Tryptamines The Big & Dandy DMT Thread - The 6th Recursion

[Xorkoth]

Yep, that'll work.

 

[Madrus]

I'm wondering how different batches from different sources affect the trip. My previous yellow batch seemed to produce softer visuals with more colors and it was a slower moving scene and it was generally more 2D, but this new white batch is much more crisp with very vivid shapes of blue/green/red and there's this complex scene that I can never remember, and the come up almost feels a little stronger, a little more pushy. What other DMT-like alkaloids can be pulled from these sources? I know there's NMT but I'm not sure how that affects it.

It's fun stuff though, very clean batch this white one is. Many new people were introduced to it last night using the foil&bottle method, and almost all enjoyed their medium-level trips. I just wish I could remember these experiences! It's frustrating because it all happens so fast and I only save maybe 1 frame of this 10 minute long vision that was playing at 400 FPS

Also, I kept reading people say that tolerance is down within the hour; DMT tolerance is so short, etc etc. Well this was my second attempt at a DMT experience in the same night (first was +60min, second was +3 hours) and both times the second the trip was just lackluster and boring. The whole experience just feels like my brain is saying "Really? You want me to do this again?". The visuals are much less fun, more dull, and the body high hits harder. So I don't know if my reaction is idiosyncratic, but for me DMT requires some sleep before you can blast off again.

 

[5HToInfinity]

I've come to take 300mg Moclobemide to save DMT; I've had successfully intense trips on 12mg of DMT with this combo. Suspect breakthrough territory around 30mg.

 

[Madrus]

I had a sub-par DMT trip and I'm wondering if it was the DMT itself (harsh yellow batch) or tolerance from a long trip the day before? Does anyone have experience taking DMT the day after tripping and did you notice decreased effects?

 

[SteamboatBillJr]

I had a sub-par DMT trip and I'm wondering if it was the DMT itself (harsh yellow batch) or tolerance from a long trip the day before? Does anyone have experience taking DMT the day after tripping and did you notice decreased effects?

Yes, DMT has cross tolerance with other psychedelics.

 

[Bluuberry]

You guys posting about uninteresting trips - DMT quality varies A LOT. Reagent testing won't tell you shit about the quality of a batch unless someone was trying to sell you complete bunk. I've seen white powder that was practically inactive - I'm guessing it was cut. I've also seen goo and crystalline waxy stuff that had a huge body load with few visuals and little breakthrough potential. That stuff made it feel like you were being sat on by an elephant, which was unpleasant to me, but it also gave intense bliss and serenity feeling. I'm guessing it was NMT "contamination". Some people like the NMT / DMT mix but personally I don't.

Also, LOL at the guy who said "this is garbage and no one does it". Literally everyone in my age range that I know and meet either loves to smoke it or wants to try it. I'm talking like 95% of the time it gets brought up, that is the reaction. It sucks you didn't enjoy it, but as you said you don't enjoy most drugs.

A lot of people have stuff that's sloppily extracted and not vacuum purged, so solvent tainted DMT unfortunately isn't rare. That shit definitely makes me feel like I'm, well, inhaling solvent. Even though it's probably pretty small amounts I still don't fuck with any DMT that smells solvent-y.

Madrus - it is likely due to the DMT itself. Yellow batches are usually fairly impure. Was it yellow crystals or yellow powder or solid or what? I have no problem tripping on DMT the day after tripping on anything else. I have never NOT been able to get high as long as I have great material to begin with.

In my opinion it's all about the fluffy white crystals. I always get the cleanest trips with the least bodyload. Some people like the goo and say it lends a different tone / color to the trip and changes the buzz.

 

[SteamboatBillJr]

Madrus - it is likely due to the DMT itself. Yellow batches are usually fairly impure. Was it yellow crystals or yellow powder or solid or what? I have no problem tripping on DMT the day after tripping on anything else. I have never NOT been able to get high as long as I have great material to begin with.

White crystals: gas chromatography/mass spectrometry

4 FASI white

Extraction
A/B on ad*e*nium bark, vinegar and lye, pulled with limonene at room temperature, salted with FASI. Only retrieved the FASI that were on the sides of the container, white crystals, not the yellow accumulation on the bottom. Only from first pull.



TLC

Results

Seemed to have DMT, NMT (and fumaric acid)

PDMAB-TS turned DMT and NMT yellow, did not have apparent reaction fumaric acid



GC-MS

Results :

DMT, 2MTHBC, and limonene traces in the respective ratio of 319: 2.6: 0.1

Plus one unidentified insignificant trace component with too weak signal to tell what it is.

Raw Agilent *.MS file, plus pictures of mass spectra of the beta carb and limo is attached for those who want to double check the work.

Discussion and Questions:

* FASI precipitation yields only one beta-carboline trace, which does not seem to shine on UV ? This is interesting that there is another betacarboline or two that have not been described before in mimosa analysis. Its also interesting that they do not precipitate with FASI but do migrate to FASW and are present with xylene evap/jungle.

* Again, NMT is co-chromatographing with DMT and hence doesnt appear as distinct peak, check post in page 2

* Can these b-carbolines be active? Notice they are only in very trace amounts, here 2MTHBC is in less than 1%.

Possible ways to answer questions:

NMR, maybe some liquid chromatography. Will see if my friend can NMR it... liquid chrom, only next year.. Concentrating these b-carbolines with column and bioassaying would be interesting.

Yellow gunk: gas chromatography/mass spectrometry

6- FASI - Yellow container-bottom accumulation

Extraction
A/B on ad*e*nium bark, vinegar and lye, pulled with limonene at room temperature, salted with FASI. Only the yellow part that accumulated on the bottom of the container on the first pull (Same as 4- FASI white) was separated and analysed. This bottom yellow accumulation is due to small water content of IPA or that was left over from washing limonene before. As soon as one adds the FASI, if one sees drops/goo on the bottom, decant and let FASI fumarates crystallize slowly, this will separate.



TLC

Results

Seemed to have small amount of some beta-carboline, DMT, NMT (and fumaric acid)

PDMAB-TS turned DMT and NMT yellow, did not have apparent reaction with b-carboline, neither with fumaric acid



GC-MS

Results :

DMT, 2MTHBC, MTHBC, another possible b carboline (edit: dozuki in post 66 and 67 of this thread suggests its a yuremamine degradation product) and limonene in the respective ratio of
103: 10: 2.4: 1: 6.8

Plus unidentified insignificant trace components with too weak signal to tell what they are.

Raw Agilent *.MS file is attached for those who want to double check the work.

Discussion and Questions:

* FASI "goo" that goes to bottom of container when using wet IPA has very similar alkaloid profile to FASW and jungle results are very similar alkaloid-wise than jungle spice. It is interesting to note that, as predicted, this water on the bottom of the container has pulled the other beta-carbolines that do not precipitate with propper dry FASI. A potential idea to further concentrate these other beta carbolines would be doing FASI and after retrieving crystals, washing with water to retrieve other b-carbolines.

* The goo had clearly much more limonene quantity than the clean FASI. While this wet yellow FASI one has nearly 7% of dmt weight in limonene (it was clearly wet as I took it to analyse), while the other clean FASI had 0.03% of limo weight. A little cold/dry acetone or IPA washing on wet orange-smelling fumarates would go a long way if you want to remove limonene leftovers.

* Again, where is that NMT that appears on the TLC (it should appear just after DMT, at around 5.7min)?

So i've found out why the NMT is not appearing. It basically co-chromatographs with DMT in this column/system we're using. It does appear as separate peaks when NMT is in large quantities (for example in Acacia confusa), but in very small quantity it appears under the curve area of DMT and the AMDIS program doesn't detect it as a separate peak (but if you go manually just before DMT, you can see in the ion scans that there are the two main peaks at 131, 44 and 77 (and the molecular peak at 174). So there you go, indeed those spots under DMT in TLC were NMT

Both the white crystals and yellow gunk contained mainly DMT. At normal doses there shouldn't be psychoactive impurities here.

(Source) https://www.dmt-nexus.me/forum/default.aspx?g=posts&t=27724
(Also relevant) https://www.dmt-nexus.me/forum/default.aspx?g=posts&m=298786

 

[ecstacylover]

So NMT is responsible for the difference in subjective experiences?

I think the appearance of the dmt also can affect the nature of the trip. Kind of like we see with the variability of the nature of 4-aco-dmt experiences, even though degradation to psilocin has been comfirmed.

 

[MoonLiquid]

Going to do soon a higher dosage. (Since my last one was around the 25 mg and that was already mind blowing, not ''for 20 minutes off the world'' effect what people mention to have with a higher dosage.I'm not scared to fall back with a smile and just enjoy the trip , i mean that you're totally in another dimension for 20 minutes. Is it able that you will have that below the 50 mg? I'm not aiming on that and i go with the flow since i already enjoyed dmt without have that ''knock out'' effect but i'm just curious because, i'm not sure if i'm going to do 50 mgs without steps from like 40 mg ( or something like that).

 

[Listening]

^^ Don't understand your question, but am trying to integrate the significance of the fact that 99% of your paragraph is in parenthesis. Maybe that's relevant. I too have not yet broken through, even though I've smoked DMT several times (sub-breakthrough doses, for me at least, <=40mg).

Here's tonight's story:

About six years ago, I extracted some DMT from some root bark. I got plenty (for me) of some beautiful white crystalline stuff that I packed in a ziplock, tightly surrounded by desiccants galore, in an air-tight mason jar, which I have stored in the freezer ever since.

From a shittier pull I got a bunch of yellow stuff that I stored in a ziplock in a different air-tight mason jar, which was not kept in the freezer but has been at room temperature for six years.

I assumed that stuff was #1) weakish to being with and #2) possibly degraded due to being stored at room temperature. After six years, tried 10mg tonight in a freebase pipe, on top of 80mg of MXM and blasted me off to five-minutes of insane-latice-land and a long tail of goodness.

I think I had better put that bag in the freezer now. Better late than never.

 

[The Shadow Self]

I have about 1.5 gr of DMT crystals extracted from RB stored in an amber vial. I have had it for about nine months. I launched myself into the abyss with it when I first got it, about 40mg or so, and I have to say that it was enough to keep me away from the vial since. I want to go back to it at some point, and another part of me wouldn't mind if the vial disappeared. I am attracted to it like a moth to a flame, just because of the potential in that vial. I know that there's a place I can go, in an instant with it, a wondrous and scary place that really rattled my cage some time ago. At some point, I'll get back to that vial, when the time is right, and change my reality all over again. In the mean time, it's just stored away, like an arsenal of potential. I feel both blessed and cursed to even have it, because as much as I fancy myself a psychonaut, DMT is really the one compound that puts the fear of god in me, and also is more seductive than anything else I've ever done. That's shit is like nothing else, that's for sure...

 

[Listening]

^^^ I felt almost exactly the same way. Which is why I had sat on my stash for six years. After my most recent low-dose test run though, I know that the time is right for me now. Planning to do further trials in the coming weeks.

 

[Listening]

Vapor Genie on 30mg infused into a ceramic infuser worked a treat; fuck me. That's what it did. I was staring at a chair for like 10-15 minutes but that chair was an alien caterpillar. The memory is already fading so I don't think there will be a trip report, but I can say that this drug answers back if you ask one question and ask it at the start. "Thanks for your answer, alien white giant caterpillar."

I got there only after two attempts (spaced out by much too long a time) but that was only because my torch lighter decided to become very unreliable all of a sudden. If you plan to do this, be sure you can rely on your torch lighter to do the job (test on weed or whatever).

 

[NiceEnough]

A fantastic drug for me every time. reinvigorating, shocking, awe-inspiring, a real teacher. to be treated with real respect.

 

[Beenhead]

That is just a chromatogram. Do you have the .MS file or the spectra? IM just curious. Does not look like there is a lot of junk in there. Where you doing a SIM scan? thats kinda what it looks like.

 

[Bluuberry]

Sorry, I was fucked up when I was posted, it's bad wording to say "yellow batches are usually fairly impure". I just meant that there is at least SOME non-DMT compounds, since pure DMT is white. The results you posted is basically what I was trying to say - there is something else in the yellow variety. Who knows what kind of synergistic reactions might be going on, even with just small amounts of alkaloids or terpenes. From some results I remember reading, a yellow batch was something like 1 or 2% less DMT vs a white one analyzed. (98% vs 96%, something like that, don't feel like digging up that post from the ethers..)

I hypothesize that the subjective differences in trips are largely due to varying NMT content in extractions. Would be easy to test this by splitting a batch in half and removing the NMT from one half, do some blind bioassays and see if there's any noticeable difference. From what I've heard about people's experiences with pure NMT, it sounds like the "impurity" that tends to change the nature of the experience one way or another. A lot of very heavy, body based trips from what I've heard. Rather than the pure light, OOBE type experiences described by n,n-DMT trips so commonly. Just a thought.

 

[ColtDan]

A fantastic drug for me every time. reinvigorating, shocking, awe-inspiring, a real teacher. to be treated with real respect.

Spot on.

 

[Madrus]

Most intense DMT trip yet: 25mg + Nitrous right after exhaling.
WOW. I can't even describe it. Definitely potentiated it, that much is certain.

 

[ordinary mind]

Does anyone have any first hand experience with combining kratom and DMT? I'm thinking it might act as a nice 'launch pad', but not sure whether it will significantly reduce the trip?

 

[consumer]

Most intense DMT trip yet: 25mg + Nitrous right after exhaling.
WOW. I can't even describe it. Definitely potentiated it, that much is certain.

Potentiating DMT...that gave me a good laugh