Ok guys and gals... here we go!
This is the thread for conversation about 12 step based programs, and some examples of these are Alcoholics Anonymous and Narcotics Anonymous. In this thread you can voice your opinion on these programs whether its positive or negative, but lets keep it respectful and civilized. Many of us have strong beliefs on these programs, and thats fine. However, TDS is a place of respect and support, so lets keep this productive.
Most people in recovery have been exposed to the 12-step approach to recovery through Alcoholics Anonymous or Narcotics Anonymous, and most have very definite opinions about it, based on their personal experiences. This thread has been created to allow for the passionate opinions both pro and con and everything in between. The point of this thread is not to convince anyone of a particular point of view. Ideally, this thread will create a place to participate in an intelligent, civil and nuanced discussion that allows people to grow their understanding of someone's experience that is different from their own. At its basest level it may serve a similar purpose to the Vent/Rant thread. Either way, it is the thread to come to if you want to assert your own point of view about the 12-steps. It is important to note that many people see the benefits of a 12-step approach to be a literal life-saver. Others feel it actually deepens their addiction. Those are highly personal experiences and it is good to remember that people are literally fighting for their lives. So, without name-calling or shaming, but with mutual respect, everyone who feels so inclined now has a thread to debate in. If a general argument about AA/NA surfaces in another person's personal thread, it will be moderated and the poster will be directed to this thread. So play fair and have at it!
The direction where we are talking TDS is a very positive one, and the idea of this thread is to stop the derailment of other threads when the OP had a specific idea for their thread. Myself and the other mods in TDS are aiming for most of the opinion related conversation based on 12 step programs to be in this thread. So I will give a heads up to the community in TDS, and let you guys know we will use our best judgment in other threads when this type of conversation gets started. This could mean merging the posts to this thread, editing or other means of containment. That being said, we all appreciate and respect your individual opinions, so thats why this thread now exists!
*When sharing personal experiences, opinions or anecdotal information regarding treatments it is important that readers understand that what you are saying is your own valid perspective but not necessarily objective fact.
*rude or abusive posts will not be tolerated. Treatment and programs are very controversial. It is a complex subject that we all feel very passionate about for extremely personal reasons. Always keep in mind that the goal of discussion and debate is to expand knowledge, not to contract it.
Lets start the discussion...
NSA EDIT: This turned out to be kinda a messy merge so I had to repost skags intro. So anyway the debate rages on. We as addicts tend to have kinda black and white thinking so I would keep this in mind when this debate rolls on. Personally I use some things from the fellowships and a whole bunch of things from other sources. I really am totally over this is the only way, but just because I'm over that doesn't mean I'm going to prohib myself from using things from the fellowship I have found good and combine them with all the other stuff I do. Just something to think about.
Thinking about quitting AA and unsubscribing from their views.
Well the title says it all. Here is a little about me, I'm 27, and have been an addict my entire life. For the last 6 months I have been bone-dry from alcohol, mostly do to my circumstances. I progressed from weed at 16 to shrooms, to trying the harder stuff, and eventually got a love-affair with opiates. For these last 6-months I have gone to AA and admitted that I was an alcoholic. Now I drank heavily and would drink alcoholically for many years. But I was never a real alcoholic. How do I know that? Because I was the same way with pot, cigarettes, coke, anything. If I had a pack of cigarette's I would smoke every last one of those suckers even though I didn't want to.
So I'm an addict. I know that. And the last six months I've grown to become a really mature adult and I'm soon to finish my bachelors degree and relocate. The thing is, I am thirsty. I'm tired of everyone knowing about my addiction problems and being defined by them. I'm tired of AA, the steps, Bill wilson, etc. When I relocate I'm considering not going to AA at all because I don't want to have that reputation and stigma and honestly I just don't want my whole life to be about recovery and the 10 years of abuse. But thats what young people do anyways, I just let opiates ruin my life a couple of times. I have never relapsed because of alcohol, it's always drugs, esp. benzos.
So I guess my question is, have any of you been able to drink wine or beer and smoke pot occasionally without it ruining your life and leading you back to hard drugs and that cycle of misery. I want to be able to enjoy a bottle of wine at home watching a movie alone. I want to be able to drink beer on the golf course, enjoying the hot sun. I don't want AA and sober people to be everything my life is about. I'm very religious and rely on God to keep me sober, but I know that drinking again is taking a risk. I'm just over this negatively extreme way of thinking that I have a fucking disease and that I'll never be able to enjoy drinking again. I so so wish I were Italian or French and able to drink wine throughout the day and it's totally normal. I get a lot of enjoyment out of drinking and it's always the hard stuff and drugs that ruin it. I'm afraid that if I start drinking again I will eventually want to do my drug of choice, opiates.
If I could just drink wine/beer in the evenings and still have my career and be independent from AA that would be all I could ask for in life. I can't do that right now because my parents will kick me out of the house and I won't finish college. But once I get some independence and am able to live life my way, I think I'm going to incorporate wine/beer back into the picture and just make ground rules that I have to stick to. No more buying cheap 40oz. no more early drinking, etc. Just cut out all the alcoholic behavior and drink responsibly like an adult. I need success stories from you BL'ers.
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