Serotonin Syndrome? Please help.

[EdBro]

hi bluelight

I apologize in advance if this is too much writing but I wanted to be thorough since it truly is affecting my life quite a lot at the moment.



I am 23, 75kg and male.

11 days ago on sunday night I took MDMA crystals for the first time(first time taking mdma ever) while getting stoned as well.

I took about 200mg and the effects kicked in 20 mins later, I was sitting on a chair at this point immediately felt a burning sensation in my brain, like it was on fire, it felt like my whole body was melting including my face, eventually I made it over to the sofa and lied down. I was pretty happy at this point from the euphoria but at the same time I felt this sense that the experience was so intense I was going to die, not because I was in pain but just as if I felt like I was going to "go" or pass away, as if my soul was about to exit my body.

Eventually I experienced minor tremors in my jaw (not clenching but actual shaking, I shook a bit and after about 45 mins or an hour of this, I was okay and enjoyed the high. I went to sleep at about 7am after a couple more joints. The euphoric lasted about 10 hours total (2100-0700) during this period I drank no water and ate no food. I woke at 1400 the next day and went for a walk, I still felt great and I was jittery. I still had drank little water during that day (monday.)

At about 11pm that evening (still monday, the day after) I was walking my girlfriend home and all of a sudden my heart just felt like it dropped. I suddenly started experiencing symptoms of low blood pressure and had to sit down on a bench. I was dizzy that night and my heart rate was high when walking around or standing (orthostatic hypotension) I got home and slept.

The next day I experienced the exact same symptoms + bad chest pain when walking or standing so I spent all day in bed and barely left the house. I also rehydrated and ate.

The day following that (wedensday), I felt the exact same, so I called my GP, it may have been a bit early but for me this was very new and I thought I caused some sort of heart damage.

I walked to the GP and it took me 20 mins instead of the usual 10, I had to sit in the middle of the street 2 times for a few mins to bring myself back to reality as I was experiencing a racing heart, chest pain and dizziness and a few more symptoms of orthostatic hypotension. The GP upon hearing my symptoms and doing an ECG (which came back fine) said she highly recommended that I let her call an ambulance for me, so, I took that advise and waited.

Upon reaching the hospital, I could barely walk at this point more than a few feet so they had to wheel me to the main part of the hospital, they did a blood test and ECG and I stayed the night. That night I stayed in the hospital bed and I experienced a massive panic attack (I've never had one before in my life.)

I could barely walk the whole time I was there, but, I waited it out in the bed. I experienced minor chest pains that whole day in bed and when walking they intensified. The next day (thursday,) I got the results back on the ECG and blood work and they came back fine. The senior doctor sent me home and told me to rest. Still, unable to walk properly I got wheeled to the front and a lift home. I slept that whole evening.

Next day, friday. Exact same symptoms, same saturday and only on sunday morning did my chest pain slowly subside and I could walk without dizziness, so I went for a small walk. After 10 minutes I was exhausted, the chest pains were back and I went back to bed.

It was only on monday, 8 days later, did I start to be able to walk a bit more, my chest pain subsided a bit more and I could finally go for a 15 minute walk. My heart still raced when standing.

Tuesday, I could walk all day with very minor chest pain, but, am still having a lot of problems regulating my heart rate.

Summary:


23 year old 75kg took MDMA (200mg) for the first time combined with weed. After the MDMA exited my system I experienced pretty severe orthostatic hypotension and restlessness that mainly persisted for a week. Increased heart rate when standing or walking and heart palpitations remained.. but dizziness, balance and nausea went away. I Supplemented during that week, with Vitamin C and other supplements, I took 5HTP for a while until I realized it may increase symptoms if it is truly serotonin syndrome related.

Originally having a resting BPM in the low 50s or high 40's, and walking about at 75-80bpm my walking heart rate is now 100 almost always when walking and spikes regularly to 120-130.

In conclusion to all this is I believe, I experienced a minor serotonin syndrome as it was my first time and I was sensitive to 200mg + doubling up with weed which also boosts serotonin and I've caused minor damage to my hypothalamus which is regulates my heart rate and blood pressure.

I am still experiencing a high heart rate when standing (100-130) and very minor occasional chest pains and it is really affecting me drastically during work (I haven't been able to do anything recently other than read) and I cannot train at all (I used to do MMA and gym 5 times a week before this episode.) This specific symptom has barely improved if at all. I am scared to train or do anything physically demanding in case of a serious heart rate spike.

My question is, has anyone experienced anything similar and how long did it take to go away? Does anyone know anything? I have scoured the internet for other people with the same problem but can't find anyone at all, so, I thought the best thing to do would be to make a thread.

Please help, I know this may be minor in comparison with some other comedowns and effects but this is majorly affecting my life at the moment as it makes struggle to do anything at all. I've more or less been bedbound for almost 10 days.

 

[fairnymph]

Are you sure it was MDMA? It shouldn't last that long. But if it was, 200mg is a big dose, especially for your first time, so you may have had a mild OD. I've experienced both serotonin syndrome (on MDMA + St. John's Wort) as well as mild ODs from MDMA-like/stimulating drugs (specifically MDA & 4-mar, a strong stimulant), & your experience sounds a lot more like that latter, though you may have had both. Weed + MDMA shouldn't cause SS, even mildly. Are you on any meds?

The long duration & after effects really make me suspect another drug (or a combo of drugs), like methamphetamine or 4-mar, or a research chem like 2-fma. Not drinking water while high surely made everything much worse, regardless of what the you actually took. It increases neurotoxicity & the crash, I.e. your problems since.

If you have any left, get it tested. Where are you located?

 

[Cudi]

I agree with nymph, try to test it if you have any left or can get more of it. It's fucked up when fake stuff gets passed off as the real thing and dealers should be held accountable for that since they should test it themselves before selling it. Did you tell the hospital about what you took? All i can advise is to try and relax for now, and you'll slowly start to feel like yourself again. Worst thing to do is to psych yourself out because it'll give you more anxiety. The drug is out of your system and more than likely hasn't caused you any long term harm. It seems to just be some acute adverse effects especially since it was your first time and a high dose. Maybe take some multi-vitamins daily and perhaps even some 5-HTP until full recovery. Drink lots of water.

 

[F.U.B.A.R.]

I agree with fairnymph. What you describe does NOT sound like an MDMA experience. Therefore, the only answers you are likely to receive will be purely speculative.

 

[EdBro]

Update:

Had Blood tests and ECG done again today, waiting for results tomorrow and then hopefully I ultrasound of my heart to rule out any problems ... I bought a reagent kit and I'm going to test it tomorrow or so. I don't know what I took, but I did feel the whole empathic, euphoric feeling and when I did stood up (when I could be arsed) everything had a trail behind it, like motion blur. Music sounded amazing and I ended up playing counter-strike.

I am no longer dizzy now, I think I have orthostatic tachycardia and chest pain at the moment. Those are my only remaining symptoms, but they are scary and debilitating. It's not nice going for a walk and getting chest pain, not to mention I get a lot when lying down, which is (if it was a heart problem,) Unstable angina, that being the dodgier version of it.

I'll add as well that, when I did take it, I took it with my friend who took more than me although he's a bit more experienced with it and he experienced no side effects at all ... same batch.

 

[fairnymph]

You might just be really sensitive, & that could possibly be why it lasted so long too, due to abnormally high or low liver enzymes. But I still think it's unlikely you took MDMA, or ONLY it. MDA + a long acting stim sounds more likely, but still...a lot of drugs could have the effects you described. How long did your friend's effects last? Did he also take 200mg? If so, & if he recommended you take that amount, he may have quite a tolerance to this drug or overall drug class (MDXX/stimulants/amphetamine based drugs), so comparing his response to yours doesn't necessarily make sense. And/or he could be a heavy polydrug user who was on other drugs that partly counteracted the nasty effects you experienced.

Did you actually weigh out the 200mg yourself on an accurate scale? Or were you just told that? Do you have any experience with eyeballing any powdered drugs with any reasonable accuracy & if so, do you think it looked like 200mg?

I highly doubt you'll suffer long term consequences from this one experience, & you should be feeling back to normal soon, but any info you can obtain could help you recover. And I definitely wouldn't trust or take any more drugs from this 'experienced friend'.

 

[EdBro]

Sorry, by experienced I simply meant he's taken a bit more than me in the past. He's not by any means an actual experienced drug user. I didn't weigh it at the time, no. But I remember specifically how much I had in my hand and the size of the crystal and went back the next day to weigh a similar rock on an accurate scale, yes, it seemed it could not have been more than 200. Maybe 180-220 at the most to give room for error. He's not taken any other drugs other than cocaine weed mdma and alcohol, so the only other tolerance build up to any other drugs would be as you said, unknown additives to the crystals.

We both smoked weed, he had no other drugs and we both took from the same batch. He had, I'd say, about 350-400mg. Almost twice as much as mine and his comedown was almost non-existent. He also had no water that night but I assume he re-hydrated a lot more than me the following day.

 

[EdBro]

Quite crazy how one guy can get symptoms with a small amount and another with a larger dosage can get none. It must be something to do with sensitivity, I guess because I've never taken it before my serotonin bank in my brain must have had a lot of serotonin to release, where as his brain may have been slightly less full and therefore it didn't fry him as much.

 

[fairnymph]

Could he have been using this stuff for days or weeks before you 'rolled' together? 350+ is a really high dose. Probably impossible to know for sure which plays the bigger role, but I'd guess he has a mega tolerance AND you happen to be at least a little sensitive to whatever it is.

 

[Bethical]

Hi EdBro,

If your friend used the same substance in roughly the same amounts and experienced no negative effects, then there is a low probability that your symptoms can be explained by physical damage to your cells, tissues, organs, etc. This seems to have been confirmed by the results of the various tests you underwent.

You mentioned having a panic attack while staying at the hospital, which leads me to believe that your symptoms be may explained, at least partially, by a psychological reaction to your drug experience, as many of the symptoms you describe (panic attacks, irregular heartbeat, rapid heartbeat, restlessness, etc.) manifest themselves in various anxiety and mood disorders.

But without knowing more about your personal psychological state and history, it's difficult to say with any degree of confidence.

In the unlikely event that you did suffer some kind of psychical trauma to one or more of your organs, like your heart or your brain, then you should at least take comfort in the fact that your body WILL heal itself over time, assuming you are not doing anything else in your life that would inhibit or complicate the healing process. My advice, at least until you know more about the physical state of your neurological and vascular systems, is to continue resting and relaxing. You should also make sure to eat healthy, stay hydrated, get enough sleep, and exercise. If you find exercise is too stressful on your body, then try reducing the intensity and/or duration of the exercise. Even a light amount of exercise is better than none at all. Start small and adjust your regimen incrementally and things might go back to normal in some time.

 

[lionheart90]

Sounds like just anxiety and panic attacks. Nothing more.

Plenty of people experience panic attacks on MDMA. Smoking weed while still high on MDMA increases the chances. Its better to smoke MDMA when you are coming down, so like 5+ hours into the trip when its starting to wear off.

Talk to a doctor about the panic attacks and go see a therapist. Panic attacks start from chemicals being out of balance, but they cause massive behavioral changes that can become long term problems if not dealt with properly.

basically panic attacks start as a chemical thing, from your body being low on serotonin and high on adrenaline (MDMA can disrupt serotonin for up to a month after last dose), but sometimes it becomes a panic disorder when they body begins to have panic attacks despite the internal chemistry being OK. panic attacks can be a behavioral thing or a chemical thing. Either way, a therapist can help you out, and a doctor might also be willing to prescribe you something.

get the panic attacks dealt with and you'll be fine. do it sooner rather than later.

 

[EdBro]

Hello. Update, I'm a lot better now. My heart has slowed down. I still have chest pain but I believe I've identified the cause.

So first of all, I can't smoke weed anymore. I used to smoke all the time and now just one joint gives me a panic attack and makes me very paranoid about my heart, which does beat extremely irregularly when I do smoke. I just broke up with my girlfriend so that didn't help, but I've slowly developed anxiety. Tremors when I lie down, not violent but shakyness and a stress like feeling in my stomach from the stress.

If I get a panic attack, I simply walk it off. It's quite extreme, shakyness and all. Keeping in mind I've never had a panic attack in my life until the one in that hospital.

I believe that the anxiety is more than likely causing my chest pain by vasoconstriction of my arteries from the stress caused by my anxiety, resulting in minor angina however ... I will still be visiting the GP and asking for an angiogram to rule out any blockages as I want to be sure, and I can't imagine that wouldn't help ease the anxiety a little bit.

What should I do? will my anxiety go away? as of this post it's been 2 weeks. My heart rate didn't normalize until 2 days ago, the 12th day into this.

I can't imagine I need a therapist as I am quite mentally strong and aware that this anxiety is benign and I can fight it with breathing and such. Although it is annoying and interferes with my peace and sleep, it's difficult to sit down and watch tv or sit and eat because I have this constant anxious feeling, not fearing anything, but just a feeling of constantly being stressed. Should I go to a therapist anyway? Also I wouldn't say I get panic attacks unless I have an extremely stressful situation or I smoke a joint. So I'm just staying stress free and keeping my head held high at the moment.

 

[Jaredborgetti]

Unfortunately, these kind of issues sometimes happen after pure MDMA experiences, I will admit that your cardiovascular issues seem pretty extreme and are extremely unlikely to be caused by 1 use of whatever drug, so you perhaps developed an anxiety disorder after the experience, I have gotten all the effects you describe from pure reagent tested MDMA including the fast heartbeat after the comedown which could have something to do with serotonin depletion, for now, test the drug with Marquis reagent if you can and tell us the results, and just eat healthy, exercise, and keep away from all drugs for a while, meditate on your fears and current state of mind, and I promise you it will get better 100%.

 

[Jaredborgetti]

Its unlikely you had serotonin syndrome, its an acute condition not a chronic one and its pretty rare to be caused by a single drug or medicine, its usually a combination of substances that causes it.

 

[Phobos]

I'm pretty sure that what happened physically is that you got significantly dehydrated, which lowered your plasma volume.
When the drug finally left your system lowered plasma volume plus relaxed (no more supra physiological levels of adrenaline) blood vessels caused the low blood pressure as you described it.
With low blood pressure your hearth will speed up its rhythm to compensate and circulate the blood to and from lungs fast enough to keep your body oxygenated.
Typical of too much stims coupled with not enough water, electrolytes and food.
The panic and anxiety most likely where a combo of lack of rest and food, depletion of neurotransmitters, and the influence of the physical symptoms.
As Jared says serotonin syndrome is acute and it would have happened during the effects rendering you unconscious, probably causing seizures and possibly even coma/brain damage/death.
Tests the crystals, and report your findings here, but odds are you did not cause any permanent or long term damage although it might take a few days to be 100%.
Use jewellery scales from now on, do no fucking eyeball any drug that is not weed.