Opioids Kratom Mega Thread V.4

88dood88 said:

Kratom gave me the eye wobbles at high doses, and I would agree with another poster that it felt very similar to Tramadol. It also did clear up the sinuses 10x better than something like pseudoephedrine.

I'm on day 2 of WD and the only thing that's really bothering me is the lower body pain and restless. It wasn't even bad until I tried to sleep, and then it felt like my lower half was just seizin up in absolute pain. But other than that not too bad, got this weird tingly feeling on my skin like I'm really antsy or something. Just took some phenibut now so maybe that will help in a few hours.

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Yeah thats the dreaded "skin crawling" sensation, seems to be a common WD symptom for many substances. In fact I get it from trying to cease nicotine, it seems to coincide with an extreme psychological restlessness. Whats interesting is I have heard from many that stimulant WD is limited to extreme psychological cravings and not much physical, I wonder why nicotine WD shares some similarities to opiate, benzo WD. hmmmm

That would make sense alladdin as kratom has got me through some pretty boring times and I'm extremely bored right now lol. I would agree with stim WD being mostly psychological, although perhaps physiological, cause when I was coming off Vyvanse I got extreme boredom, depression, restlessness, and anxiety. Waiting for this weed is gonna feel like forever, but damn will it help...

Yes for me boredome is the most common reason I start up using substances again.....shit I could go months without kratom, alcohol or whatever so long as Im working out, having steady sex, and really feeling motivated with my art/music. But every now and again this intnense sensation of purposless in the uiverse coupled with boredome cuts through everything....spiritually empty? Perhaps some sort of PAWS? Ive been dependant on alcohol or opiods since I was about 15 years old....bouncing back and forth between the two and sometimes even both when I was severely depressed. I was "able" to stay clean for months (6 -18 months) but I would always go back due to some sort of existential crisis...I dont give a shit what people say man, I substances improve my quality of life....unfortunatly alcohol and hard opiates seem to get too out of control too fast but kratom has a self-regulating mechanism. Kinda like cannabis I suppose, but weed makes me depressed/anxious almost psychotic. Anyway kratom is the perfect anti-depressant for me . Keeps me moving forward.

Funny you talk about that^ it isnt any paws cos i have exactly the same thing and ive been 'clean' of any intoxicants for probably 18 months or so after having a slight breakdown after taking a tiny amount of a RC stim.

Unfortunately i too suffer from the acute existential angst as well and being sober is probably even more depressing minus the comedowns ofc, cos now theres nothing to look forward to in life.

yes my life would be real fun if i had a bit money/or at least steady income and ofc lots of good pussy, but how hard are those things to get on a consistent basis

infinitely harder than to get high thats for sure.

i try and try and yet continue to fail at being any kind of 'success', and with nothing now to blow off steam life seems to be one extended punishment.

getting high all the time certinaly isnt satifying either but i think total sobriety has really been shit. Sure its fine the first few months but as they drag on you realise that there is really nothing to look forward to and no real hope of there being anything else to look forward to for the forseeable future.

This^^^^

except you can have all the pussy you want.....its a chemical reaction....keeping her..well that's different. Understanding how to create the chemistry, well that's something one must study but theres a formula on getting women "addicted" to you. I once read that "love" is literally an opiate like reaction in the body. When someone loses a loved one, be it to divorce, break up or death , studies show very similar brain function to that of an opiate addict in withdrawal. Crazy huh?

If theyre gonna go around banning shit....they can take love too....fuck love...worst withdrawal I ever went through....Ive only had that happen once though

I know what yall mean existential crisis and angst along with drug use. That's probably why I got into drugs, pretty much because in reality I don't see myself being happy in life no matter what I do. I'm young but Ive been single my entire life and have no reason to believe it will be otherwise, its like being intimate with other humans is so foreign to me. Ive had friends in the past but always when they get too close I tend to drift away from them, happens EVERY time. I'm trying to finish college but theres always this nagging feeling of 'whats the point' of going down that route. I don't look forward to work, I don't look forward to school, don't look forward to making relationships with people, and without drugs I don't look forward to life. Kinda pathetic but it is what it is :-/

al-laddin said:

what meds effected this? Oxy , hydro... dosage?

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Oxy mostly. Prescribed for surgery. But I had a previous addiction with it, so when I started using it my dependency came right back, and I was already taking Kratom so I kept taking it right alongside of it, and then when I stopped the oxy I increased my Kratom intake even more and then planned to wean myself off of it. It didn't work that way though and I ended up needing gabapentin. That worked fine, great actually - for the physiological (physical symptoms behind the body and the mind, except I kept relapsing anyway lol because mentally I still just craved it. And it made the withdrawals 10x worse and longer than it would have been otherwise. I'm actually already pretty good from my slip over the weekend though. Not 100% yet, but close. I think part of what made the last few weeks hard too was some rebound anxiety from stopping a 2 week Valium binge (to try and help Kratom withdrawals... oops lol). I'm glad I stopped that when I did though, because holy hell it sucked - I can't even imagine what hardcore benzo withdrawal is like. Stick to Kratom guys lol.

And for you guys talking about existential crises and boredom and all of that leading back to substance use... I am right there with you. That's my main reason for going back too, even if I had been clean for months. And trust me, making money isn't gonna get rid of the desire to do it. I didn't have a steady income for a long time and thought that would help me stop my usage patterns, now I have one and it didn't help. Maybe a little bit in the beginning, but then the luster fades. Same with relationships. One thing I could see helping is traveling the world, living out of a backpack, vagabonding of sorts. Where everyday is different. Then there is always something keeping your mind occupied, because you're always busy experiencing something new. And then maybe after staying away for so long you won't crave it anymore. That's just a theory though. Although I am planning on putting it into practice soon enough and seeing what happens

Oh Kratom, haven't even thought about it in such a long time. I used it in an attempt to get off pills but it didn't work,just ended up eating 16-20 tablespoons a day,so glad I don't have to eat all that nasty crap all the time(at the time I didn't really wanna quit pills so thats why it didn't work for me.) But I do plan to use it when I taper off the Subs. Just wonder though, can anyone feel Kratom while on Subs, like they say you can feel Tramadol on Subs? And had anyone had any exerience with the mitragaine(know I didn't spell that right) anolaolgs? I've been interested in trying them for when I start to taper off the Subs..

im currently self employed and kind fo a workaholic, i dont want a drug habit to trash my productiviy/life. so is kratom agood one to take up?

i stopped doing stims cos they distroy me for days/weeks after physcially and mentally, so on top of it being extrmeely unpleasant when they wear off there is also the disruption of normal lifestyle.

regarding the existential issues i think my current thinking is- if im gonna want something to get by day to day anyhow i want it to be something that has least risks and generally safe. so does kratom fit the bill?

i hate all the usual suspects such as alcohol or weed.

I would say ya. If you are looking for a stimulating strain go for thai. It want trash your life, it does have withdrawls if you don't have it, but IMO there not bad and it doesn't last long at all. I think it would be a way better option than whatever stimulants you were using, but get on google, or read through some megathreads and do some research first.

ive been doing research for 6 months or so im just an extremely cautious type so shit myself trying anything new! esp an opiod.

One thing I worry about is say I got a taste for the kratom high. If it suddenly became illegal in my country would i then look to harder opiates to want to get that 'fix'? ofc no1 can say but what is the liklihood?

It could be codeine at first then a slippery slope to ultimate destruction trying H then next thing i know im living on the street another lost soul.

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i suppose contrary to that there are tons of 'sizzrup' sippers addicted to codeine who never graduate to harder stuff right and that is about the same or worse than kratom right?

Yeah if you are going for an opiate to take to get buzzed kratom is definitely a better option. Lots of health benefits, like I never was remotely sick on it, cleared out the sinuses, pretty much cleared the bowels in single clean poop (lol). I would agree that the WD isn't that bad. I'd say the worse part about it, and keep in mind my usage was irresponsibly high, is the RLS/leg pain along with boredom is bad. Nothing else is too serious and can't be mitigated by phenibut. Haven't even had insomnia, just the leg pain seems to kick in right when I want to go to bed. Still averaging 8 hours a night and actually waking up way less than when I was sober off any drugs or on kratom.

Question.. im well versed with the different strains of kratom but know nothing of extracts (plain powdered leaf has always been best bang for buck IMO).
But if I was to see my reliable vendor selling an extract that claims to have 200mg alkaloids per gram, doesn't say which ones.
So i know it would be speculation, but how many grams of regular bali/PC would that 1 gram of extract most likely be comparable to?
I know it's a hard question to answer.. but an answer like "roughly Xgrams to Xgrams" would be a good enough answer for me.
Thanks peeps.

-HOOD

Sounds to me like you got some bad kratom. First, stop buying it from headshops. Herb stores with herbalists who know what they are doing are a much better choice. There are some online sources that are very good. Most of them have the word "therapy" in their business's name, signaling that they are really medicinal suppliers. Even there, don't buy the cheapest strain you can get. Get the kind that they produce on their own plantations, if possible. Kratom has been a miracle in my life. Good luck to you.

ams said:

Sounds to me like you got some bad kratom. First, stop buying it from headshops. Herb stores with herbalists who know what they are doing are a much better choice. There are some online sources that are very good. Most of them have the word "therapy" in their business's name, signaling that they are really medicinal suppliers. Even there, don't buy the cheapest strain you can get. Get the kind that they produce on their own plantations, if possible. Kratom has been a miracle in my life. Good luck to you.

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ams, avoid the one with "therapy" in the name. I used to be their customer but found that they were selling to headshops, and guesssss whaaat? The actual brand has appeared on stories that negatively publicize kratom in the media outlets. As "Kratom a dangerous dug". Best thing you can do is join a kratom forum. Theres one out there that's the best, where the community looks out for each other and shares info about best vendors etc. Im a member and because of this have been using many vendors that support the legality of kratom by using honest business/marketing tactics and keeping kratom in the appropriate community. Im telling you this is the best way to stay on top of what vendors are good and which are shady/have shit product/don't care about the plant etc

HOOD, its hard to say, because its not that linear/logical. Extracts have a different effect. Everyone reacts different and finds some superior to others. But everyones cchemistry plays a huge role in this. I know you probably weren't looking for this answer but it is what it is.

al-laddin said:

HOOD, its hard to say, because its not that linear/logical. Extracts have a different effect. Everyone reacts different and finds some superior to others. But everyones cchemistry plays a huge role in this. I know you probably weren't looking for this answer but it is what it is.

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That answer was fine lol.
I decided to find out for myself, i got a 1 gram sample and took half. Practically no effects at the +1hr mark so took the other half.
Effects of the whole 1g of extract were comparable to about 10g of Bail or maybe even Red Vein Thai.
So I guess it was about 10x stronger. Price not worth it, but for those who dont like to swallow a shit load of powder i could see it having a use.
Personally, I'd stick to plain powdered leaf IMO.

Thanks for your help bro.

-HOOD

Am i seriously the only person who gets trouble sleeping and sleep disturbances from Kratom??

I simply CANNOT sleep on Kratom or if I have taken Kratom within the past few hours, and even last night when my last dosage wore off 4 hours before bedtime I ended up waking up multiple times in the night for progressed periods of time.

I also still can't ever be entirely sure how any dosage is going to make me feel, and even though Im getting better and better at avoiding dysphoria and getting more euphoria, I would still say that about 30% of the time I use Kratom I experience dysphoria by taking the wrong amount.

It seems like I am one of the few people who has these problems with Kratom and I just don't get it.

The reason I like Oxycodone/Hydrocodone better than Kratom is because it's SO much more PREDICTABLE..and also, I can sleep on it...however, I almost never take those drugs because they are so much worse for you than Kratom and just really not good to get heavily into.

But at least when I take Oxy/Hydro I KNOW for 100% fact I will be getting 100% euphoria and won't be having trouble sleeping aftwerwards.

With Kratom every single time it's a crap shoot...sometimes I get the amount right and have nice euphoria...sometimes I get it just SLIGHTLY off so I kind of sway between mild euphoria and mild dysphoria on and off at random intervals for hours....

Other times if I take too much I won't get speedy...but will experience HORRIBLE dysphoria and exhaustion for hours...

Then times like yesterday when I take too much instead I get SERIOUSLY speedy to an uncomfortable extent.

And then when I DO get high..there's really no telling whether or not the high will be more of a stimulant high or more of a depressant high....sometimes it's like 70% stimulant and 30% relaxnat...sometimes it'll be 40% stimulant and 60% relaxant or god even knows what ratio.....

If you talk to me on Kratom and ask me how I am feeling you could get a different answer literally based on the exact minute you ask me.

Ask me at 2:00PM and I'll tell you I have a nice stimulated euphoria, but ask me at 2:20 and I might be dysphoric...then ask me again 3:10 and I've got relaxed euphoria....15 mins later I'm speedy as hell....and ALWAYS knowing that I will have a HELL of a time falling and/or staying asleep once it's all over!!!

Does anyone else experience kratom as being this unpredicatable or does everyone else here just think kratom is this 100% predictable drug that always feels nice after which they just fall asleep and have a pleasant night's sleep?!?!