi Breathing
    • Loosely described, a part of Qi Gong is learning to bring in Qi into all parts of the body, because all is Qi, and we are Qi, then we can pull in Qi.
    • Again loosely, in breathing we draw in air that we convert to internal Qi
    • Qi breathing I guess you could describe as more a state.
    • The breath is so light and unnoticable, there is no consious recognition that you are breathing in and out
    • However you are aware that the body is expanding and contracting as it pulls in and pushes out 'breath' or Qi
  • Spinal breathing
    • Again, this may be described in part as a state of awareness and consiousness.
    • With the 'diaphragmatic breathing', rather than awareness of the breath inwards and outwards and the abdomen and chest expanding / contracting, the focus / awareness is on your spine.
    • You draw in breath / Qi into the spine, you can draw upwards towards your head, and also propagate it outwards from the spinal cord.
I hope this helps and makes some sense, I am trying to describe assuming no prior knowledge.

edit: spelling
edit to add:


There was a passage I read in an ancient chinese text (translated) that said "after enlightenment, one understands that the 'six classics' contain not even a word". The six classics being the writing of 6 Taoist masters, for me this describes how in this area of concepts, understanding can not be gained from reading the words, we already have the knowledge, and I use what tools I can to discover and explore these concepts.

edit: formatting
Thanks very clear description.

Chest breathing as i understand is actually wrong breathing. The abdominal is where it starts and ends.

Circular breathing and meditation quickly make that obvious. that conclusion came quick after practicing these.

Martial art's offer a lot of things modern science and Fysiotherapie only touch on the surface.
 
@emkee_reinvented

martial arts are about mind body refinement for combat or sparring, or ninja duty.

it does not easily separate from that origin of fighting.

Zazen is better learned without that fighting edge. The world we want to be more at home in is our selves, and being able to sleep at night, not to keep fighting, or dream about fighting. I had some karate training, it made my resistance strong.

Islam also has a fighting edge referred to as Jihad, meant to be directed at the parts of the self you wish to terminate, but distorted into what we see with Iran and the taliban.

I think it is important to keep psychedelic thinking separate from fighting. Better to orient towards peace, and beauty.
 
In this context it means teacher, tutor, master. I believe direct translation is teacher or father.

My Shifu is the person that teaches me / guides me through my Shaolin Martial Arts practice.



My words will not go far to explain, and as most energy based arts, discovery is the only way to truely understand. In fact my Shifu suggested when I started not to read about anything online or to watch other instructors videos as he understood that in doing so I may have built expectations and directed toward my interperation rather than his guidence for me to discover for myself.

My descriptions will be mechanical in nature, there are deeper and more detailed ways that people with far more experience and mastery of this area could explain.

First, the meaning of Qi. This has multiple meanings in its interperation, I will simplistically describe it as 'life energy', which all is made, it also means breath, being that in language terms, we breath inwards for life, so we pull in Qi, the energy of life through breath (which is one aspect).

I mentioned Jing & Shen, which are different forms of Qi, the Ying Yang being the balance of forms of Qi. Again, I know this is described from a point of minimal knowledge, and I am sure there are much more concise descriptions from those that know more than I.

In my scientific mind, the concept of Qi from the early Taoism interperations reconciles inside my mind with my small understanding of physics (I studied at BSc level).
  • Reverse breathing
    • In general, people breath with an inhale expanding the chest, an exhale deflating the chest
    • In my learning, the dantien, more specifically the lower dantien can be very loosely described as the Qi center
    • Breathing into and out of the lower dantien, or I think its called diaphragmatic breathing, is something to learn, most people do not breath this way
    • In reverse breathing, rather than the breath inward raising the lower abdomen, the lower abdomen falls / deflates, and the outward breath raises out the abdomen.
  • Qi Breathing
    • Loosely described, a part of Qi Gong is learning to bring in Qi into all parts of the body, because all is Qi, and we are Qi, then we can pull in Qi.
    • Again loosely, in breathing we draw in air that we convert to internal Qi
    • Qi breathing I guess you could describe as more a state.
    • The breath is so light and unnoticable, there is no consious recognition that you are breathing in and out
    • However you are aware that the body is expanding and contracting as it pulls in and pushes out 'breath' or Qi
  • Spinal breathing
    • Again, this may be described in part as a state of awareness and consiousness.
    • With the 'diaphragmatic breathing', rather than awareness of the breath inwards and outwards and the abdomen and chest expanding / contracting, the focus / awareness is on your spine.
    • You draw in breath / Qi into the spine, you can draw upwards towards your head, and also propagate it outwards from the spinal cord.
I hope this helps and makes some sense, I am trying to describe assuming no prior knowledge.

edit: spelling
edit to add:


There was a passage I read in an ancient chinese text (translated) that said "after enlightenment, one understands that the 'six classics' contain not even a word". The six classics being the writing of 6 Taoist masters, for me this describes how in this area of concepts, understanding can not be gained from reading the words, we already have the knowledge, and I use what tools I can to discover and explore these concepts.

edit: formatting
For all you guys interested in different types of meditation and Yoga, I've gotten into the Wim Hof method.

Wim Hof is a dutch extreme athlete who has been able break records like climb part of the way up mount Everast in nothing but shorts and sandels, longest barefoot marathon through snow, longest time spent in ice, longest time spent under ice water, longest marathon through the sahara desert without water, and has actively resisted ecoli and other bacteria injected into his blood stream using breathing techniques. Normally that bacteria would cause severe illness for 6 hours which would then pass without long term effects, but not only did he resist it, but he was able to train 12 test subjects to do the same.

He's also an expert in Yoga.

I'm almost done completing his 10 week fundamentals course the 2nd time around and it's great.

The 3 main pillars are: 1) breathing exercises 2) cold exposure like cold showers and ice baths 3) intention (basically, auto-hypnosis and harnessing the placebo effect and directing your practice towards various goals.

This stuff has all kinds of benefits and helps with: depression, anxiety, energy, inflammation, endurance, creativity, etc.

It also includes yoga, body weight exercises and other types of exercises, etc.

The breathing can really take you to intense places through accessing your own DMT as well as melatonin, norepinephrine, dopamine, serotonin and adrenalin, though I'm not USUALLY able to get psychedelic experiences out of it, Ive gotten a few that were AMAZINGLY peaceful, but others have gotten full blow visuals, although it really isn't about that. I am frequently able to get to a place of peace.

Basically, what you do is at least 3 rounds of at least 30 breaths, but you breath out a lot more than you breath in to fully saturate your blood with oxygen but not breath much of it out: essentially controlled hyperventilation.

Then, after the last breath (usually after the out-breath rather than the in breath) you hold you breath for as long as you can, and then when you have to breath you breath out...then immediately hold you breath again for another 10-15 seconds, and then that round is over.

While holding your breath is when a lot the amazingly peaceful sensations happen, but also after the blood rushes back to your brain after your 2nd breath in.

This also serves the purpose of making your body alkaline and warming it up for the cold shower or ice bath, and you are supposed to do those daily.

I've been doing it a year now and only recently started ice baths, with my coldest and longest one being 36 degrees of 2:45.

You have to be very careful not to get hypothermia or frostbite, and I would NOT do this stuff on drugs....but what most people don't realize is that tolerance to the cold REALLY DOES exist. People who have done this for years often no longer need anything more than a t shirt and shorts even in the coldest weather, and have INCREDIBLE control over their immune systems and their minds.

I would highly recommend it, though I'm still just a beginner.

I'm also very into martial arts as people mentioned, mainly Brazilian Jiu-Jitsu, but there isn't always any clear connection between martial arts and meditation, though eastern disciplines often make one. I like to have a connection there for myself, and many BJJ guys do the WH method, but fighting and meditative techniques are not always inter-related, though I think more martial artists could benefit from meditative practice for sure.
 
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