NEWS: News.com.au - 10/01/08 'Hmmm, did you call the dealer?'

Hmmm, did you call the dealer?
By staff writers
January 10, 2008 03:41pm

ECSTASY users will forget to do basic tasks - including taking drugs - because their memory will be so bad they would not be able remember simple plans, a new study suggests.

A team of researchers from the Australian Catholic University, led by Peter Rendell, has found that even the most infrequent users of ecstasy could lose their ability to remember tasks.

“When we have to remember actions/intentions for the future, such as remembering to take medicine, make a phone call or turn off appliances, we call that prospective memory,” Dr Rendell said.

“We know that ecstasy has a detrimental effect on our general recall of past events… but it also has a proven impact on our ability to remember regular and one-off tasks which still need to be done.”

The research, which appeared in the international Psychopharmacology journal, was based on a special board game that tested different types of prospective memory tasks.

According to the article, participants in the study who had used ecstasy had problems remembering both one-off and regular tasks.

“Prospective memory performance is sensitive to regular and even moderate ecstasy use,” Dr Rendell said.

“Importantly, ecstasy users experience generalised difficulties with prospective memory, suggesting that these deficits are likely to have important implications for day-to-day functioning.”

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News.com.au

There are 87 comments with this story too.

Once again, they bombard us drug takers with these studies, yet "in ya face" evidence, that being i and many 1000's of ecstasy users who show no symptoms still has no power in the public forum. I mean fuck, back in my day i was doing 4-5 pills a weekend, and that may not be much to some, but this study suggests very occasional use can cause this.

Fuck off.

Some of the comments on News.com.au are interesting, to the effect that the study can't be trusted because it's from Australian Catholic University, also not much has been said about how many people were involved in the study and what the parameters were.

"According to the article, participants in the study who had used ecstasy had problems remembering both one-off and regular tasks."

and this is what i hate about this sort of research.

maybe the memory recall of the average drug user IS sub par. shows absolutely nothing to prove that it was ecstacy that caused this. (although im not saying it doesn't affect your memory, im sure it does)
this is a bad example which may invalidate my point (but i'll say it anyway in an attempt to get my point across), but it's sort of like comparing people who sniff petrol to those who don't.
well i wouldn't be surprised if the people who sniffed petrol had significantly slower brains than others. as you are likely a complete moron in the first place if decide to take up the habbit.

it's pretty well beat into us (by the news and government) that recreational drugs are dangerous and will fuck you up, so perhaps the more intelligent people are more likely to listen to these messages, and play it safe. of course most of us here like to enjoy ourselves at same time as minimising harm to our bodies and minds, and we can fortunately strive to do this by researching the net and discussing things on the board etc....

dunno just some thoughts...

Okay I stopped at Australian Catholic University... are you fucking serious. I am not reading this and besides the memory loss studies have been beaten to death 100 times over, I found my memory recovers after a while after abusing any drug.. it seems abusing any drug makes u stutter, lose vocabulary, basically drop a few IQ points, and lose short term memory etc.. and usually comes back after u stop.

*unzip* heres your holy water A.C.U

Splatt said:

*unzip* heres your holy water A.C.U

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lol

When I started reading this I thought they meant forgetting shit while munted, brought back memories of trying to do an IQ test at a mates place after a big night out. It went read question, read first answer, read second answer, forget question and start again never did make it past the first question.

I do tend to forget stuff, always have though - its hard to judge these things but haven't noticed any significant changes since I started doing drugs regularly.

Well Ive taken for over 20 years and I dont forget anything. Now what was I doing again? lol

I have access to that journal so will take a look at the original article and give you a verdict on the standard of it.... btw it's a respectable journal, I don't think they would be accepting complete sillyness there, but you always have to have your critical hat on when assessing these sorts of findings!

Monday morning can be a little tough but by Tuesday I'm back at full form at work and I'm still top of my team despite what ever trouble I get up to on the wknd.

Case by case, I know it used to screw with my long term memory a lot but who really needs to remember high school anyway

This is fucking hilarious! :D And even more so because there has been the odd occasion where I've forgotten to take my next pill cos I was already fairly chopped


I had no idea an Australian Catholic University even existed. Enough said

Mr TIMO said:

it's pretty well beat into us (by the news and government) that recreational drugs are dangerous and will fuck you up, so perhaps the more intelligent people are more likely to listen to these messages, and play it safe.

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You can't be serious 8( Not investigating these things and making up your own opinion is one of the most unintelligent things you can do, IMHO.

So you haven't had any short term memory problems from MDMA use Nicky? What about your friends?

I've noticed with myself and quite a few friends that our memory's don't seem to be as good as when we started taking pills. Some of those people smoke weed though so that could be a factor.


Just because you didn't know the Australian Catholic University doesn't mean their findings should be dismissed. Although I'm skeptical I don't know anything about them.

^ I've had plenty of short term memory problems. Did I imply that I hadn't?
Short term memory problems are short term memory problems, ie. They'd never last longer than a week in my experience. But I'm not a heavy user. Friends are the same. As far as I know anyway.

ECSTASY users will forget to do basic tasks - including taking drugs -

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hmm... im pretty sure that statement is completley self defeating: if you forget to take drugs then you are clearly no longer a drug user...

I hope more of these articles come out, push the *average joe* away from drug use, and leave the individuals who choose to take them in the loop.

Why try and get more and more into it? (its what alot of people seem to be trying to do... mainstream it...) Let everyone make their own mind up, including, the people who did these "tests" :D (oh cmon, wouldnt you love to be in one of them?, *now take these pills, and try and act completely normal* lol)

CozmoNz said:

I hope more of these articles come out, push the *average joe* away from drug use, and leave the individuals who choose to take them in the loop.

Why try and get more and more into it? (its what alot of people seem to be trying to do... mainstream it...) Let everyone make their own mind up, including, the people who did these "tests" :D (oh cmon, wouldnt you love to be in one of them?, *now take these pills, and try and act completely normal* lol)

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We need LESS bullshit articles like these are MORE truthful articles about drug use.

The more people that do drugs, the greater the chance of getting drugs legalised in the future.

Something to remember in this situation is that the way results are depicted in a news article aren't necessarily an accurate portrayal of the project itself. Checking out the source directly is always a good idea - if possible.

I've found the source article:
Rendell, P. G., Gray, T. J., Henry, J. D., & Tolan, A. (2007). Prospective memory impairment in "ecstasy" (MDMA) users. Psychopharmacology, 194(4), 497-504.

Abstract:

RATIONALE: Considerable research indicates that "ecstasy" users perceive their memory for future intentions (prospective memory) to be impaired. However, only one empirical study to date has directly tested how this capacity is affected by ecstasy use, and this study provided relatively limited information regarding the extent, scope, or implications of problems experienced. OBJECTIVES: The present study assessed prospective performance on a laboratory measure of prospective memory that closely represents the types of prospective memory tasks that actually occur in everyday life and provides an opportunity to investigate the different sorts of prospective memory failures that occur ("Virtual Week"). METHOD: Ecstasy user group (27 current users and 34 nonusers) was between participants, and prospective memory task (regular, irregular, time-check) was within participants. A measure sensitive to specific aspects of psychopathology was also administered. RESULTS: Ecstasy users were significantly impaired on Virtual Week, and these deficits were of a comparable magnitude irrespective of the specific prospective memory task demands. The pattern of results was unchanged after controlling for marijuana use, level of psychopathology, and sleep quality. Further, prospective memory was shown to be significantly impaired for both relatively infrequent and relatively frequent ecstasy users, although for the latter group the magnitude of this deficit was greater. CONCLUSIONS: Prospective memory performance is sensitive to regular and even moderate ecstasy use. Importantly, ecstasy users experience generalized difficulties with prospective memory, suggesting that these deficits are likely to have important implications for day-to-day functioning.

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Download full text pdf here

I've just had a read over it, not in any great detail, but it certainly seems like a legitimate project. They have certainly made an effort to account for other reasons for the memory deficits in the ecstasy using group, by controlling for current psycho-pathology (eg. depression, psychosis, mental illness) and cannabis/marijuana use. They still found that people using ecstasy fortnightly or more often had greater memory deficits than people using ecstasy monthly or less often, who had greater deficits than non-users.

Two criticisms/comments:

1. This seemed like a problem to me: "To ensure participants’ responses were not influenced by acute effects of ecstasy, both users and nonusers agreed to abstain from taking ecstasy (or any other drugs) for at least 48 h before testing." I'd say they should have asked them to refrain for at least 7 days - people could be at the come-down point here and this would be reflected in the results! It's not clear whether 'other drugs' includes alcohol and prescribed psych drugs, as this would also be important.

2. I'd be interested in knowing whether the memory deficits they found in their testing actually translate to perceived problems for the research participants - ie. do they think they have memory problems or is it not really a problem for them? This is not really the question the researchers are trying to answer, but I think it is very important. Are the memory deficits "clinically significant" or are they just statistically significant?

To conclude, the research is legitimate, as you would expect in this kind of journal. As usual, journalists have spun it out a bit - I agree with previous poster, how can these people be drug users if they forget their next pill But I think we all have to admit, ecstasy/MDMA is not really a good drug for enhancing one's memory I often wonder what types of brains our generation will have in a couple of decades.......!

Tronica said:

I often wonder what types of brains our generation will have in a couple of decades.......!

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I too think the same thing

I've done my fair share of partying, but i've never ever acted/spoken/looked like some of the e-tards i see on the scene these days.

*shudder*

Personally, I always found it amsuing having no short term memory after using a lot of pills. I haven't taken a pill for over 3 years, and whilst I've had a lot of psychedelics, my memory has increased and expanded in some arenas; mainly in my ability to recall, in detail, scenes from long ago. That said, I think smoking pot defintely scatters your memory around heaps more, I often trail of mid-sentence; maybe I'll think of something completely different or just los all memory of what I was about to say. It doesn't bother me as such but gets annoying for people around me, generally as I will interupt them five minutes later excitedly remembering what it was....

NickyJ said:

You can't be serious 8( Not investigating these things and making up your own opinion is one of the most unintelligent things you can do, IMHO.

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ummm yeah, not sure what you're getting at, you may have misinterpreted what i said or meant (understandable because it was pretty incoherent)
Im saying that maybe there are the 'intelligent' people, who listen to what the governement tries to teach you about drug use, and rather than doing their own research on recreational drugs, they just play it safe and just steer clear of drugs.
making up an opinion in such a way doesn't seem that dumb to me. what you don't touch can't harm you right?
if you don't plan to take recreational drugs, and they don't interest you, why would you waste time researching them?
Now at the same time, there are the equally intelligent people who as you say, do their own proper research and come to their own conclusions on what is ok and what is not. I think this is purely a curiosity thing, nothing to do with intelligence.
Of course when you decide to take drugs, then yes you can make a statement like that, but if you choose not to i think not.
really not sure where we're gong with this...