lazyvegan
Bluelighter
- Joined
- Jan 31, 2003
- Messages
- 1,660
MEMANTINE - First Time- A few words of caution...!
Well this is the final version of this report includuding additional commentaries from my original posting in the 'Psychedelics' forum a few months back, so I figured this finished version deserved a place in 'this' forum for those you who may one day be searching for info on this obscure, desirable chemical. Erowid hasn't got it posted yet, but I did manage to get it published in the last version of the Entheogon Review. Anyways all, enjoy. And BE SAFE!!!!! Peace.
Memantine - A Few Words of Caution
In the interest of harm reduction, I feel compelled to write this report. I have determined that Memantine is indeed an active substance. I have also discovered that there are some potential dangers involved when experimenting with this chemical that I feel the need to address. I would not want anyone else to unintentionally realize the undesirable effects of taking multiple doses of this drug without previous knowledge of the possible consequences. There are some potentially serious complications that could occur when experimenting with high doses of this molecule. If you comprehend the technical jargon, then this is how it has since been explained to me by a more knowledgable soul than I...
-------------
"The problem with Memantine is it's slow absorption and excretion. It is not metabolized, but slowly excreted with urine. In clinical applications there is a large accumulation of Memantine with only one dose per day. If you are taking a large dose it will take some time until it hits you, and the effect is prolonged, because it remains in the body for a very long time (t1/2 is 60 to 100h). Taking large doses daily is probably not a good idea."
-------------
Needless to say I learned this lesson the hard way. Plain and simple, I am at +48 hours and still feeling the effects of 4 compounded doses.
Now on to the good stuff...
I have found that 50-100 mg/Oral is acceptable for a pleasant evening if you can wait 1-3 hours for full effects to manifest. One of my first, single-dose experiences was at this level, and I noticed very few lingering effects 24 hours later. This leads me to believe that perhaps single doses via oral administration may prove to be the best way to experience this substance.
On the other hand, 50-100 mg/IM (50mg/Ml) presents a stinging, itchy, burning sensation in human tissue, which eventually gives way to a very pleasant, comfortable feeling in the human mind and body. For 5-6 hours, I noticed similarities to both Ketamine and Methylone. Reluctantly, but at the insistence of my tripping partner, I decided to attempt multiple dosing. My friend C and I have had incompatible schedules lately, which do not allow us the luxury of shared tripping time. Seeing as how we might not have the opportunity to explore this molecule together again for some time, but against my intuition and better judgement, we redosed 4 times over the course of the next 7-8 hours, at levels ranging from 50 to 100 mg/IM.
This turned out to be a bad idea. C had obligations yesterday that she was unable to fufill do to lingering effects and the inability to drive a car. She was reluctantly able to perform some of them today, although she re-dosed with much smaller amounts than I. On the other hand, I am still feeling pretty 'warbled out' at +48 hours, with pending obligations later this evening.
Definite similarities were noted to low doses of Ketamine, but at no point did I ever experience anything that I would even remotely compare to a breakthrough IM-Ketamine experience. At least not at these levels. Other than the fact they are both NMDA-antagonists, similarities would be that they share the same type of body signature, driving energy, and inability to sleep. I find that when taken at these levels, Memantine provides a very comfortable, desirable effect, that resonates nicely in my body and mind.
I would not recommend IM administration of this chemical for two reasons. Firstly, the vast majority of this substance commonly available is in a pre-packaged pill form that likely contains binders or other impurities which you would not want to inject into your body. Secondly, there is a definite stinging sensation when taking Memantine intermuscularly . It irritates the tissue at the injection point, leaving an itchy red bump, similar to a bee-sting, that eventually subsides over the course of a few hours, although the pain should be gone within 10-20 minutes.
Additionally, it does not seem that this chemical is readily soluble in water. I was able to to mix 50 mg. of Memantine HCl into 1 Ml of dH2O after applying light heat to increase solubility. If one does not mind waiting a few hours for the effects to be felt, and due to the pain involved with IM administration, I believe oral administration might be the preferred method at 50+ mg. I would also like to add that I tried insufflating a 10 mg. line at one point during one of my original experiments. Needless to say I only managed to snort about 5 mg. before I realized it burned. A lot. I thoroughly regretted even attempting such a thing. It was very uncomfortable to say the least.
Well, it is now +66 hours, and we are both still feeling pretty warbly, although improving. Multilple doses are definitely not recommended unless you have A LOT of spare time on your hands. The overall experience could be considered rather subtle by some standards, and one might feel compelled to take multiple doses. Be aware of these possible consequences if you choose to do so. And the experience, although highly enjoyable, doesn't really break into uncharted territory. So is the ride worth the ticket price?. The jury is still out on that one.
It has also come to my attention that it is possible to clear the human body of Memantine faster by acidyfing one's urine. Apparently, drinking cranberry juice can also aid in this process, but here is what I have been told by someone more knowledgable than I...
---------
"This is how you can get the Memantine out of your system quickly. Try to acidify your urine, that way Memantine is eliminated 7-10 times faster. There are prescription-free medications available to acidify the urine, for example pills containing Methionine, which are used to prevent bladder infections."
----------
I have just awoken at +90 hours, and I think I'm finally pretty much back to baseline. I feel it is inevitable that someone else is going to attempt experiments with this compound in the future, do to the fact that it's potential recreational value is being freely discussed on the internet, and coupled with the fact that it has recently been approved as a prescription medication by governments worldwide. It would be a real shame for someone to experiment with multiple and/or high doses of this chemical, without realizing the potential dangers involved. If it were, for example, crucial that one should drive a car or perform other obligations 24-72 hours into the experience, I would not want anyone else to be unknowingly forced into such a situation.
Let this also be a lesson to other intrepid psychonauts who attempt experiments with high doses of relatively unresearched substances. I have definitely learned my lesson. It is possible to reasonably predict the actions of some of these chemicals with a bit of foresight, but the ability to do so is unfortunately not one that I possess. I feel pretty irresponsible at this point in time, due to the fact that, although I dedicated much time to researching the properties of this drug before consuming it, I was unable to foresee this unexpected turn of events. I sincerely hope this report helps someone avoid a potentially hazardous situation in the future, and I share this information only because I feel it is inevitable that it will soon be noticed that this molecule has potential recreational value. Peace. Go Vegan.
Lazyvegan
2/2004
Memantine - A Few Words of Caution
Well this is the final version of this report includuding additional commentaries from my original posting in the 'Psychedelics' forum a few months back, so I figured this finished version deserved a place in 'this' forum for those you who may one day be searching for info on this obscure, desirable chemical. Erowid hasn't got it posted yet, but I did manage to get it published in the last version of the Entheogon Review. Anyways all, enjoy. And BE SAFE!!!!! Peace.
Memantine - A Few Words of Caution
In the interest of harm reduction, I feel compelled to write this report. I have determined that Memantine is indeed an active substance. I have also discovered that there are some potential dangers involved when experimenting with this chemical that I feel the need to address. I would not want anyone else to unintentionally realize the undesirable effects of taking multiple doses of this drug without previous knowledge of the possible consequences. There are some potentially serious complications that could occur when experimenting with high doses of this molecule. If you comprehend the technical jargon, then this is how it has since been explained to me by a more knowledgable soul than I...
-------------
"The problem with Memantine is it's slow absorption and excretion. It is not metabolized, but slowly excreted with urine. In clinical applications there is a large accumulation of Memantine with only one dose per day. If you are taking a large dose it will take some time until it hits you, and the effect is prolonged, because it remains in the body for a very long time (t1/2 is 60 to 100h). Taking large doses daily is probably not a good idea."
-------------
Needless to say I learned this lesson the hard way. Plain and simple, I am at +48 hours and still feeling the effects of 4 compounded doses.
Now on to the good stuff...
I have found that 50-100 mg/Oral is acceptable for a pleasant evening if you can wait 1-3 hours for full effects to manifest. One of my first, single-dose experiences was at this level, and I noticed very few lingering effects 24 hours later. This leads me to believe that perhaps single doses via oral administration may prove to be the best way to experience this substance.
On the other hand, 50-100 mg/IM (50mg/Ml) presents a stinging, itchy, burning sensation in human tissue, which eventually gives way to a very pleasant, comfortable feeling in the human mind and body. For 5-6 hours, I noticed similarities to both Ketamine and Methylone. Reluctantly, but at the insistence of my tripping partner, I decided to attempt multiple dosing. My friend C and I have had incompatible schedules lately, which do not allow us the luxury of shared tripping time. Seeing as how we might not have the opportunity to explore this molecule together again for some time, but against my intuition and better judgement, we redosed 4 times over the course of the next 7-8 hours, at levels ranging from 50 to 100 mg/IM.
This turned out to be a bad idea. C had obligations yesterday that she was unable to fufill do to lingering effects and the inability to drive a car. She was reluctantly able to perform some of them today, although she re-dosed with much smaller amounts than I. On the other hand, I am still feeling pretty 'warbled out' at +48 hours, with pending obligations later this evening.
Definite similarities were noted to low doses of Ketamine, but at no point did I ever experience anything that I would even remotely compare to a breakthrough IM-Ketamine experience. At least not at these levels. Other than the fact they are both NMDA-antagonists, similarities would be that they share the same type of body signature, driving energy, and inability to sleep. I find that when taken at these levels, Memantine provides a very comfortable, desirable effect, that resonates nicely in my body and mind.
I would not recommend IM administration of this chemical for two reasons. Firstly, the vast majority of this substance commonly available is in a pre-packaged pill form that likely contains binders or other impurities which you would not want to inject into your body. Secondly, there is a definite stinging sensation when taking Memantine intermuscularly . It irritates the tissue at the injection point, leaving an itchy red bump, similar to a bee-sting, that eventually subsides over the course of a few hours, although the pain should be gone within 10-20 minutes.
Additionally, it does not seem that this chemical is readily soluble in water. I was able to to mix 50 mg. of Memantine HCl into 1 Ml of dH2O after applying light heat to increase solubility. If one does not mind waiting a few hours for the effects to be felt, and due to the pain involved with IM administration, I believe oral administration might be the preferred method at 50+ mg. I would also like to add that I tried insufflating a 10 mg. line at one point during one of my original experiments. Needless to say I only managed to snort about 5 mg. before I realized it burned. A lot. I thoroughly regretted even attempting such a thing. It was very uncomfortable to say the least.
Well, it is now +66 hours, and we are both still feeling pretty warbly, although improving. Multilple doses are definitely not recommended unless you have A LOT of spare time on your hands. The overall experience could be considered rather subtle by some standards, and one might feel compelled to take multiple doses. Be aware of these possible consequences if you choose to do so. And the experience, although highly enjoyable, doesn't really break into uncharted territory. So is the ride worth the ticket price?. The jury is still out on that one.
It has also come to my attention that it is possible to clear the human body of Memantine faster by acidyfing one's urine. Apparently, drinking cranberry juice can also aid in this process, but here is what I have been told by someone more knowledgable than I...
---------
"This is how you can get the Memantine out of your system quickly. Try to acidify your urine, that way Memantine is eliminated 7-10 times faster. There are prescription-free medications available to acidify the urine, for example pills containing Methionine, which are used to prevent bladder infections."
----------
I have just awoken at +90 hours, and I think I'm finally pretty much back to baseline. I feel it is inevitable that someone else is going to attempt experiments with this compound in the future, do to the fact that it's potential recreational value is being freely discussed on the internet, and coupled with the fact that it has recently been approved as a prescription medication by governments worldwide. It would be a real shame for someone to experiment with multiple and/or high doses of this chemical, without realizing the potential dangers involved. If it were, for example, crucial that one should drive a car or perform other obligations 24-72 hours into the experience, I would not want anyone else to be unknowingly forced into such a situation.
Let this also be a lesson to other intrepid psychonauts who attempt experiments with high doses of relatively unresearched substances. I have definitely learned my lesson. It is possible to reasonably predict the actions of some of these chemicals with a bit of foresight, but the ability to do so is unfortunately not one that I possess. I feel pretty irresponsible at this point in time, due to the fact that, although I dedicated much time to researching the properties of this drug before consuming it, I was unable to foresee this unexpected turn of events. I sincerely hope this report helps someone avoid a potentially hazardous situation in the future, and I share this information only because I feel it is inevitable that it will soon be noticed that this molecule has potential recreational value. Peace. Go Vegan.
Lazyvegan
2/2004
Memantine - A Few Words of Caution
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