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‘Very promising’: UK’s first full heroin-prescribing scheme extended after reductions in crime and homelessness

RedRum OG

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Heroin is a name for correct, me if I'm wrong Diacetyl-Morphine meaning Heroin is literally simply morphine that penetrates the blood-brain barrier causing a quicker and stronger effect especially when it comes to the I.V. rush for Heroin compared to Morphine otherwise they r basically the same drug nearly at least with some subtle differences.

This is objectively true, but must heroin addicts would find it highly offensive, as do I ;)

Morphine tends to give me a histamine reaction. Hard to enjoy the rush when I'm trying to itch my scalp off.

Snorting heroin and shooting it are exactly the same drug, and they are still worlds apart in terms of pleasure. The speed in which it overwhelms your brain makes it or breaks it. For me, IV, morphine 6/10, heroin 9/10, hydromorphone 10/10.

Speaking of hydromorphone, I could make the hyperbolic comparison of hydrocodone = hydromorphone in your brain, thus vicodin and diluadid are equal, but they are opposite ends of the spectrum.
 
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CfZrx

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Moving toward the light/crawling out of a needle
Heroin is literally simply morphine that penetrates the blood-brain barrier causing a quicker and stronger effect
I know what you are referring to, it should simply be this way, but for me, heroin was psychedelic! A completely different drug, at least for me.

This is objectively true, but must heroin addicts would find it highly offensive, as do I ;)

Morphine tends to give me a histamine reaction. Hard to enjoy the rush when I'm trying to itch my scalp off.

Snorting heroin and shooting it are exactly the same drug, and they are still worlds apart in terms of pleasure. The speed in which it overwhelms your brain makes it or breaks it. For me, IV, morphine 6/10, heroin 9/10, hydromorphone 10/10.

Speaking of hydromorphone, I could make the hyperbolic comparison of hydrocodone = hydromorphone in your brain, thus vicodin and diluadid are equal, but they are opposite ends of the spectrum.
How is the skag over in MN? I am from there, but never visit. I Heard the H was amazingly pure. Made me very very jealous and envious. I heard it was very available at this time, where 20 years ago, not so much from what I could tell when I lived there.
 

RedRum OG

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How is the skag over in MN? I am from there, but never visit. I Heard the H was amazingly pure. Made me very very jealous and envious. I heard it was very available at this time, where 20 years ago, not so much from what I could tell when I lived there.

Unfortunately/fortunately i have no idea what's going on in the streets anymore. In 2008-2012 when I was doing mostly tar, the heroin was surprisingly good for being that far inland. The mexican cartels worked the streets directly, so while their tar wasn't produced in a top notch way, it wasn't intentionally cut whatsoever so was pretty pure. The powder heroin from the black crews was also surprisingly good. If I had to guess around 60-75%. Somebody with no tolerance could get probably 5-10 strong shots off of one 10 bag/balloon.

So back then, yeah, MN for sure had above average stuff, consistently. It created a lot of huge habits. When I went to detox in 2010, almost everyone there in their teens or 20s was there for tar.

From what little I hear, fentanyl has ruined the true heroin scene, like everywhere else, but I'm not the best guy to ask about the current state. I definitely still see people nodding off around town once in a while, and there are always newbies at the methadone clinic
 
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DKs

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There re some Heroin programs in the German speaking word for quite some time now, especially in Switzerland and Germany. In Germany you can choose your dose freely, but you have to be able to shoot up yourself without any help from anyone else and you MUST shoot up. In Switzerland, for example, you're allowed to smoke it, too. Anyway, the highest doses reported in Germany were 750 mg pure Diamorphine per injections, though people are allowed to do more. I guess there is some kind of ceiling effect. The downside is that, at least in Germany, you MUST shoot up under sight. You can never ever get a take home, though you are allowed to combine your Heroin prescription with a Methadone prescription, which you are allowed to take home for 1 or 2 weeks worth of Methadone at a time. You can, in most regions of Germany shoot up Drugs you've brought yourself under sight, too and thus reducing fatalities. Also you will be provided with most things you'll need on entering the facility such as clean syringes and needles, disinfected spoons, acid in water fit for IV. The only thing you can't get are sterile membranes for micro-filtering. They will give you cigarette filters instead. Police is not allowed to enter these facilities, but might stop people and check ID if your hanging around by the entrance too long.
Munich is a little backward in all these things and has many more deaths due to overdose. What has been observed in Germany is, that the ore relaxed restrictions are, the less people die of drug-related illness, especially overdoses, but infectious deceases, too.

In Germany many people leave substitution programs (don't get new prescriptions), if the street heroins purity improves to about 60% r higher. But this happens rarely and arrests of dealers are made fairly quick in these cases.

In the UK you can get Heroin on a regular prescription, or at least you used to. Don't know if it is still like that, however I think the hurdle is much too high as you have to fail a regular replacement-drug therapy with Methadone or Buprenorphine like a dozen times... But at least you can get methadone to IV in UK, too. In Germany this might only be possible if you're getting Methadone for pain.
If you ask me I'd say that maintenance therapies should be conducted just like opioid-supported chronic pain treatment: an opioid with long duration of action and for acute ad strong cravings another instant-release opioid with short action and short half-life. Opioid rotation as necessary. But as long as these evil "Junkies" are not seen as people who are ill and need medical help and rather as something the "normal population" needs to be protected from as they spread desease and financial hardship due to their criminal behavior, nothing much will change, unfortunately, and drug-addicts will always be considered unworthy sub-humans.
 

Zephyn

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Id like a clinic that provided me with heroin 2-3x a week and then cut me off.

There re some Heroin programs in the German speaking word for quite some time now, especially in Switzerland and Germany. In Germany you can choose your dose freely, but you have to be able to shoot up yourself without any help from anyone else and you MUST shoot up. In Switzerland, for example, you're allowed to smoke it, too. Anyway, the highest doses reported in Germany were 750 mg pure Diamorphine per injections, though people are allowed to do more. I guess there is some kind of ceiling effect. The downside is that, at least in Germany, you MUST shoot up under sight. You can never ever get a take home, though you are allowed to combine your Heroin prescription with a Methadone prescription, which you are allowed to take home for 1 or 2 weeks worth of Methadone at a time. You can, in most regions of Germany shoot up Drugs you've brought yourself under sight, too and thus reducing fatalities. Also you will be provided with most things you'll need on entering the facility such as clean syringes and needles, disinfected spoons, acid in water fit for IV. The only thing you can't get are sterile membranes for micro-filtering. They will give you cigarette filters instead. Police is not allowed to enter these facilities, but might stop people and check ID if your hanging around by the entrance too long.
Munich is a little backward in all these things and has many more deaths due to overdose. What has been observed in Germany is, that the ore relaxed restrictions are, the less people die of drug-related illness, especially overdoses, but infectious deceases, too.

In Germany many people leave substitution programs (don't get new prescriptions), if the street heroins purity improves to about 60% r higher. But this happens rarely and arrests of dealers are made fairly quick in these cases.

In the UK you can get Heroin on a regular prescription, or at least you used to. Don't know if it is still like that, however I think the hurdle is much too high as you have to fail a regular replacement-drug therapy with Methadone or Buprenorphine like a dozen times... But at least you can get methadone to IV in UK, too. In Germany this might only be possible if you're getting Methadone for pain.
If you ask me I'd say that maintenance therapies should be conducted just like opioid-supported chronic pain treatment: an opioid with long duration of action and for acute ad strong cravings another instant-release opioid with short action and short half-life. Opioid rotation as necessary. But as long as these evil "Junkies" are not seen as people who are ill and need medical help and rather as something the "normal population" needs to be protected from as they spread desease and financial hardship due to their criminal behavior, nothing much will change, unfortunately, and drug-addicts will always be considered unworthy sub-humans.
Riiight long half life so the withdrawals are worse and "clients" have to keep coming back. I mean im someone who can avoid dependency alltogether but think of the rest of the junkies!
 

DKs

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Yeah, I guess I would take it 2-3 times a week, too. If it was offered on top of my Methadone. I would like to have some DHC or hydrocodone or oxycodone on top of my Methadone, too. Really any of these would be nice.
But even in Germany you'll have to come daily to shoot up or you'll be kicked out of the program. Even if your base subtitution is oral Methadone or oral Morphine-Sulfate (you can get a 24 hour Morphine pill instead iof Methadone, too).
 

Zephyn

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legalize meth too for prescription use please guys
It already is, at least here in the USA

legalize meth too for prescription use please guys
And alcohol while your at it!

Yeah, I guess I would take it 2-3 times a week, too. If it was offered on top of my Methadone. I would like to have some DHC or hydrocodone or oxycodone on top of my Methadone, too. Really any of these would be nice.
But even in Germany you'll have to come daily to shoot up or you'll be kicked out of the program. Even if your base subtitution is oral Methadone or oral Morphine-Sulfate (you can get a 24 hour Morphine pill instead iof Methadone, too).
Yeah see i dont want to be a daily user and that's why I very rarely ever touch the stuff/won't ever again. Having a clinic to cut me off would be nice.
 

Calder

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Jun 26, 2020
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I think some programs do.
In Austria they have Morphine-sulfat to choose as your main therapeutic medicine, or you can choose Methadone.
In the country where i live, we have Methadone(40ml to 200ml) or Subutex(under tongue 2mg and 8 mg)
 

AlphaMethylPhenyl

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Stimulants function pretty differently than opioids. Replacement therapy is rarely viable due to the fiendish nature of the habit. Meth might as well be illegal in the USA. Not only is it selected for very treatment-resistant people, but insurance is unlikely to cover it, and because of the low amount produced (partly), it's very expensive. That's all good and well, because it's much harder on the brain than amphetamine otherwise.

I think though that the USA is leading global drug reform through individual states passing more progressive laws. It's sort of snowballing (no pun). It started with legal medical cannabis, and finally has cracked personal amounts of substances as decriminalized. Next 10-20 years and most states will follow, assuming that the feds don't get to it earlier, in which case the opioid epidemic would have to likely grow and mutate and become worse and worse.
 

bingey

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We had a heroine program in my city, the addicts would sneak out white pharm grade heroin and sell it or trade it for dark brown Street dopewhich was perceived to give a stronger rush even when smoked
 

thegreenhand

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We had a heroine program in my city, the addicts would sneak out white pharm grade heroin and sell it or trade it for dark brown Street dopewhich was perceived to give a stronger rush even when smoked
that's why these prograsm only work imo if the pharma heroin/meth/cocaine is available to all. legal supply needs to put black market supply out of business. but that won't happen when most people can't access the pharma drugs as @F.U.B.A.R. has noted
 

RedRum OG

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Yeah man, I’m from Florida, supposedly the drug capital of the World, and unfortunately unless you really know & trust your connect you will most likely be sold a little bit of fentanyl mixed with a lot of cut.
But for someone like me who has been going to the Methadone clinic & getting 180mgs a day for over 15 years, even pure fentanyl or pure heroine for that matter does almost NOTHING for me but give me a 3 minute little weak ass rush, then nothing!!!
I've been on that high dose methadone + benzo train my man, and itll ruin ya. That habit was 10x harder to come off of than when I was shooting speedballs. Be careful. I came very close to death many times when I was put in a detox that was unequipped to handle massive habits, seizures, hallucinations, less than 20 hours of sleep in 2 months... I'm still recovering from that experience 7 years later.

I bet you could cut your methadone dose down to like 100mg in a month with liberal loperamide usage. Read up on the benefits and potential dangers of that, it can be a lifesaver.

Yeah, it's a major bummer all the real heroin is disappearing. Soon itll just be a legend old junkies croon about, like OC80s, true opium, and powdered diluadid. Fentanyl has no class, and heroin is the most regal of all drugs. Embarassing. Haven't done it in years but it still saddens me greatly
 
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Uden

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Yeah it'll be nice when we have our personal freedom back, and we lose the need for a babysitter.
 

Bomb319

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Wow! Who would've thought that providing the substance that makes people rob and even kill could make such a difference!

This country...
 

thegreenhand

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I’m in bed already and on my iPad. Cannot keep up with dude or dudette! They’re on a roll though. Overstepped the mark on the remembrance thread though. Handing back the reigns to you now. 🤣
I was just kidding with ya friend, mods are taking care of it
 
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