Misc Kratom withdrawal, keep track here

[asiam]

Plus, since quitting and letting my brain equalize closer to normal, I feel more clear and connected to things... like my spirituality and connection to others and the environment is slowly coming back. I forgot what it felt like. .

Omg yes, the feeling of spiritual connection is better than any high anywhere. And i found even when the withdrawal was at it's worst at day 3, i was noticing smells and the feeling of the air outside, and even through such a horrible sickness you already feel more connected just because you're not numb. Also, kratom is weird that way. Tolerance goes down extremely slowly, I remember once a few years ago I waited 3 months for my tolerance to go down, and i took a dose and it felt like i just teleported back to the end of my last compulsive usage, dull effects and noticeable after effects even though it was just one dose. The mental part is worse? As long as it doesn't last more than a month, that would be tough if it did.

Drewbocop how'd your progress going? I always seem to pick up some kind of habit, somehow, over the last 10 years as well. i'm sure having been through deeper opiate withdrawal makes kratom withdrawal seem very doable, I hope you're doing well!

 

[asiam]

I'm on day 7 now after lots of procrastinating (WOW it feels like it's been 1 month not 1 week) and i can say i'm past the hurdle of being pointlessly scared to go through the w/ds. I've found there are 2 physical stages before the mental stage, the second one being after day 6 and involving less physical detoxifying and more, well, constant panic feeling, imbalanced gut floria (all sorts of gastro issues, wee fun), and the RLS turns into a deep bone-feeling ache that has the same result as the RLS, = no to little sleep and difficulty standing/walking. The one symptom that really makes me insane. But you become semi functional, and after a year of not feeling clear it feels great to get a small piece of that clarity back.

Btw, benadryl to try and sleep through the restlessness? My 2 cents, it makes it MUCH worse so beware.

 

[drewbocop]

I've been off kratom for quite a while and have been supplementing with gabapentin. My RLS is ongoing STILL and it drives me insane. Not sleeping well or at all without gabapentin. It seriously doesn't help I just stay in my room all the time jobless and with no money, but I am going to be moving back home to NC soon and getting out of the hell hole that is mid-Michigan. Cannot WAIT and I'll be with family. Loneliness coupled with insomnia and mental anguish will get ya if you let it. Good luck guys! I'm sure as hell trying my best.

 

[pinpoint]

I've been using an ounce a day for several months. I take breaks once a month though because after a while Kratom gets boring. The feeling of apathy that daily dosing provides is reminiscent of my past heroin habit. Music sounds like shit, nothing provokes laughter or happiness, and I seriously start to believe a close family member could die and I wouldn't feel sorrow. Fuck that, so I'm off for a week as of yesterday. I may not go back.

Phenibut is essential Kratom w/d gear. It removes all mental anguish and cures the physical restlessness. The only thing that remains is the hyperanalgesia that radiates from the spine. I used to get ultra-euphoric from Phenibut, but I abused the shit out of it so now it does little to get me past feeling normal.

I see Kratom being perma-banned in the US by the end of this year, so what's the point of running up a gorilla habit? You'll probably end up on dope or opioid maintenance when Kratom is gone if you can't shake this.

 

[drewbocop]

I've been using an ounce a day for several months. I take breaks once a month though because after a while Kratom gets boring. The feeling of apathy that daily dosing provides is reminiscent of my past heroin habit. Music sounds like shit, nothing provokes laughter or happiness, and I seriously start to believe a close family member could die and I wouldn't feel sorrow. Fuck that, so I'm off for a week as of yesterday. I may not go back.

Phenibut is essential Kratom w/d gear. It removes all mental anguish and cures the physical restlessness. The only thing that remains is the hyperanalgesia that radiates from the spine. I used to get ultra-euphoric from Phenibut, but I abused the shit out of it so now it does little to get me past feeling normal.

I see Kratom being perma-banned in the US by the end of this year, so what's the point of running up a gorilla habit? You'll probably end up on dope or opioid maintenance when Kratom is gone if you can't shake this.

Exactly. I quit for two reasons 1) I'm broke now and 2) I was void of any and all emotion just like that. It really does suck your emotions dry after a while. If this god damn insomnia and RLS would quit I would be grand! The gabapentin is VERY effective just like phenibut is.

 

[KyleOpium]

I used to completely disbelieve in Kratom withdrawal, as I have never gotten it from Kratom alone.

However, the other week I was completely caught off guard with major withdrawals from stopping kratom, and I believe it was because I took 300mg of tramadol, 30 mg of oxy, and a kratom extract on the same day. The next day I felt extreme depersonalization, brain zaps, diareah, suicidal thoughts, vertigo, lethargy, and extreme hyperalgesia. I could not get out of bed or walk straight without falling over from dizziness, and I felt like I was not myself, like I was in a video game or movie. I have never experienced any kind of withdrawal like this before, even when I kicked dope.

I believe that since kratom modulates serotonin and norepinephrine, and so does tramadol, the gold reserve extract, mixed with the high dose of tramadol really fucked with my brain. These symptoms lasted about a week, but somehow I managed to push through work without anyone noticing much was off. Even taking other opiates, and kratom could not fix these symptoms. I contemplated suicide after day 5, as I believed I may have permanently fucked over my brain.

So I don't know if these were exactly withdrawals but please DO NOT MIX KRATOM AND TRAMADOL. It was the most hellish thing I've ever gone through, and whether it was withdrawal or not I'm not sure. All I know is that I've taken plain leaf kratom daily for years and quit cold turkey off a 30+ gram a day habit with no symptoms other than lethargy.

One day of gold reserve and a high dose tramadol mix and I was in hell for a week. Please for the love of god do not mix kratom and tramadol. Like I said, there has to be something weird going on with serotonin, and norepiniphrine between the two, and I wouldn't wish that hell on my worst enemy.

 

[pinpoint]

^Makes sense that Gabapentin works well since it is interchangeable with Phenibut (one cures the others withdrawal). The one part of kicking the Kratom that I enjoy is the intense emotions I get, it feels good to feel, ya know? I'll drive around with Pandora on blast just jamming to music with goosebumps and all. Feels good man.

 

[drewbocop]

^Makes sense that Gabapentin works well since it is interchangeable with Phenibut (one cures the others withdrawal). The one part of kicking the Kratom that I enjoy is the intense emotions I get, it feels good to feel, ya know? I'll drive around with Pandora on blast just jamming to music with goosebumps and all. Feels good man.

I've been on a music-listening streak since I quot. I get goosebumps from Radiohead, Daft Punk, etc. Heavy nostalgia lol. Does feel really good. I pretty much cancelled music out of my life while on opiates/kratom despite the fact I'm a drummer.

 

[JoeKava]

I have seen at least one Kratom user post in the Kava Forums. (www.kavaforums.com). Kava is mild and helps with addictions of all kinds. It provides mild sedation. The Kava Library has a bunch of information at www.kavalibrary.com.

 

[pinpoint]

^Kava has helped in the past with restlessness and joint pain but the body load is a bit gross.

I've been on a music-listening streak since I quot. I get goosebumps from Radiohead, Daft Punk, etc. Heavy nostalgia lol. Does feel really good. I pretty much cancelled music out of my life while on opiates/kratom despite the fact I'm a drummer.

Hah, yep, give me a week on Kratom and I end up almost exclusively listening to talk radio. After a few days off I'm feinding for some avicii.

 

[drewbocop]

Hah, yep, give me a week on Kratom and I end up almost exclusively listening to talk radio. After a few days off I'm feinding for some avicii.

Haha same here. I was listening to Coast to Coast and related shows pretty much exclusively. Still do but at least the real music's back.

 

[liftedgift]

I'm on day 5 no kratom, been using around 20-25g of plain leaf daily for over two years with a break or two thrown in there.

I agree with the first two posters, the WD definitely sucks even with just plain leaf but as said, phenibut knocked out most negative feelings. I don't get nausea, but the depression is the worst for me and getting back into rhythm without dosing is a challenge. Cannabis helps with the boredom but no so much with any physical symptoms.

 

[Thanatos9]

I don't get why so many kratom (and opiate) addicts are so insistent on cold turkeying? It will make you more likely to relapse if you're unable to deal with it and tapering is far more easy to handle. As a benzo addict for about 3 years obviously I wouldn't dream of cold turkeying that, the worst withdrawal was where i came off too quickly and it gave me a never ending panic attack feeling, hallucinations and if I had a gun I might have shot myself (not being histrionic, it was horrific, ended up getting some diazepam from the doctor).

Atm I'm taking 2x9g kratom tea a day and if I needed to come off a taper would probably be relatively straightforward. If I run out of kratom I get anxiety, RLS, chills and hot flashes but generally receive some more kratom in the mail the next day or two.

 

[whiteroom67]

Tapering Kratom is way different than tapering benzos. I don't think anyone should cold turkey benzos, and I'm sure you would agree. Kratom and even other opiates though are a different story. I for one couldn't taper Kratom when I tried, not because of lack of willpower (though that is always a factor regardless), but because tapering Kratom did not have the same effect as tapering benzos, or even other opiates. It was weird. Some people have certainly been able to taper Kratom easily, but for me at least, the effects did not lessen upon lowering my dose, the effects only changed character (became more stimulatory as opposed to sedating), withdrawal was just dragged out, and jumping off was just as difficult as it would have been without a taper. I do think it's a good idea to lower your intake as much as possible before jumping off, but in my experience if withdrawal becomes too difficult to bear with, at a certain point it's better to just jump off. Again, I'm talking about Kratom, NOT benzos.

BUT, this was also when my Kratom dependency was largely caused and intensified by co-usage of oxycontin. Without the usage of oxy during my Kratom usage, thereby increasing my opiate dependency in general, maybe it would have been different. Because I do think that played a huge part in intensifying both acute and post-acute withdrawal upon stopping Kratom. So who knows

 

[pinpoint]

The lack of any opiate withdrawal-induced life threatening symptoms make it all too easy to use until it's all gone. At least with benzo withdrawal there is the powerful deterrent of a possible grand mal seizure looming on the horizon should you choose to CT in a reckless fashion. Not the case with opiates.

 

[liftedgift]

^Makes sense that Gabapentin works well since it is interchangeable with Phenibut (one cures the others withdrawal). The one part of kicking the Kratom that I enjoy is the intense emotions I get, it feels good to feel, ya know? I'll drive around with Pandora on blast just jamming to music with goosebumps and all. Feels good man.

Damn dude, same thing happened to me the other day I was loving music, guess I was on day 2. I wonder why that happens.


And yeah I can't taper with kratom, I dose so many times a day it gets confusing. I would taper with benzos or phenibut though.

 

[drewbocop]

Damn dude, same thing happened to me the other day I was loving music, guess I was on day 2. I wonder why that happens.

Because opiates numb your emotions and make you totally apathetic and depressed eventually. That's half the reason many of us use them in the first place. To kill those pesky emotions.

 

[FlawedByDesign]

After reading through this thread I feel the need to recommend that anyone who is tapering off of kratom to invest in a scale(as it seem that alot of you have not). While I know that it may not seem important, executing a proper taper requires at least fairly accurate doses. When keeping track of one's progress/the reduction of one's dose it is IME very helpful to be able to think in terms like 1 or .5 grams, compared to say a whole/half of a teaspoon. As someone who has been struggling with tapering off of kratom for years I feel that accurate doses play a big role in getting clean. I wish the best of luck to all of you and will now end my mundane rambling

 

[asiam]

white room i had a similar rection, when i lowered my dosage i'd actually get MORE stimulant effect, which is 50% of what I chased, which did reduce willpower, and contradict commitment. SO i suppose it was more of a willpower thing. Funny though, I agree more with tapering than cold turkey. With cold turkey, I am much more prone to relapses on anything available. I'd say tapering is safer

 

[asiam]

Exactly. I quit for two reasons 1) I'm broke now and 2) I was void of any and all emotion just like that. It really does suck your emotions dry after a while. If this god damn insomnia and RLS would quit I would be grand! The gabapentin is VERY effective just like phenibut is.

Yep, I thought the rls would fade after day 3-6. i'm into day 9-10 and realizing it might take months before I can sleep normally. The problem with hearing all of these helpful supplements, is that I had to become flat broke to stop buying kratom. is gabapentin a costly supplement or some pharmaceutical covered via health care?