4-HO-MIPT, phenibut, kratom - Experienced - I chaired an AA meeting while tripping.



Hello friends, I had an interesting experience the other day. This is my first trip report. I ingested my maintenance dosage of 10 g kratom, 5 g phenibut, and also 17 mg of miprocin and went to AA. I had no intention of chairing this meeting as I never have before.

I go to AA because I'm an alcoholic, of course, and I benefit from the free therapy and fellowship with other people trying to improve their lives. I have been taking psychedelics again, I hadn't taken many in recent years, to get to the root of my alcoholism. It was destroying my life and I want to be done with it. I quit hard drugs on my own in recent years but alcohol has been a different beast. It's a much more pervasive addiction in my opinion because of legality and social acceptance. Not many people will ask you if you wanna smoke a few rocks or get your nod on after a hard day at work to socialize, but many people will ask if you want to get a drink afterwards.

My use of psychedelics has helped me to abstain from alcohol and has curbed the constant thirst for it. I had been struggling very badly with it before the last few years. I am the kind of person who has been fired by religious librarians from a temp job at the American Theological Society in Chicago for drinking most of a handle of cheap vodka and passing out at the desk I attended. I was unresponsive and I was carried out by EMS on a stretcher. I once drank a bunch of Everclear and was taken to the hospital for alcohol poisoning with a .39 BAC, afterwards accepted into the psych ward. Not proud of this, I just want to give some background information.

I have been mostly abstinent from alcohol lately and I have been looking for a trancendental experience and I got one for ya.

Substances ingested: Approx. 30 grams of kratom total, 5 grams phenibut, and 17 mg 4-HO-MIPT.

I decided to dose 17 mg miprocin and go to AA riding my bicycle. The day after would be Bicycle Day, but I didn't remember that until today. I thought if I felt uncomfortable that I could leave. Not this time. I showed up to a small meeting and the chairperson was clearly not going to arrive. We needed someone to chair the meeting. Someone who has 10 years sobriety suggested that I chair the meeting. He volun-told me to do it and sat the chairperson's folder in front of me. I've never chaired a meeting as I still take psychedelics and kratom. They would disagree with my methods, but as a former hard opiate addict, alcoholic, benzo-head, recovered tweaker/crackhead, DXM addict....I figure that the maintenance drugs of phenibut and kratom are the lesser of the evils.

Kratom and phenibut have helped me lead a normal life where I'm not crushed by anxiety. I've been able to make and keep friends, hold a job, be a caring and compassionate person, and a hell of a hard worker with the aid of these drugs and psychedelics. I don't care if it's not classic "sobriety"...I refuse to be suicidally depressed, which was exacerbated by alcohol. I will recover by any means necessary.

So, the miprocin was taken 15 minutes before the meeting and by the time we finished the preamble I was already "up" but not feeling the peak effects by any means. I suggested a topic as no one else had any suggestions. These are lost people and many of them are in early sobriety and feel empty inside. It was such a golden opportunity/teaching experience to lead them and tell what I had learned in my journey and how events that we think have ruined our lives have in actuality presented us with the opportunity of starting anew. They were all literally looking at me directly as they shared/confessed their experiences. It was catharsis for me and for them as well, I think. Like a snake that is shedding it's skin, we're irate and milky eyed and don't want to be touched...you'd be in danger to do so actually. Afterwards we can be "happy snakes" when the painful shedding process is over. The phoenix from the ashes thing.

They were looking to me for some hope and recovery and I provided my experience, strength, and hope to the best of my abilities. I am not allowed to recommend my personal way of coming into faith and healing because of stigma which is unfortunate. However, it's important to remember that the founder of AA, Bill W. whom they venerate almost as a deity, took LSD multiple times, advocated it as a cure for addiction, and actually came to his hot flash spiritual awakening under the influence of belladonna! It's all true and verifiable. He was heavily criticized for his advocacy of psychedelics by the very group that he created.

I am in a process of cultivating my spirituality again. The field has lain fallow for many years. It was not all a waste for it has brought me to the place I am in now. I am planning on using my knowledge of addiction and recovery to help others. I didn't see myself finding my life's purpose by becoming a crackhead and cough syrup junkie, among other addictions, and it's a complete surprise but it makes total sense to me now.

So...the miprocin opened me up to a spiritual experience I would not have felt so deeply otherwise. I want to help others recover from addiction. Of course there are some pretty colors, but the inspiration is what I feel to be noteworthy about this compound combined with a good mindset/set/setting. Afterwards I listened to music, called my father, grandmother, cousin, and apologized to a co-worker for treating him badly.

I've never experienced anything quite like this. Nothing that helps people re-discover their true potential and reconnect with family/humanity should ever be illegal but I'm sure someday it will be. I'm so grateful for this experience. Thanks for reading.


Oct 7, 2005
If you use cannabis and other psychedelic drugs, or even Kratom, phenibut, etc. you are not sober or clean, and should not be a leader/chairperson of AA or NA, or speaking about sobriety at AA/NA meetings.

The purpose of sobriety groups both 12 step and non-12 step, is to provide support for people who are sober/clean and living life without the use of of drugs and alcohol, and if you use drugs like cannabis, other psychedelic drugs, Kratom, etc. then you're just being a hypocrite.

I'm not involved in AA/NA and have never been to meetings but Bill W. is not seen by people in AA/NA as some sort of deity as you claim he is.
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Jul 26, 2009
I completely support you. you didn't WANT to chair, the guy made you. I took a very similar path to you and ended up in some situations that were reminiscent, including "chairing" our youth outpatient rehab meetings on LSD, and doing a wonderful job I might add. Everyone gets there differently, as long as you aren't in group advocating others break sobriety or disrupting the meeting, I think it's ok. IME and this varies from person to person - there's a LOT of deception that goes on in AA/NA and a LOT of people that use it in the same manner - free advice, fellowship and therapy. just my .02, obviously they wouldnt be happy if they knew


Nov 15, 2012
i can tell you your phenibut dose of 5 g's is dangerous. 1 gram is plenty and phenibut has a high tolerance and needs be used sparingly


Sep 12, 2014
This is brilliant. You would have to give me drugs to get me to go to one of those things.

Keif' Richards

Moderator: BDD, OD
Staff member
Aug 4, 2010
Lowell, Massachusetts
I think the moment you say something has positively no benefit, you're depriving yourself. There's a healthy place along a spectrum between worshipping the founders of 12 Step Meetings and holding them as completely useless. If nothing else, 12 Step Meetings are an hour of therapy for a dollar - or not.

I've used meetings to put my life back together several times, but have always returned to Opiates. If you focus on living a 24-hour-at-a-time program, none of this really matters in the long-term. I chaired a couple of meetings while under the influence back in the day and I have spent a lot of time pondering the cosmic ramifications of my behavior. Some people are never going to be as happy as they would be sober and I often wonder what part I've played in actively derailing people from their chance at "contentment". The truth is, I probably have made little difference in the outcomes of these people's lives, but I always worry that I might have.


"City Watcher" & Sr. Mod: PD, TR, TDS, P&S
Staff member
Feb 8, 2006
Shadowmeister v0
I will say this: kratom is an opioid; not in structure, but in the fact that it hits the mu opiate receptor which is what the big opiates do. I mean yes, it's a better alternative to real opiates, but let me tell you, it's addictive and can grind you down in the same way. I was addicted to opiates for 10 years, and the first 7 were just kratom. It got to where I had to take a dose every 6 hours or I would go into withdrawal. The withdrawal didn't make me feel like I had the flu unlike other opiates, but the restlessness is WORSE by far, and for me the restless legs are the worst part because it makes me unable to sleep. The restlessness from kratom is a hundred times worse, it feels like my entire BODY has the restless legs, I would thrash around my arms and legs and torso in bed, crying from frustration... punch myself repeatedly as hard as I could in the legs because it would make my legs feel calm for like 30 seconds. I told myself every day I would stop after that day, but I broke my promise every day. It ground down my self-esteem, ruined my finances, destroyed a relationship, and brought me so low. Just saying it can get there, so please don't consider it harmless. If I were you I'd stop using kratom. I went on to become addicted over the following 3 years after I quit kratom, to oxy, morphine, and heroin at various times 9I switched between them), and in some ways the kratom withdrawal was worse than the withdrawal from the others, and it had just as strong a hold on me.

Phenibut is also addictive, albeit less severely so in my opinion (at least for me). But it's serving as a replacement for alcohol for you. I would say it's fine to use as a crutch for the time being if it helps you stay away from alcohol (but please try to stick to every other day at maximum, for me the physical dependence develops very slowly, if at all, at this level, but daily use will result in a pretty strong physical dependence after a while).

As for psychedelics, I advocate their use as long as it doesn't become abuse. I've abused psychedelics and I've used them properly, at various times in my life. They certainly can help facilitate meaningful experience and clarity, but they can also be used for the same reasons one might use other drugs inappropriately/addictively.

As for chairing the AA meeting or participating in an AA meeting while doing drugs, I'm certainly not going to pass judgment on you for that. I don't believe abstinence from all drugs is necessary for everyone, though it seems to be for some. Anyway plenty of AA people use drugs daily (nicotine/caffeine). If you can get some benefit from AA and still use other drugs, good for you.

Just be really careful with drugs, man. If you decide to keep using drugs after a destructive addiction, you really need to be cautious and maintain a high level of objective oversight over yourself. It's all too easy to slip back into a destructive pattern of abuse with another drug, you already know your personality has a tendency to go there, so it's playing with fire. I still use other drugs after getting free of opiates (it's been over 2 years now), and I sometimes have to realize I need to moderate myself as I notice I am slipping into using them too much. I feel confident it works for me because the drugs I choose to use add positive things to my life, but I have that part of me that is like, "hey, this was great, more is better!", and I have to recognize and overcome that part sometimes.

Good luck man. <3