So fucking tired of this cycle...

[Pineapple84]

Im so discouraged guys. Had a bad pill habit for a giod 5 years. New I had to quit, my kids are getting to the age where they are gonna start to realizing why mom gets "the flu" around the same time every month. (When I cant find anything). So I go sign up for a 21 day detox at the methadone clinic. I did well as far as not taking anything but what they gave me for the 21 days but out of fear of the withdrawls kept taking the 5 mg dose after it was over for another week or so (bought these off a dealer). So then I read about, then went out and got myself some kratom and holy shit its amazing, no withdrawls what so ever. Now 2 weeks on only the kratom and I try to stop and guess what? Withdrawls! I am a single mom, self employed and work 6 days a week and absolutely cant take any extra time off. Im so frustrated, I dont know what to do anymore! I could really use some kind words or advice if anyone has any? Am I ever going to get this monkey off my back?

 

[Xorkoth]

Hey there, sorry you're struggling. Yeah, kratom is an opiate. It gets touted as a harmless cure for opiate addiction but in fact it hits the same receptors and is addictive. Although it can be a godsend if you take it just when you absolutely can't handle it anymore and stop as soon as possible. I was addicted to opiates for 10 years, and kratom is what pulled me in. Eventually it stopped working and I moved to harder opiates.

I'll write some more when I have a little more time, and in the meantime I'm sure others will chime in. You've come to the right place.

 

[Mafioso]

So did they fully detox you at the clinic or only taper you down with methadone? I'm not familiar with methadone dosages, but I'm pretty sure 5mg isn't a lot. And you could try tapering down off the kratom if you are taking a lot. But really, if you go cold turkey now you'll probably be done with acute withdrawal in 7-14 days max. People report methadone withdrawal for up to a month sometimes more, so if you were stopping kratom in the first 2 weeks and noticing withdrawal, it was probably more so from the methadone.

There are other comfort meds that can help, but you'll have to go to a doctor to get some of them. Things like immodium, cough syrup with dxm, and antihistamine have been reported to help by some. IME, you can only taper so far, eventually you have to tough it through some of the withdrawal. Usually if you can make it past the first week things start to get better. You definitely don't have to keep repeating this process. I think a lot of people let the fear of withdrawal consume years of their life. I know I did.

Reaching out and building a sober network can really help as well. Usually people at groups like NA are really supportive of people in early recovery. Working with a substance use disorder/addiction counselor can really help as well. There isn't one simple path to recovery, you really have to pave your own way and find what works for you. If you like art or music, now is a great time to renew your passion. Anything that keeps you preoccupied enough to not use really. Journaling can help if you need a place to put your emotions. It can also really help you start to notice repetitive behaviors that occur over days or weeks. You might notice you kind of cycle through thoughts and connected emotions during. Or maybe you'll notice specific things that trigger you.

A lot of recovery is about self-discovery. Rediscovering all the old feelings and emotions and having to figure out what to do with them and how to handle them. It's important to pay attention to your self-talk and do you best to create a positive inner dialogue and not beat yourself up and try to punish yourself for past mistakes. Cognitive behavioral therapy can really help with this. Through CBT you'll learn how your thoughts shape emotions which then shape behavior.

 

[Painful One]

Great advise above.

I don't have much to add, I just wanted to offer my love, support, and understanding.

Try some meditation. It has been a GREAT help for me.

 

[Xorkoth]

Probably the single most important thing to actually stay off opiates is to restructure your life to fill the void that opiates left. Generally people get addicted to opiates in order to fill some void in the first place. For me, I started them just because I like to experiment with drugs, but I quickly discovered that they allowed me to hide from my abusive relationship that was getting increasingly worse, and numb myself to it so I could tell myself everything was fine. After years of that, I had no idea how to face my life without them, I became so depressed I wanted to die because I could no longer deny how terrible my wife was. When I was finally able to stay off opiates, it was when that relationship finally ended and I let it go. Additionally, I realized I had let myself stop playing music, hadn't touched a piano in 10 years but it's one of the most important things to me in my life. I started playing music again which produces a lot of joy and fulfillment in my life. The feeling of playing music in my band is better than the feeling of opiates. I got back involved with various things to fill my free time, so I wasn't sitting around bored and thinking about opiates. Every time I quit before, I didn't do that, so I'd just be sitting around bored out of my mind, because all the time I used to spend high on opiates I would spend not high on opiates but not really doing anything, so of course all I could think about was opiates. Basically, it's very important to identify things that are causing you pain and not working for you in your life, and cut those out. And also identify things that are missing and work to enrich your life with those things.

Another thing that is super important is to exercise. Working out is the single best way to speed along your recovery. it produces endorphins which are the body's natural opioids, it's why we have opiate receptors. By blasting yourself with endorphins from exercise every day, your body and mind will regain balance without opiates so much faster. Plus afterwards, every time, you feel better. it helps with the depression and the restlessness. Plus, being in shape makes you feel good in many other ways.

If you can provide a better baseline for yourself by doing these things, it's a lot easier to jump off of opiates and deal with some withdrawals. You probably aren't going to have very bad ones considering you tapered so low on methadone and haven't been using kratom long.

 

[Painful One]

Ah yes, MUSIC wonderful MUSIC!

The number one thing that has pulled me through all of my life!

Stay musical my friends!

Thanks for that post shadowmeister. Reminds me I need to get back doing some exercise now!

 

[Stargazer]

Hey Pineapple! This stuff gets old quick. Don't I know it.

You can get a grip on this situation. Most definitely. Your habit/usage doesn't sound extreme. If 5mg of methadone keeps you well for 24hrs, that's not a high dose. I was on 120mgs a day.

You know what you need to do. It's either cold turkey, warm turkey (using over the counter meds) or get on some opiate replacement therapy. You need to get stability and structure in your life.

Also, you have to address why you use in the first place. Undiagnosed and untreated mental/ emotional issues may be underneath it all.

For most of my life, I suffered with severe anxiety and panic attacks. Fast forward, chronic pain comes into the picture. Opiates seemed like the cure. Like I finally found what I needed to stop the racing thoughts, etc.

Eventually, I was diagnosed with Bipolar 2 and it all made sense. I didn't know that mania can be anxiety, restlessness, racing thoughts, insomnia, etc. I always thought it meant getting euphoric and having alot of energy.

I got put on meds that help alot. I'm not perfect w using, but I'm a hell of alot better then I was.

Just some thoughts. Hope you're well, and get where you want to be.

 

[Pineapple84]

Hey guys thanks for the kind words. Ive cut down the kratom to just morning and before bed, today I took 2 grams a d now Im out of everything so I have no choice but to deal with it. I have 15 Gabapentin 300s if anyone has ant advice on how to use them to help, Id love to hear it. Thanks again!

 

[Mafioso]

I've never taken gaba before, but I'd probably split the dose in half if possible and do morning and evening doses. Or take as little as you need to be effective only when you are at your absolute witts end. Truth is you probably don't really need them but so long as you don't build tolerance or become addicted to them you'll be alright. I might even try to avoid taking every day and have a few leftover.

 

[Xorkoth]

Gabapentin only absorbs so much at a time, so if you take a lot at once it is less effective. it's best to stagger the doses, maybe like 300mg every half hour until you're where you want to be? I'm not exactly sure about the doses as I've only taken it once but the staggering is absolutely true.

I think the most important thing for you right now is to not dwell on the fear so much. You're turning it into a bigger thing than it is before it happens. You tapered a lot and haven't been using kratom long, it's likely it won't even be bad, but if you THINK it's going to be bad, then you might overreact when you start to feel withdrawal and try to self-medicate too much and get yourself into another bad situation.

 

[Pineapple84]

Thats exactly right. Im not sure I ever needed the kratom really. But I took the Gabapentin last night and slept great and now Im up and feeling pretty normal so fingers crossed. I think Im going to take the Gabapentin as needed but I dont have many so when I run out in a couple days Im going to just try otc meds if I still need them. But I'm starting to realize it might be more in my head. Ive only ever had to withdrawl (I was good planner when it comes to making sure I had pills) and it was HORRIBLE. But Im realizing now that Im nowhere near that level anymore. So again thank you guys. Ill check in and let y'all know how it goes.

 

[Stargazer]

How are things going Pineapple? Gabapentin is a life saver if you need it And probably the lesser of all evils for treating withdrawal. Since your tolerance is fairly low, it will probably be a huge help getting you through and of off everything. If you still aren't feeling well, after your done with the Neurontin , a short sub taper will help. Like 7-10 days.

Example: 6mg, 2-3 days, 4mg 2 days, 1mg for 2-3 days. Then done. Something like that. You probably can begin the taper with 4mg actually. Like 4, 4, 2,2,2,1,1,1.

Obviously, feeling really horrible can cause it's too run right back to using. I'm just trying to cover all bases. I hope you're doing well! And be hope you come back to update us.

 

[Tombs]

Interesting they only gave 5mg a day. My detox started at 30mg and I'm on 60 a day now.