The Big & Dandy ALD-52 Thread

[Yeetbeat]

Protip: this ISN'T the PARGY-LAD thread.

 

[sean107]

I agree with 240sxLover.
I really wish these novel lysergimides weren't talked about online so openly. They get scheduled quicker and quicker these days and I just don't always have the motivation to spend a bunch of money on RC's before scheduling happens when I can get regular LSD, mushrooms, and DMT locally.

 

[StickyChron]

I think it's a bit naive to think that not mentioning them here will somehow prolong the legal lifespan of any particular substance. I'm pretty sure the DEA/NSA/CIA-whatever is a bit more capable than that...maybe.

Then again, I haven't been able to find this illusive source yet, so who knows?

MXE and 4-AcO-DMT are still technically legal in the U.S. and are more popular than ALD will probably ever be. MXE was branded in the UK and sold in cute packages and shit at first and it's illegal there now, so it's a tough call and hard to find consistencies in the U.S.' drug policy.

 

[Hawk-o]

I agree with 240sxLover.
I really wish these novel lysergimides weren't talked about online so openly. They get scheduled quicker and quicker these days and I just don't always have the motivation to spend a bunch of money on RC's before scheduling happens when I can get regular LSD, mushrooms, and DMT locally.

So if you are not buying them, why do you care if they are being discussed?

 

[sean107]

I buy them occasionally but not often enough to stock up before some bans happen. I missed out on pretty much all the 2C series of phethylamines since I don't use the darknet. I've tried LSZ but I wonder how long it will be before that al-lad and MXE among others will be scheduled here. And I don't mind it being discussed online. I just wish it was more on the down-low. I guess that's impoosible in this day in age with the Internet, shame.

 

[Transform]

Just to let you know I've trimmed a few less informative posts to make it easier to research this compound. Please keep social chatter to the social thread and don't forget we don't allow vendor discussion

 

[Hawk-o]

I buy them occasionally but not often enough to stock up before some bans happen. I missed out on pretty much all the 2C series of phethylamines since I don't use the darknet. I've tried LSZ but I wonder how long it will be before that al-lad and MXE among others will be scheduled here. And I don't mind it being discussed online. I just wish it was more on the down-low. I guess that's impoosible in this day in age with the Internet, shame.

Its a Double Edge sword.

 

[maddee2145]

Wow! Does anyone think this will be any different from 1p-LSD, subjectively?

Dont get much from 1p-lsd by myself. Al-Lad was quit intresting but mild for me too. I expect ald-52 will be much stronger than 1p-lsd as it will start quicker without synthesin propionil part of molecule out from chain. Thanks Gods "Orange sunshine" is coming. Prays for Mother Acid was heard.When comes Father peyote golden ages ? )

 

[Toltec]

I want to try it because i have this need to know..... If it is Orange Sunshine like.... I tried OS a few times in 1970's.. I know a few others here may feel the same
....

 

[Yeetbeat]

I want to try it because i have this need to know..... If it is Orange Sunshine like.... I tried OS a few times in 1970's.. I know a few others here may feel the same
....

Orange Sunshine?

You mean plain ol' LSD?

 

[jammin83]

Orange Sunshine was circulating back in the late sixties throughout california. The people that ran the lab got busted and said they were making ALD-52. They lost because it can break down to LSD and back then you needed LSD to make ALD-52. That's the story more or less. The more you know...

 

[Incunabula]

I want to try it because i have this need to know..... If it is Orange Sunshine like.... I tried OS a few times in 1970's.. I know a few others here may feel the same
....

Nice to see you in this thread, as I remember that you'd tried orange sunshine

I know that you've touched on it before in other threads, but how did you find orange sunshine different to LSD?

 

[Yeetbeat]

Ah, got it now. The story cleared that up haha. They were actually making LSD, but claimed otherwise. In this context, you're referring to ACTUAL ALD-52 is Orange Sunshine as those dudes tried to claim.

 

[Incunabula]

Yes. But honestly. I don't think that it's clear cut like that. Nick Sands and those other people who got busted for making orange sunshine might have made up that it was ALD-52, to not go to jail. That's what Nick Sands apparently have said later anyway.

But in my opinion, orange sunshine has become a mythic name for "LSD" blotters purported to contain ALD-52 instead. I mean, when did Nick Sands et al get arrested? wasn't it in 1969? And people have been reporting taking "orange sunshine" up through the '70s, and even today, all over the world. Was all of it left overs of Nick Sands stash? Seems unlikely. The orange sunshine name has been used again and again since. Most of it probably "just" LSD, but some of it might have been ALD-52. Nobody knows, right? I've seen people swear it was different than LSD. Placebo? Sure, very likely. But still.....

One thing I know for a fact though, is that Hoffman print LSD blotters have circulated just a few years ago, with the ALD-52 molecule printed on the back. Why would some one do that, if not to imply that it was actually not LSD in them, but ALD-52.

So, I'd just like to hear Toltec's thought about the topic, and experiences with the 70'ies orange sunshine

Edit: Erh, I guess was just trying to say, that even if Nick Sands didn't make ALD-52, the name orange sunshine has become iconic. And it's very possible, that some one else made ALD-52 later, and sold it as orange sunshine - Because that's what the name came to mean, kind of. Nick Sands didn't tell the public untill very recently that it was "just" LSD.

If ya get my drift?

 

[Solipsis]

Didn't Nichols already say that 1-pos amides of lysergamides cannot really bind to 5HT2a c.s. themselves and should therefore be considered pro-drugs? Sure the esters of 4-HO trypts have a similar argument going, and the question would remain at what rate the pro-drug is metabolized, whether that affects pharmacokinetics (and as a result the subjective experience possibly) and also whether different people may have different genetic expression for enzyme populations that cleave the pro-drug into the active principles...

As was briefly mentioned / suggested in this thread: Yes if it takes a significant while for the 1-amide to fall off after entering the body, that can cause the trip architecture to be more dilated and the feeling of how it comes on (important in further development towards the peak) to be different. Not everyone may process this the same way in their bodies which may explain unreliable results when compared to LSD itself.

But this seems very iffy to me, something that we ought to be open to but IMO definitely not fit for the assumption that these drugs must be considered each as distinct.

You are ignorant if you forget that psychedelics call on our suggestibility. They scramble our perceptual and cognitive processing making it a bigger challenge for our consciousness and the "reentrant signalling" to integrate what we experience into something remotely sensible.
Even if there are small differences in the way closely related psychedelics act, there are a lot of different factors that determine the course of a trip. So: it will be easy to imagine special differences without much merit.
If you like to imagine, go right ahead but please be aware of it. It's not that I like to ruin people's enthousiasm and impression with mythical drugs like ALD-52, but I would hate to yet again see superstition running wild causing near hysterical confusion about the special or novel nature / properties of drugs like this.

If you cannot source LSD and in your country 1-amides of it are legal then I can definitely see the advantage. Also if you are a collector like me, even one with the pokemon mentality... well I guess it's another chem and experience to collect and talk about... but contain yourselves plz?

 

[Incunabula]

Sorry Who's not able to contain themselves? Who's ignorant of the suggestibility of psychedelics? I don't see it in this thread, and I don't know who you're talking to, but I have a hunch that it's my post you're misunderstanding.

To me, 1-P-LSD was just like really good LSD, no different. And I don't expect ALD-52 to be any different either. On that topic, I do actually find 4-AcO-DMT different from mushrooms. (more DMTish)

That doesn't change the fact, that the orange sunshine name has become synonymous to ALD-52 containing blotters. And it's a fact, that ALD-52 is a "mythic" drug (like DOM too, for instance). But that's going to change now, isn't it.

Many rare drugs have become more easily available because of the darknet, and because of that lab churning out HQ lysergamides - so follows that many of these rare drugs, are going to loose their "iconic/mythic" status too, imo.

And by the way. If we already concluded, that ALD-52 and 1-P-LSD is just the same as LSD, why even have threads on them?

 

[roi]

And by the way. If we already concluded, that ALD-52 and 1-P-LSD is just the same as LSD, why even have threads on them?

They're still *different* molecules. Just like lisdexamphetamine is identical with dextroamphetamine, yet different.

 

[Xorkoth]

I do actually find 4-AcO-DMT different from mushrooms. (more DMTish)

As do I, this one is the example that got me really thinking about the standpoint of simple prodrug or something more. Before I was on the side of thinking that the differences found between suspected prodrugs and their parent drug were all due to the rate at which it is converted to the parent drug, but once I tried mushrooms, pure 4-HO-DMT, and 4-AcO-DMT a few times, I realized that there is no way 4-AcO-DMT is simply equivalent to 4-HO-DMT absorbed at a different rate, at least for me. The nature of each is dramatically different for me, I don't even take them for the same purpose they're so different. I am convinced that 4-AcO-DMT is able to pass my blood-brain barrier unchanged.

With lysergamides I'm not sure at all, I mean 1p-LSD seems more chilled out than LSD but that could easily be placebo. I do HOPE that ALD-52 feels distinct enough to be worth taking in a different way than LSD, but I wouldn't be surprised if it's not. I guess I'll see, I suspect I'll have a chance to give it a try soon.

 

[Solipsis]

And by the way. If we already concluded, that ALD-52 and 1-P-LSD is just the same as LSD, why even have threads on them?

It would be really bad form to conclude it from the theory suggesting it, and close the door on any discussion and reported experiences. It is important to stress that the idea of these 1P and ALD-52 being special compared to LSD should be taken with a grain of salt as there is likely to be conversion... but we definitely shouldn't dismiss it altogether.

Some people are clearly infatuated with the idea of ALD-52 because of the whole Orange Sunshine thing. Everyone should just keep all these facts in mind and weigh them together, to be apprehensive about their preconceptions. IMO a good position to start from is to think that it is probably hard or impossible to distinguish from LSD (honestly, even psychedelics far more different from each other cannot be told apart by most people if you do double blind tests, iirc) and that subtle differences people think they feel could also easily be imagined and suggested to each other via trip reports.
Still, despite such a quite skeptical position we can still be open to the possibility that more easygoing pharmakinetics may help provide a more gentle comeup.

Heroin, diacetylmorphine, is metabolized to morphine... if you were to eat the heroin that would happen significantly but if you shoot it or smoke it the heroin itself has markedly potent action as is very clearly known.

4-AcO-DMT to psilocin
Vyvanse (lisdexamphetamine) to dexamphetamine

These are examples as well. It's a little confusing perhaps, but pro-drugs may prove to be virtually identical in all significant ways but they may also instead prove to behave differently depending on the route of administration, or prove to have different kinetics making the experience different... and they may be active themselves, fully or only a little bit or not at all.

So it's not that simple.

 

[maddee2145]

So, I'd just like to hear Toltec's thought about the topic, and experiences with the 70'ies orange sunshine

Oh CMon after 45 years no one will tell if it was the same shit.

But I am surprised nobody knows about ald-52 that it was one and only available in USA from 70 till 90 after the big hunt for LSD. It is only view labs in europe after the hunt was able to produce LSD and it was not available for USA.

So actualy all true LSD was eaten in late 60 by the last hippies )) After that till 90 we all was under the Orange Sunshine influence.

Maybe in early 90 with third psychedelic waves LSD was available again

Ah, got it now. The story cleared that up haha. They were actually making LSD, but claimed otherwise. In this context, you're referring to ACTUAL ALD-52 is Orange Sunshine as those dudes tried to claim.

No no. They just did ald-52 because it was not prohibited..And all was tripping from 70 with Orange Sunshine, not from Luccy )

Or are you really think that they make ald-52 for tranporting it ,keeping and when they neede to sell it they make lsd from ald-52?? Its quit complicated.And also DEA was not able to find any of LSD tracer with Scully and Sand . And this was the bigest rumor why actualy they are guilty. For ALD-52 which was not prohibited. This was a real precident in that late 70!

But in 70 the government, mothfkcrs, was soo scaried about all that revolution that they desided just to keep Scully and Sand for real and long.(

I want to try it because i have this need to know..... If it is Orange Sunshine like.... I tried OS a few times in 1970's.. I know a few others here may feel the same
....

Are you sure man? )) I am not remember what shit I was eaten last year summer on openair. But you will remember 45 years ago trip that you did few times?? Toltec you gona be kiding me right? )

And to be honest every trip is so diferent even from the same compound and the same batch.

But Toltec its quit sure it is the same ALD-52 that was. Its like the same water too. It is different us .