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Is taking mdma three times within three days safe?

I blew about 6k in college financial aid on molly in under 3 months. And in my experience it's a waste of mdma. After a one time use your serotonin is pretty much nill.
 
shugenja said:
Completely False - the synaptic vesicle is constantly being refilled with serotonin -- synthesis of serotonin never stops it may be reduced but it is still going on
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nothing is ever 100% in biological systems. so while synthesis doesn't stop completely, mdma is a potent inhibitor of tryptophan hydroxylase leading to impaired synthesis of new serotonin.

besides, neurotransmitter depletion is a perfectly fine explanation for the tachyphylaxis we see with mdma. even for amphetamines this is the accepted model for tachyphylaxis. and the pathways using dopamine/noradrenalin seem more "more robust" than those using serotonin when confronted with chemicals.

here is just one random paper showing 5-ht depletion in rats. granted, the doses are higher than we'd see in humans (they try to find markers for decreased neuron viability using a ricaurte-style regimen but don't find anything to that effect), but what tells you that there is no depletion of serotonin at all even at lower doses when we know for sure that mdma releases shitloads of serotonin which is then broken down (because sert is blocked/reversed) and when we know that mdma inhibits serotonin synthesis?
 
Black said:
nothing is ever 100% in biological systems. so while synthesis doesn't stop completely, mdma is a potent inhibitor of tryptophan hydroxylase leading to impaired synthesis of new serotonin.

besides, neurotransmitter depletion is a perfectly fine explanation for the tachyphylaxis we see with mdma. even for amphetamines this is the accepted model for tachyphylaxis. and the pathways using dopamine/noradrenalin seem more "more robust" than those using serotonin when confronted with chemicals.

here is just one random paper showing 5-ht depletion in rats. granted, the doses are higher than we'd see in humans (they try to find markers for decreased neuron viability using a ricaurte-style regimen but don't find anything to that effect), but what tells you that there is no depletion of serotonin at all even at lower doses when we know for sure that mdma releases shitloads of serotonin which is then broken down (because sert is blocked/reversed) and when we know that mdma inhibits serotonin synthesis?
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Even at 90% inhibition -- the synaptic vesicles would be refilled in much less than a day

"the uniformity observed in the present study in different brain areas suggests that the rate of serotonin synthesis depends on factors other than the density of innervation. Using the postmortem concentrations of serotonin reported by Young et al. (34) for the putamen (466 ng/g) and temporal cortex (11 ng/g), and the present data for the rates of serotonin synthesis, the time required to synthesize an amount of serotonin equal to the tissue content is 31 and 48 min for the putamen of males and females, respectively, and 0.8 and 1.3 min, respectively for the temporal cortex. "

http://www.pnas.org/content/94/10/5308.long

so if serotonin synthesis is 90% inhibited -- that = 310 minutes, 480 minutes, for the putamen, and 8 minutes and 13 minutes for the temporal cortex -- to completely re-saturate the tissue (synaptic vesicle)

acute downregulation of binding affinity of MDMA due to acute SERT and receptor morphological changes is just as valid an explanation for MDMA tachyphylaxis -- probably moreso, as both of the following are true

1. MDA is NOT cross tolerant with MDMA -- MDA effects are subjectively normal after 6 days of MDMA administration that resulted in complete tolerance to MDMA - PIHKAL -Shulgin

2. Tolerance to MDMA reverses after 7 days abstinence
 
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both of the following are true

1. MDA is NOT cross tolerant with MDMA -- MDA effects are subjectively normal after 6 days of MDMA administration that resulted in complete tolerance to MDMA - PIHKAL -Shulgin

2. Tolerance to MDMA reverses after 7 days abstinence
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Has any evidence supporting these claims been found since 1991? Shulgin was great and all, but his private experiments do not a fact make.
 
shugenja said:
so if serotonin synthesis is 90% inhibited -- that = 310 minutes, 480 minutes, for the putamen, and 8 minutes and 13 minutes for the temporal cortex -- to completely re-saturate the tissue (synaptic vesicle)
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the serotonin synthesis rate is a few orders of magnitude above what i expected. while looking for sources to refute your values (and higher values than 90% for tryptophane hydroxylase inhibition) i found this nice paragraph:

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3153986/ said:
In the acute phase, which lasts for the first few h after drug administration, massive depletion of brain tissue 5-HT is accompanied by inactivation of tryptophan hydroxylase. By 24 h later, tissue 5-HT recovers to normal levels but hydroxylase activity remains diminished
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so it seems you are right. this is from ca. 10mg/kg doses in fact. so while it is not inconceivable be that serotonin depletion took longer than a few minutes (due to higher levels of enzyme inhibition or lower synthesis rates of whatever) it doesn't matter since we know that serotonin concentations are back to normal by the next evening.

while receptor/sert downregulation is a perfectly good explanation, i don't buy it that there's no cross tolernace with mda. mda hits the same receptors. i could see that you'd still get psychedelic effects from mda, but i don't see it having the full effects...
i agree with clocktower, shulgin isn't infallible.

part of the tolerance to mdma doesn't reset after 7 days. the first few times are special. after that side effects will slowly increase while the desired effects decrease. it's the same as with amphetamine (or any of its many derivatives).
 
On a couple of occasions I have done the 3 day streak, with on one occasion doing it on 4 consecutive nights (each streak being a total of 0.8-1.3.g consumed of pure crystals). On the earlier occasions when my tolerance was low I got proper euphoria each night, with the first night being the best, and the other two nights being less and equal in intensity, yet worthwhile in the sense that I did not feel like the MDMA was wasted. With higher tolerance the 3rd and the 4th day were really not worth while for me, but this was at a time when I was a lot of MDMA at completely irresponsible intervals. For me it never felt like it got dangerous as such, which I credit to getting sleep each night as well as not combining it with anything. I definitely wouldn't say its healthy, but if you have no other options and want to get most out of the 3 nights with low tolerance, it still beats alcohol imo. Also, take some time off to deal with the dip after wards, it was not very pleasant.

I would recommend maybe doing 1 unit first night, 2 units the second night and again 1 unit the third night, because no matter what you won't get the full ride on the last night, although you can try and compensate with a higher quantity on the second nights!
 
I think you have your answer.... and sincerely trust you had a good time, and survived!
 
about 3 weeks ago I took MDMA 3 nights in a row

first night 0.4g of pure mdma bombed
second night 1 xanax, 1 blue tesla pill & about 0.15g snorted
third night 3 xanax and 1 sim card pill

the first night the mdma was a very enjoyable experience (had a 8 or so week break before), the second night the pill had no effect until i snorted a line which got me fucked up then on the 3rd night the pill did nothing and i wasted £10

moral of the story? take ur avg. amount of mandy on night 1, then take more the second and find a new drug for the third (i cant recommend xanax tho)
 
Rolling 5 days in a row.

I rolled 5 days in a row and the effects on the 5th day were not quite as overwhelming as the 1st day but the trip was amazing. The only downside was that it took me a 3-4 weeks to recover. I started to feel fine just after a month maybe because I had never done MDMA before this happened. I would not recommend anyone to roll days in a row. The magic of molly is unlike anything else. So be responsible while taking MDMA, do your research on how to minimise the risks and maximise the trip. Its been 9 months and I'm planning to roll when the time feels right, but this time only once, or maybe not. :)
shugenja said:
There is no basis to this statement at all. Is it advisable? Perhaps not

Is there any evidence at ALL that 3consecutive days of MDMA use is harmful? NONE WHATSOEVER

In fact, in PIHKAL Alexander Shulgin cites a tolerance study where subjects were given 120 mg - 160 mg MDMA daily for 6 days.



Unfounded Assertion, many people actually DO continue to feel the effects just fine



Completely False - the synaptic vesicle is constantly being refilled with serotonin -- synthesis of serotonin never stops it may be reduced but it is still going on



Total Bullshit -- how MDMA is metabolized has nothing to do with serotonin release -- the only difference in MDMA metabolism caused by MDMA use is the inhibition of CYP450 enzymes -- causing a longer but not different metabolic process



Again, total Bullshit



Posts like yours contribute to people NOT LISTENING TO HARM REDUCTION your are scientifically WRONG, and assert ridiculous things (nerve damage after 3 rolls - lolz lolz)



To the OP --

Based on many thousands of experiences, and outcomes the following is likely:

1. The subjective experience of MDMA -- for most people is reduced on consecutive days of use.
2. It is likely you will experience an altered perception, and perhaps a slightly depressed mood on day 4 -- however a small percentage of persons experience elevated mood as an afterglow for days or even weeks following MDMA use
3. Due to the catecholamine release and cascade as well as the possible inability to sleep -- it is very likely you will be physically exhausted on day four

If the substance you have is not MDMA or MDXX -- you could be subject to harm by taking an unknown substance for 3 consecutive days

the likelihood that you will have a negative experience and/or after effects increases based on the following:

1. concurrent use of alcohol
2. excessive concurrent use of cannabis (research cannabinoids like Spice/K2 should be avoided like the plague)
3. concurrent use of cocaine/ amphetamines/methamphetamines
4. failure to remaine properly hydrated with electrolytes (not dehydrated, not over hydrated on water alone)
5. failure to eat balanced meals
6. use of redosing MDMA or multiple dosing MDMA on any of the 3 consecutive days of use
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I hope you see my message
I just wanna ask u are u ok now
The twitches are gone
 
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