Lets all stop being so damn blasé about GHB

Gamma-Hydroxybutyrate (GHB) and its related counterparts 1,4-Butanediol (1,4B) and Gamma-Butyrolactone (GBL) have probably the smallest threshold to overdose ratio's of all the drugs we do. It usually comes as a clear or coloured liquid which can vary in concentration so greatly that sometimes you need 1ml and sometimes you need 15ml. By the time you get hold of it it's probably passed through 3 peoples hands, all of who might or might not have changed the concentration and sold it as something it's not.
Yet a whole lot of people seem to treat it like damn cordial.
In my opinion, "G" (the generic term for any of the three substances) is the most abused drug that those involved in the rave culture use. Of the other drugs that have a high potential for abuse, most ravers are either too scared to use it (heroin for example), or are relatively sensible about their usage. But G is something people just seem to take because it's there. When I was first exposed to it, the people that gave it to me made me read up about it first. Then they measured the dose calculated from my body weight, based on the fact that they knew the exact concentration because they mixed it themselves from the powdered salts. I don't really see that sort of care being taken very often anymore.
Here are some common dosage measurements (information from erowid):
Light --> 0.5 - 1.5 g
Common --> 1 - 2.5 g
Strong --> 2 - 3.5 g
Can induce heavy sleep --> 3 - 5 g
Overdose --> 5 - 10 g
Poisoning (Risk of Death)--> 10+ g
The above figures are grams of pure GHB powder. It is possible to dissolve 1 gram of GHB powder into less than 1ml of water. That means that you could potentially overdose on as little as 5ml of liquid GHB - and that's even for a large person.
Going around Melbourne at the moment I am aware of at least 3 different concentrations of G. There's some where you need to take 2.5ml, and there's a couple of concentrations where you need around 15. Then there's the matter of whether it's GHB, 14B, or GBL (nobody seems to know). And there's also the issue of how hard it is to accurately measure 2.5ml of liquid. Last weekend there were people measuring with a syringe (still for oral consumption obviously) - that was a very good idea and it a good step towards the safety measures we should be taking.
I know everything in this post has been said before. But I think it needs to be said again and again so everyone hears the message at least once. And please don't think I'm refering to anyone specifically - this has been on my mind for a long time. This is a good reminder for everyone who uses it.
Be fucking careful with G.
[ 11 February 2002: Message edited by: Pleonastic ]
[Edit: Fixed up a few GBHs]
[ 12 February 2002: Message edited by: BigTrancer ]

I'd really love to try maybe even abuse G, but i only know one person who can score it and he would probably down it all before it got to me- D*O*H! (Damn G Whores)
But yeah i agree with u it does seem to be highly dose dependant with many contraindictions and other variables that demand that GHB, GBL or 1,4B be treated with respect.
Although i'd still say pills are the most abused substance in raverland

Bumpity fucking bump.
Pleo, you make a very good point. However there are measuring cylinders that do measure 2.5ml, always make sure that u measure with the bottom of the miniscus on the measuring line. Also a word on redosing, a lot of things effect the way G comes on a good thing to remember is that if you've had a meal shortly before you've had a dose it does take awhile before the dose will come on, so please dont redose thinking theres nothing happening, I've seen too many people either throw up or pass out this way, keep in mind that even if you haven't eaten please WAIT before redosing.
Remember the rule of thumb, START LOW.

[ 11 February 2002: Message edited by: ruski ]

i know its probably not the MOST accurate but i've heard of too many ppl just using a tea spoon to measure...!?
If you can't be bothered using a small measuring beaker atleast use an eye dropper...you can get them anywhere. Im sure you can buy a eye dropper bottle from woolies with some sort of cough syrup or eye crap in it. But anyway... a standard glass eye dropper should always be around 1ml full. Never more. So try atleast just filling one and squirting into your mouth once at a time. One quirt should give enough for a decent hit each time you want some i guess. Anyway its better than guessing or teaspoons or sipping blah.
Hope that helps too...
Rob.

Squirting it into your mouth every now and then is almost as bad as swigging it out of the bottle! Unless the eye dropper has clearly marked standard metric units of measurement, that's still an extremely dangerous practice. The major problem here isn't really the dose measurement (although that still is a problem), but the fact that it's hard to keep track of the amount and times you dose up and the length of time between doses. Same goes for using bottle lids or various household spoons. If you don't use proper measuring equipment you're asking for trouble really - especially on the second dose where you need to measure even smaller amounts...
It's really important to measure every dose accurately, and if someone else pours it for you then always check the measurement before drinking.

I met yesterday with a Gold Coast harm minimisation group. It was stated that most of their illicit substance interventions are G related, not E, speed or smack.
So listen to Pleonastic, and accurately assess your dose requirements to your body weight if taking G chems.

Phase Dancer, I have found the Gold Coast clubbing community possibly the LEAST educated about G, despite the overdoses and deaths a few years ago. Alot of people call it "Fanta" (presumably a shortening of Fantasy- one of the original street names) and drink it with alcohol on the coast.
I totally agree with Pleonastic. In some ways I feel slightly guilty, as I was probably one of the people that bought GHB to the attention of the Aust BL board, with my ravings about it some 4 years ago. And I introduced many of the Melbourne Bluelight crew to it, where it spread throughout the community like wildfire.....
But it is a harsh lady. It will kick your ass. It has high abuse potential, and like other drugs, misuse will fuck you up.
Please be careful.
Know your dose.
Dilute your solution to avoid inaccuracies in dosing.
Never mix with other depressants.
Be careful dosing others.
[ 11 February 2002: Message edited by: pinger ]

A medicin measuring cup costs like $1 for almost all chemists. Oh and they don't question you purchasing either.

If the G u are getting has a suggested dose of 2.5ml the FIRST thing i would do is dilute it 1:10; thus making the suggested dose 25ml and easily measurable with say a cheap medicine glass as Airwalk suggested.
Only the most accurate graduated cylinders, that is those with volumes of only 10ml could do greater concentrations. Unless u know someone who works in biological science labs and could "obtain" u an automatic pipette capable of measuring to a tenth of a ml.
But screw all that difficulty, just dilute it.
Pleo: great post, but why the use of the acronym GBH a few times. Making a point or an oversight?
I always thought we frowned upon the use of GBH?

^^^^^
They're just typos - I thought I got rid of them all but obviously didn't...
BT seems to have fixed it... thanks!
[ 12 February 2002: Message edited by: Pleonastic ]

you can use baby medicine syringes that come from supermarkets to measure ya G, they come in 2packs one with a 10ml syringe and a 2ml syringe which makes measuring from 0.1ml and up easy and they cheap as shit, like 2bucks or somthin.
ya will never miss calculate a dose again and ya can suk it straight out the bottle no need for pouring.
They good
$h@n|<0$

You're local needle and syringe program can supply you with syringes for free! If your in Brisbane, pop into 185 Brunswick St in the Valley. They have three ml barrels...Just ask at the counter.
If you get syringes that have needles attached, you'll need to be aware of the unsafe needle disposal laws in your state.

Light --> 0.5 - 1.5 g
Common --> 1 - 2.5 g
Strong --> 2 - 3.5 g
Can induce heavy sleep --> 3 - 5 g
Overdose --> 5 - 10 g
Poisoning (Risk of Death)--> 10+ g
Sorry but i totally disagree. Depends on the person, so know your limits. There are people who can take 70g, and just sleep it off with no worries. Depends on your body.. Know your body..
Also..
ALCOHOL has the exact same "overdose" limits, if not even worse... Its just more diluted. Take twice the amount of a fun dose of alcohol and you'll see yourself in hospital. Take ten times the amount of K you usually do and head to the emergency room, same with pills, and most subtances. Its just easier to go over board with g in the form it comes in.. I suggest people should dilute there g to more like 100ml per dose or something in the realms of alcohol if they are worried.
And yes, There are a percentage of people the G will not agree with... Start off small. (more often its 14B that upsets peoples wagons than GHB though).
Real G it a completely harmless drug in you use it properly and know your body.
Chem

Sorry Chem,
I gotta call you out on this one: Normal people just don't take 70g of GHB. You post states this figure, which I believe to be an enormously exaggerated dose. There are many reports of GHB overdose, poisoning and coma on Erowid - most of the overdose stories where people have had to be hospitalised centre around the 10-15g dose region. Even in people who regularly take GHB with stimulants to the point where they are taking 10g doses due to ridiculous tolerances, a similar dose without stimulants is enough to put them into a coma.
In terms of toxic LD50, the accepted value (Merck Index entry) is around 2g/kg in male rats. This is very high, compared to anaesthetic doses and danger levels due to CNS depression. Humans have died from significantly smaller doses (relatively speaking). Even a dose of 10g is enough to make some people fall so deeply asleep that they stop breathing altogether.
In my opinion, if you take GHB and you fall asleep at all then you have had too much. The mere fact that you are not in control of your actions makes this high risk behaviour, and after you've fallen asleep you cannot look after yourself, so you become a burden on your friends. (One hopes that people would not be doing GHB alone).
BigTrancer
[ 14 February 2002: Message edited by: BigTrancer ]

This is especially more topical as a person at HWU was taken to hospital unconcious, convulsing from Overdosing on G accidentally.
Please take the knowledge in this thread given for good use..

Bumpity bump.