Why do you like dissociatives?

[belligerent drunk]

I haven't really come across a thread discussing why people enjoy doing dissociatives. Obviously not many people do dissociatives regularly, but some people like myself do. In this thread I will mainly focus on PCP/PCE analogues because I haven't done ketamine, but any NMDA antagonist dissociative is good to discuss: ketamine, DXM, PCP, x-PCPs, PCE (does anyone use it?) x-PCEs, x-PCMs etc; salvia doesn't count as it's not an NMDAR antagonist.

What you should mention is how often you use your disso of choice (how many times per day, days per week/month), ROA, average dosages, what positive effects you enjoy it for, and what negative effects you have noticed during your use.

I shall begin. I mainly use 3-MeO-PCP and 3-MeO-PCE. My favourite disso is 3-HO-PCP, but the vendor selling it has shut down, so I'm sticking with 3-MeO-PCP at the moment.

3-MeO-PCP/3-MeO-PCP will be described as the same as they're quite similar, although the PCP is more potent. Usual dosages range from 10 to 30 mg for PCP and 20 to 40 mg for PCE depending on tolerance. Rectal ROA. First effects appear at the 5 minute mark, full effects by 20 minutes. Effects last for 4-6 hours. Mainly I like them for the mood lift and energy boost, vision enhancement, antidepressant effects, and pain relief. The pain relief is really nice and somewhat different from that of opioids - stronger even. One of the really positive aspects of dissos for me is that they produce no physical dependence. I can stop at any time and feel no withdrawal effects or physical cravings. Of course, psychologically they're pretty addictive exactly because of the plethora of positive effects and lack of negatives.

As for negatives, the main is the inability to fall asleep. I find it almost impossible to fall asleep unless 3-4 hours since last dose have passed if I don't have any benzos or alcohol. Obviously this is, on the other hand, useful in the morning as a wakefulness promoting agent. The other strongly negative aspect is that they make me stoned. I'm mostly very functional on them, but sometimes I exceed my normal dosage and then I will appear pretty intoxicated to someone who knows what to look for - my wife for example. That perhaps is the single most unpleasant adverse effect of dissos IMO.

My frequency of use is 2-4 doses per day, practically every day until I run out. I almost always use 1 g at a time, which lasts for about 10 days for me. Then I take a break of 2-10 weeks to lower tolerance and give it a little bit of a rest, and resume. So far I've found them to be largely beneficial to my well-being after having used them for almost 3 years.

Looking forward to your replies.

 

[Ketamania]

DXM and Ketamine.

400-1000mg of DXM with approximately 3 weeks between each trip. I enjoy the dissociated and euphoric feeling it gives me. I have also noticed that it will also act as a anti-depressant for a couple weeks afterwards. As for negatives, those gel capsules can put your stomach through hell. I consider it a worthy exchange though.

As for Ketamine, not very often. 30mg-100mg (just depending on how far I want to go). It is rare to come by where I live. However, the couple times I have done it is has been nothing short of amazing. Negatives-the fear of kidney damage for sure.

I am definelty planning on diving deeper into the dissociative world with some other compounds as I come across them.

 

[LucidSDreamr]

I used to use MXE, then 3meo, then ketamine. Pretty moderatedly regular use.

Injected a lot of them each bot aslo used orally

No negative hangover effects, one of the things that made them so alluring and versatile. But the use eventually caused interstitial cystitis (bladder damage). I was in suicidal pain for months and now i have to take a medicine just because of it. I can never do them again. Along with alcohol and really spicy food. Stims i havn't even touched since having this problem but i would imagine they will cause problems now that i've damaged myself

 

[Patrickforsterter]

Is dxm one? Cuus I like love dxm

 

[Help?!?!]

Many reasons. I love them. Probably my because I attribute them and psychedelics for helping to save my life. They could allow me to completely disconnect from the harsh world, dive deeply into myself, and realize everything's okay, I'm okay. It centers me and instills a deep sense of peace. It helps me realize that no matter what happens, I'll be okay even if it takes time, and work. Then their also just astoundingly interesting. Unlike any other drug but with facets of effects very similar to many drugs yet still unique. This is really a short hand version because I'm not in the mood to type to much. Methoxatmine is my favorite drug and I've tried many. My count in the DC "How many drugs gave you taken?" thread was something like 125 two or three years ago. I would take 125mgs of pure MXE in a 3ml 25g IM syringe over anything like pure heroin etc if I some how had the chance and had to choose.

 

[Cream Gravy?]

I've only tried MXE and nitrous.

MXE is akin to LSD in that it awakens something in me that I can only refer to as religious realizations. It's like it connects everything somehow. No other drug has 'taken me places' so to speak. There was a year when I was a senior in college, where I took MXE at least twice a week, sometimes more. I'd even choose to hole over going to drink with friends. It had very little side effects or hangover. I spent an entire summer German class holing at night, and I would actually learn German better the next day (at the intermediate, conversational level).

If I could get one drug in massive quantities for life, I would likely choose MXE. Even over LSD, or weed, or hydrocodone... MXE is somethin' else.

 

[Transcendence]

Total relief from the human condition

 

[belligerent drunk]

I've only tried MXE and nitrous.

MXE is akin to LSD in that it awakens something in me that I can only refer to as religious realizations. It's like it connects everything somehow. No other drug has 'taken me places' so to speak. There was a year when I was a senior in college, where I took MXE at least twice a week, sometimes more. I'd even choose to hole over going to drink with friends. It had very little side effects or hangover. I spent an entire summer German class holing at night, and I would actually learn German better the next day (at the intermediate, conversational level).

If I could get one drug in massive quantities for life, I would likely choose MXE. Even over LSD, or weed, or hydrocodone... MXE is somethin' else.

Unfortunately MXE had already been banned when I got into dissos. Would have loved to try that one judging from all the glowing reports and so on. Although I find 3-HO-PCP amazing as well. It allowed me to kick a very heavy codeine habit (1000 mg per day) CT without much discomfort. It's really something else compared to 3-MeO-PCP, 3-MeO-PCE, and O-PCE.

 

[envoy]

i never understood how people liked these. they don't give any pleasure just a weird feeling that you're not yourself.

 

[Ketamania]

i never understood how people liked these. they don't give any pleasure just a weird feeling that you're not yourself.

That is a part of what is so enjoyable about dissociatives. They allow you to escape from reality and have time to reset and have introspection. They literally made me a happier person.

But it I guess not everyone likes dissociatives

 

[Cream Gravy?]

^^It's like how people who don't get frequent anxiety don't understand why valium is so fun. Some of us really like to explore other realities. Realities where we are not ourselves. Realities where we can look at ourselves and figure out ways to become different.

MXE used to give me the best physical pleasure though as well, something akin to nodding on opioids.

 

[Vastness]

I have tried a fair few dissociatives but have used Ketamine the most, honestly nothing has ever quite compared to Ketamine for me, and I have found that unfortunately, even Ketamine has lost it's magic for me now.

I used DXM a couple of times in the form of cough syrup when I was younger, but probably only low, first plateau dosages and before I could really appreciate the finer nuances of individual drugs so I don't have too much to say about that. After this, ketamine was the next dissociative I used and I would still say that it probably remains my favourite dissociative, however I did not truly appreciate it until I discovered the K-hole... I still remember my first K-hole and it was one of the most fully immersive, profound feeling journies that I have ever experienced on a substance... and this was and remains probably the thing that I most enjoy about dissociatives, specifically ketamine, that I have yet to experience with any other drug. That they can truly transport you to somewhere else - and, at the same time, allow you to retain enough mental lucidity to properly appreciate the bizarre and wondrous nature of this scenario. I just love that feeling of looking around mid-hole, on some level aware I am sitting in quite familiar surroundings (probably just my front room in my flat) but suddenly being somewhere else. In my earlier days as well, the places I would visit felt like truly special, sacred places, with an otherworldly beauty, and that I was truly privileged to be allowed to visit.

Since coming to appreciate K-holing I've also been able to appreciate lower doses of K as well, the oncoming body buzz, light euphoria, sensations of acceleration whenever I'd close my eyes... but some of this may be down to the anticipation of the K-hole that is to come.

My pattern of usage has generally been a few grams at a time, every couple of months. I actually worked out, out of interest, quite recently that in the past 5 years I have used about ~60g of Ketamine total. About 5 years before that I used another 10g or so over maybe a year (but during this time I used it quite differently, mostly in lower dosages and in social settings). I have always insufflated, and apart from a brief couple of months at the beginning of this most recent 5 year span when I used mostly with my girlfriend at the time, I have pretty much always used it alone.

Over this time however I believe negatives have become more apparent. For a start, the holes themselves have become less and less profound and beautiful, replaced instead with repetitive, confusing, and quite empty journeys. The comedown has also got worse - at first, I did not even feel ketamine had a comedown but now the resultant NMDA rebound is distinctly uncomfortable, a really scattered, edgy state of mind with too much restless, nervous energy to sleep, and a desire to just keep doing K if it is around to stave off this feeling - it's still nowhere near as bad as, for example, a cocaine comedown, but it is not pleasant, in a way that it never used to be.

Obviously the bladder dangers are no small thing either - while I have been lucky enough not to experience any lasting damage, I have had a few bladder "scares" starting this year, and bizarrely this did not stop me from using K ever again, although it did make me try to several times (just flushed a bag for the third and hopefully last time recently). This brings me to the other major negative in my view - it is addictive, and in a very subtle way. Finally, my main gripe with K and in fact probably most of the dissociative class (at least in the way I do them) is that I think there is just very little that is truly positive about them. I just find it hard to see that the dissociative state is a healthy state to induce psychologically. While other classical and non-dissociative psychedelics can (I believe) probably be said to have the potential for lasting benefits, it is my view now that dissociatives just pretend to have the same depth as other psychedelics but in fact these depths are just empty and devoid of any true meaning, or even if they do have any meaning, the dissociative state itself inhibits any meaningful lessons from being brought back from the depths of a hole. In my own experience, I have found more and more that my mood is negatively affected in the days after a dissociative binge, and in retrospect I believe this was likely always the case - except perhaps in the very early days - but the changes were subtle enough to just write off or try to ignore.




All that said - I am still a fan of dissociatives, at least for the immediate effects they induce, although I can say pretty confidently at this point I think that I do not believe ketamine has brought anything positive to my life, and therefore I am going to do my best not to it again - at least not for a very long time. I would like to believe that there is a dissociative with less dangers, less negatives, and that is a little less empty, but I have not found one yet.

MXE I used a few times back when it was more available but did not enjoy it. Overall confusing, dysphoric, and just colder than Ketamine although I did find that in combination with K it could lead to some quite mindblowing trips.

3-MeO-PCP was an interesting and unusual experience but the line between an enjoyable experience and existential terror is just too fine, used about 250mg over a couple of weeks and have no desire to get any more.

2-OxO-PCM I found to be basically like Ketamine, but the long comedown is just ridiculous and, in my view, trashes the already uncomfortable reintegration process further. I also found this to induce bladder symptoms far more quickly than I have ever experienced so I will not be using this again.

I just recently acquired some Ephenidine having read good things about it and wanting to try out a non-arylcyclohexylamine dissociative. Unfortunately however I find that the multi-hour come-up and long duration are not things I look for in dissociatives. Because dissociatives can be so physically disabling (or, if not, just practically disabling as far as your ability to do normal things goes) I find such a long duration to be a little anxiogenic after a while. Unfortunately I also found the comedown to be very similar if just a little less intense to that of a solid K-binge, which leads me to think this may be something that is just a general feature of NMDA-antagonists and somewhat puts me off further experimentation with this class... I did not really manage to hole so far, but my impression is that any hole on Ephenidine would be a little plainer, less visual, and probably also less lucid and just more mentally confusing than a K-hole.

So yeah, in summary I find dissociatives to be fun drugs but ultimately a little frustrating.

 

[4meSM]

i never understood how people liked these. they don't give any pleasure just a weird feeling that you're not yourself.

I feel the same way, but I do understand why some people might like them. I enjoy psychedelics, empathogens, exploring different states of consciousness, etc... And pretty much every other major class of drugs but dissociatives.
Ketamine in particular gives me anxiety and makes me feel very uncomfortable.

 

[EphemeralOutlet141]

BD you know of my love for dissos haha.

I like them because to me, they're the only drug that you can completely remove yourself from reality on and essentially visit a "new" one. Besides very high dose Ibogaine or traditional psychs but not my thing really. They're the most reality bending to me, and I very much enjoy the relaxing effects that come with many dissos.

Every "hole" experience I had was a beautiful cosmic one that I enjoyed for what felt like forever. Probably the same tendency that got me into opioids, only that was a much more insidious and harmful one.

 

[belligerent drunk]

I feel the same way, but I do understand why some people might like them. I enjoy psychedelics, empathogens, exploring different states of consciousness, etc... And pretty much every other major class of drugs but dissociatives.
Ketamine in particular gives me anxiety and makes me feel very uncomfortable.

Dissociatives are exceptionally good anxiolytics for me, and I know for many other people. In terms of their usefulness for mind exploration, I feel they're on par with psychedelics. You can easily have a psychedelic-esque trip without the visuals on dissociatives. They also make everything much more interesting, as well as enhancing my vision so much that it's actually one of my favourite aspects of dissos. Oh, and no withdrawals (or in fact any other perceivable negative physical health consequences). Oh, and great analgesics. Hard not to love them considering all this. However, I understand that not everyone feels the same way. In fact, my best friend doesn't like dissociatives at all (he's tried O-PCE and 3-MeO-PCE), because it makes him too inebriated.

---------------------------------------

Is there anybody who uses dissos at low-medium doses here? I personally never go to P-hole doses. I maintain my doses low enough for me to be able to go anywhere - public like shops etc, seeing relatives and so on. Maybe it's because I need to tend to my wife and baby at all times that I can't be noticeably intoxicated. And no, don't worry, I actually function as a parent much better on dissos because of significantly increased tolerance to whining from the baby.

 

[Ketamania]

Is there anybody who uses dissos at low-medium doses here? I personally never go to P-hole doses. I maintain my doses low enough for me to be able to go anywhere - public like shops etc, seeing relatives and so on. Maybe it's because I need to tend to my wife and baby at all times that I can't be noticeably intoxicated. And no, don't worry, I actually function as a parent much better on dissos because of significantly increased tolerance to whining from the baby.

I only take high doses on occasion, the rest of the time it is a low/medium dose. It is certainly not good for your health or tolerance to just get blasted all the time. Plus, I think it is more fun to save the high doses for special occasions.

Also, lol on the increased tolerance to the baby.

 

[F.U.B.A.R.]

Only had MXE and nitrous oxide in the dissociative class. I personally think nitrous is a bit shit, but MXE is one of the most awesome drugs ever developed. Fuckin weird shit tbh, but it could give me every drug experience possible depending upon dose and ROA. However, things could get very heavy with strong doses and I thought I would never return on several occasions - though the dissociative effects meant that I didn't really give a fuck - unlike classic psychedelics where I'd probably have a total freakout.

I often ended up in majestic blue/black landscapes surrounded by invisible angels blowing trumpets while I was being pulled apart pixel by pixel by mechanoids...

 

[SadLobbyist]

Dissociatives make everything "still" and dreamlike. This sounds ridiculous, but they allow me to choose my mood, to a degree, and they make me appreciate music, art, etc. more than any other drug.

Also, yeah, they're incredibly anxiolytic for me. A lot of my social anxiety comes from the sensory barrage one must sustain in most public places, and dissociatives sort of shield me from that immediate panic response.

 

[treezy z]

I used to like them for giving me super powers and making me fearless in dangerous situations.

Now I'm not doing them but recently wasn't getting the super powers as much (good high though.)

 

[Transcendence]

I will say that in addition to powerful (albeit short-term) anxiety relief, I've yet to sample a drug legal or otherwise that has a more profound anti-depressant effect compared to arylhexocyclamine dissociatives. It's a breath-takingly powerful effect totally unlike the hazy bandaid that opioids provide. Unlike most other drugs besides psychedelics, the anti-depressant effect does truly persist beyond the acute intoxication that the drug provides. And unlike psychedelic drugs it is relatively consistent and dependable in this regard without concern for current set and setting.

I think the major downside is that ketamine, MXE, and similar certainly bring out psychotic tendencies with repeated use in a way I haven't experienced even with strong stimulants. A very strongly reinforced sense of unlikely coincidence, universal harmony, thought-sharing, conspiracy, and ultimately paranoia. I'm not somebody who is prone to this way of thinking normally so I can only imagine what it can bring out in some others.