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Kratom Withdrawals

krattom withdraw is a bitch, but its nothing compared to methadone or other opiates. id suggest what everyone else has, either ween the dose or supplement with anti-histamines and benzoes.

there is always the route of getting plastered on booze with and marijuana. anything that gives you some dopamine should lessen the bad feelings.
 
I posted about this somewhere else but I was using high powered kratom extracts (FST) daily for about 2-3 years. I just quit 4 days ago. Before quitting, I switched to plain bali leaf and weaned myself down to about 3grams per dose, a few times a day. When I quit, it was still really bad w/ds but I was also using oxy and fent on occasion this past year. I can say that most of my w/d symptoms are gone but I'm still craving it badly.

For me, the things that help ease w/d the most are benzos, especially xanax. Also, loperamide can help in large doses but you can get dependent on that believe it or not so don't overdo it. Also, cannabis. And diphenhydramine.

The best thing about kratom is that its short acting so the true sickness w/ds do not last more than a couple days.
 
withdraws, no not from kratom

Kratom works great for kicking a opiate addiction due to its own ability to attach itself to the opiate receptors in your brain, while blocking actual opiates from attaching.

I have NEVER heard of someone havig any withdraws from even after 60 days of use. I have seen many peoples lives returned to them thanks to the help of this super botanical and I have seen people avoid far more dangerous drugs etc, by using Kratom for energy - the killing of pain - the assisting with withdraws and blocking opiates during this withdraw.

If Big Pharma could Patent this AMAZING botanical they would in a second (So you would not have access to it). But be warned Indiana and Iowa have been sneaky by banning Kratom under SYNTHETIC ANALOG CHEMICAL Bans.. Huh, last I checked Kratom is 100% natural and has nothing to do with synthetic chemistry.
 
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^ I herd about that, and honestly thats bullshit. If they ban kratom where i live ill be doin opiates in no time. It helps me in a lot of ways i dont know what i would do. Its also crazy they put it in with the synthetics when its 100% natural, people need to challenge this law
 
I've been doing the Kratom dance for several years now, ranging from using occasionally up to binges lasting several months to a year or more. I unfortunately have had my fair share of withdrawals from harder opiates as well and some of this is gleaned from those experiences as well. Using Kratom for long enough periods of time in high enough doses will give you withdrawal very reminiscent to that of the hardest opiates, despite peoples tendency to downplay Kratom withdrawal or scoff at it saying it doesn’t even compare to such and such opiate withdrawal… well, everyone is different, but for me personally it certainly ranks up there with the best of opiates. The good news is, the duration of withdrawal symptoms and PAWS is usually far less. 3-5 days for withdrawal on average and about 2 weeks after that for PAWS is usually what I experience.

The (UC) following a listed item will indicate to use sparingly, or to use with caution as they have their own addictive qualities and possibility for withdrawal as well. After going through Kratom withdrawals the last thing you want to have to do is withdraw from something else, so please be careful with these ones. I only list them because they are, unfortunately, some of the most helpful.

Anyway, that being said, this following regimen is one I have tinkered with for years and seems to work pretty effectively, for me at least. You may need to play with the dosage or avoid certain substances as everyone reacts and metabolizes differently. As always, use extreme caution and start at the lowest dosage indicated for these products if you have never used them, or used them in combination. Be careful.

Taper
Taper off. Reduce your dosage as much as you can while feeling comfortable, over the period a week or two. You will feel some discomfort – but the goal here isn’t to get high keep that in mind - It’s to take as little as you can, but still be able to function. As you taper you can start to introduce the items listed below as needed, based on symptoms, to ease any discomfort. Psychologically, it seems to reduce some of my anxiety if I have a small supply left when I stop dosing. For some reason knowing it’s there if I need it makes it easier for me. But to do the above you need to exercise a lot of self-control. If you don’t think you can, taper off to the best of your ability and use up or throw out what you have left - or just dump it and go cold turkey.

I’ll start with the ones that actually don’t involve taking more substances, but doing something. There is science behind all of these, but this is already getting too lengthy. If you don’t believe me, do the research!

Excersize.
I know this is the last thing you’ll want to do, with little no energy and feeling like overall hell… but force yourself to do it. The benefits will be obvious. Don’t under estimate the power of this one. Usually with the regimen I will list below, I feel good enough at least to get a little in. Push yourself to do this.

Cold Showers – At least twice a day
I know this is another hard one when your temperature feels as out of whack as it will when in withdrawal but again, don’t underestimate this. Try it for at least one day, no matter how uncomfortable, this always improves my mood and actually helps with the cold sweats/feverish feelings quite a lot. It seems to actually help my body regulate temperature or the perception of temperature more effectively.

Nutrition
Eat balanced and healthy (small) meals as often as you can. I know your appetite will be close to nothing and whatever you eat might come out one end or the other pretty soon, but it’s important to try to force some food down. Avoid greasy foods – they will just add to the inability to keep food IN your stomach. The substances I’m going to list below might also help recover your appetite and keep some of the food down, it does for me at least.

Here comes the list of what to take, I don’t usually take all of these at once – I address the symptoms as they come and go and treat as needed. It’s also impossible to really prescribe a regimen that works for everyone as we all react so differently, and have different symptoms during withdrawal.

Phenibut 2-3g (UC)
This helps the body and mind. It improves your mood and seriously helps with the restlessness, sleep, anxiety and depression. Helps with body aches and pains. Also seems to help with my appetite, I’m not sure why I can’t really find any science to back that up. This is probably one of the most helpful ones for me. Don’t overdo it though.

Xanax - as needed, I usually take .5 at a time (UC)
Helps with getting to sleep and also with any anxiety the Phenibut doesn’t eliminate or in rotation with the Phenibut in order to avoid tolerance/withdrawals to either substance.

Lyrica -75-150mg (UC)
Helps with sleep, anxiety and body aches and pains – pretty significantly for aches and pains. Take in conjunction with Naproxen or Ibuprofen and it usually almost completely eliminates those symptoms.

Kava – 250-500mg (UC) – Tolerance builds up EXTREMELY fast
It’s very helpful for sleep and anxiety, and restlessness.

Note: Rotate with all of the above, they all treat similar symptoms but have tolerance build up, addiction potential and/or withdrawal symptoms of their own, so use these in rotation as needed. The Phenibut seems to be the most helpful but try not to take any of these for more than 3 days in a row.

Loperamide – about 50mg is the sweet spot for me
Helps with many of the body symptoms, most importantly the diarrhea and upset stomach. Usually when I take 50+mg I’ll even get some of my appetite back. It doesn’t cross the blood-brain barrier so it won’t help with any of the mental symptoms but this one is very effective for the body related symptoms.

Inositol/Choline 500-1000mg
Seems to give me a bit of energy and helps with the mental fog. Clears up the cobwebs a little.

Noopept 10-30mg
Same as above. Gives you back a little mental clarity and some energy. Also makes it a bit easier to get some exercise in.

Multivitamin
Anything you can do to help your body, will help you.

Vitamin B Complex
Helps with energy and depression.

5-HTP – Anywhere from 1-300mg
Helps significantly with depression, but be careful with the dosage because it can cause nausea with is the last thing you want to give yourself more of.

L-Theanine
Helps with anxiety and seems to make it a little easier to relax.

L-Tyrosine and Mucuna Pruriens
Helps produce some much-needed dopamine. Will help with the feelings of boredom and depression.

Omega -3 fatty acids
Helps regain some focus and concentration.

Several of these supplements and vitamins I already take on a daily basis but it’s extra important during withdrawals.

Anyway, this helps me significantly. It usually eliminates many of the symptoms and makes it much more bearable. If done right, I’m fully functional. Not at my best, but I can still go to work and handle day-to-day life. I sincerely hope this helps you get through your withdrawals – This has been years of experimentation and I hope that my experience can help you get through yours. Always remember to keep in mind the reason you wanted to quit in the first place and that the state you are in is only temporary. It will get better day-by-day. Try not to think too far ahead as in “ugh I have another week of this shite to go through”. Take it one day at a time.

Good luck to all of you going through this. I hope this helps you achieve your goals.
 
I know from experiance that taking anti-histamines such as diphenhydramine/dimenhydranate will increase RLS like 20x dude. Fuck it made my w/ds worse and I had no idea that it was. Untill after a read a study about how it can increase RLS in people who are W/Ding opiates. And I have quit other times now without it and noticed now that it deff maybe it much worse.

Didn't know this. Thank you!!! Explains a lot...
 
What do you think the withdrawls would be like if your trying to stop after 2 years and are taking it continiously? I'm curious about the mental tug of war your friend experienced.
 
I appreciate your honesty.
I have never been addicted to Kratom but would like to know what the withdrawls are like? I have some anxiety issues like most of the Country and at one point took Xanex. Got hooked on it and thought about suicide the WD's sucked the big one, ended up in a Psychiatric ward. It took 3 months to get my energy level etc. back to normal.
I have been taking Kratom and noticed how the amounts are ever increasing to get the same affect day by day, I don't want to get sucked up into this stuff. I'm worried about some of the Kratom I purchase says "Not for human consumption" do I put it in bath water and bathe in it?
 
I have been addicted to Kratom since really the summer of 2012, I have detoxed off it a handful of times and even did inpatient treatment for 21 days- this was the longest I was clean off Kratom, but alas I relapsed a short time after treatment and continued to use. My tolerance has sky rocketed to using 50 grams+ a day of classic bali or commercial plain leaf as some call it. I never got into the extracts. I initially used the kratom to get off percocet. I actually prefer the kratom a lot of times to pills. It makes me feel great, motivated, happy,social, etc. I am currently once again quitting, started Tuesday afternoon this week and have taken a few doses to help me sleep at night but nothing more than 2-5 grams which is way less my normal dose. I don't think this will prolong my withdrawl, but it usually lasts 3-5 days before that restlessness stops (that's really my only symptom - the creapy crawly want to jump out of your skin). With that said I wanted to tell you guys that while I was in treatment I was started on Neurontin 300mg tid. And it helped the paws symptoms I had tremendously. I never had any paws symptoms any of the other times after withdrawing. Anyway I have occasionally forgotten to order my Kratom and end up stuck fighting the restlessness and rather than head to my local head shop and buy kratom at such an inflated price, I toughed it out until I could get my package the next day in the mail. I did, however, do some Internet research and found that you can use high doses of neurontin for withdrawal symptoms and it really does work great. So if you can get a prescription for neurontin (its often perscriped for nerve pain or paws) try it. If you are new to it start at 300mg, but you can go way way up if that doesn't work. I am currently taking 900mg 4x a day. The higher the dose, the more likely you might feel a bit loopy, foggy in the head and a little off balance, as well as sleepy. Its the only drug that has allowed me to sleep while in withdrawl. I am currently on day 3 and still fighting it. I don't want to quit, but I was spending way too much money). I will miss it and I wish I could just use it on occasion, but I know I'm going to want more and more, and with how easy it is to order, I would just end back up in the same cycle. I know I can feel normal again, but it's going to take some time. I recommend warm baths or hot showers as often as possible, and if you can't get neurontin, keep busy, get out and go for walks (i know I couldn't sit still I was so restless in treatment and the 300mg dose they were giving me didn't work until afterwards, but every one has different tolerances and mine is incredibly high- crap I remember popping 20+ percocet at a time, my poor liver, and I'd do that 4-5 times a day- I should have OD'd when I was doing that. Anyways I'm getting off subject, pm me if anyone has questions I'd be happy to help!
 
I am currently at 1.5 teaspoons 3X daily, at least that is my goal for today. I want to begin a very slow taper from kratom, as I've realized how fast I'm plowing through a bag. I wil keep you posted on how it goes. :|
 
How safe is taking 50 mg Loperamide?

Not safe, at all. And loperamide is even worse to kick then kratom for sure so it's not worth trading addictions. And then you have things to worry about like impact stool or toxic megacolon (if you make a habit of megadosing loperamide to avoid withdrawals), and loperamide also has some really fucking seriously fucked withdrawals, worse then regular opiates.
 
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I think those that use Kratom to mask their past opiate dependency will have a much harder time coming off of it than those that started with Kratom. I started with Kratom after being opiate-free for several months. It hit me so hard the first time I dosed that I puked and had all the classic signs of opioid agonism. I was always able to get off of it with minimal discomfort until after a year and a half when I started mixing a few days of classic full agonist opiate use with my Kratom. Then came a few experiments with extracts.

Today Kratom is a maintenance drug and gives me a nice glow reminiscent of the days I spent on Suboxone maintenance. Attempting to cease use causes pretty intense withdrawals now though, not quite as bad as heroin or Suboxone, but bad enough that I don't wish to stop at the moment. I always think that I'll have some time 'down the road' where I won't have as many responsibilities (I manage 3 brick-and-mortar businesses & 2 internet companies as well as moderate a couple forums in addition to family/social life).. that day has yet to come.
 
I think those that use Kratom to mask their past opiate dependency will have a much harder time coming off of it than those that started with Kratom. I started with Kratom after being opiate-free for several months. It hit me so hard the first time I dosed that I puked and had all the classic signs of opioid agonism. I was always able to get off of it with minimal discomfort until after a year and a half when I started mixing a few days of classic full agonist opiate use with my Kratom. Then came a few experiments with extracts.

Today Kratom is a maintenance drug and gives me a nice glow reminiscent of the days I spent on Suboxone maintenance. Attempting to cease use causes pretty intense withdrawals now though, not quite as bad as heroin or Suboxone, but bad enough that I don't wish to stop at the moment. I always think that I'll have some time 'down the road' where I won't have as many responsibilities (I manage 3 brick-and-mortar businesses & 2 internet companies as well as moderate a couple forums in addition to family/social life).. that day has yet to come.

What dose of kratom do you maintain with each day? How many times do you dose per day.
 
What dose of kratom do you maintain with each day? How many times do you dose per day.

I'm currently using three to four 5G doses per day of high quality red veins from one of the most reputable vendors online. That same dose with a white or green vein would cause dizziness, nystagmus, irritability & dysphoria. I believe it has to do with the amount of oxindole alkaloids that work as inverse agonists (think - antagonists) plus a greater abundance of other not-so-desirable adrenergic alkaloids.
 
I'm currently using three to four 5G doses per day of high quality red veins from one of the most reputable vendors online. That same dose with a white or green vein would cause dizziness, nystagmus, irritability & dysphoria. I believe it has to do with the amount of oxindole alkaloids that work as inverse agonists (think - antagonists) plus a greater abundance of other not-so-desirable adrenergic alkaloids.

Ahh, we're on pretty simlar doses then. I use 5-7g in the morning, and 5-7g at night. I used it to get off much harder opiates and am now maintaining at this dose. I did relapse though recently (but am back in recovery + kratom), and my tolerance to heroin has massively went down, so it's cool to know that kratom doesn't directly keep my tolerance super high or anything. I don't try to get high off the kratom anymore. Occasionally I'll take a higher dose though and get a little high. I started at 30g/day when I first was transisitioning from hard opiates to kratom, and have maintained on as low as 5 grams a day before. Kratom addiction and withdrawal from this dosage range at least really is much easier to deal with then H or fent withdrawal lol, that's for sure. Kratom has been a miracle for me personally, because I can actually keep my shit together when maintaining on it.
 
Good News and Bad news

The Bad news: I used Kratum for several months to treat chronic pain from my advance rheumatoid arthritis. When I went to stop...imagine my shock to discover I was physically addicted. I withdrew from oxcontin back in 2001 after being treated for a broken neck. I fell 30 feet.. Those withdrawals were the worst 30 days of my entire life. Worse even than breaking my neck. I actually thought I was going to die. The initial withdrawal symptoms I had from the Kratom felt exactly like the oxy withdrawals. I was terrified. I came here to see what was happening to others.

The Good news: I have a friend who is a pain specialist. She told me that as long as I had at least 25 percent of the original dose on board I should not go into withdrawals. So....over about 1 week....I began increasing the period of time between doses and reducing the amount. At the end of the week....when I was down to 1/4 dose......I quit cold turkey. And here's the thing. The human mind is often a trap. My fear of withdrawal was way worse than the Kratum withdrawals. Nothing like Oxy. The first day there was some fairly intense physical issues but not unbearable. The second day...anxiety and minimal cravings. Third day the return of my sense of taste and smell along with stomach function. Forth day.....FREEDOM.

The only thing I wish I had was something to help me sleep. Ambien or Trazadone would have been very helpful. The worst part about withdrawals are the racing thoughts and lack of sleep the first couple of night.

Summary-Kratum is a reasonable alternative to treating pain. It did virtually nothing for my ADD...so in my opinion.....that's bull shit. But buyer beware........it is addictive. Don't let ANYONE tell you it's not. It isn't on the same level as OXY or Hydrochodone.......but it's no walk in the park either. Some one with an addictive personality might be trapped until there was intervention. If necessary.....I would use Kratum again. But never two days in a row.

When I stopped I was using approximately 1 ounce very two days. Occasionally more. The powder form really wrecks your stomach. It's been a real relief to recover from that.
 
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The good thing about kratom wd is that it's VERY short. 3 days ime, and the 3rd day was a lot milder than the first two. I wouldn't bother tapering with anything other than kratom itself. I used to trip on dxm while wding from kratom and the kratom wd is short enough that one or two dxm trips (even low dose, like 1st plateau) covered the wd almost entirely and while I was obviously incapacitated from the dxm, I didn't feel like shit. Careful though, dxm is addictive itself and much more dangerous than kratom. Other than that, there are comfort meds like clonidine, gabapentin, pregabalin, and of course benzos. Weed always helped a TON for me too. 5htp may be a good mood booster but don't use it if you use dxm!! Good luck, kratom wds aren't fun but they're the shortest I've ever had, you'll get through it sooner than you think. :)
 
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