When judgement and condescension strikes

[xxfreak187xx]

Be it from strangers, friends, or family what is you'r reaction to this when it's aimed at you in regards to addiction and use?
I understand many people aren't very open with others irl about their situation but I'm sure you still relate.
Personally I have never hid my drug use, even as a kid just starting I was always pretty straight forward with everybody (which I get now was not always a good idea) so it's never been a surprise. Throughout my substance career I have developed a strong passion for harm reduction, drug culture, and the progression of medical uses...largely due to frequenting forums like this (just not as cool) at a young age. That combined with the lessons and experience I've gained from fucking up for 19 years of my life has fortunately graced me with a more responsible and realistic view on the subject and I feel good about that but when people in my rl ask questions or try and have a conversation about any of this with me all I get is condescending close minded fuckery that drives me fucking insane. My crazy ass mom is the worst for this and even as much as I attempt to avoid talking this subject she will find a way to bring it up. Anyways, dose anybody else ever deal with this sort of shit, if so how to respond to it?

 

[Jabberwocky]

Flame and fire.

I've been open to certain people about my addictions, mainly family and friends, doctors... some strangers like here on BL....

I can't stand the common man's perception of addiction. Like it's a weakness, not a disease.... maybe it's both? But don't tell me I'm fucking weak because I've had problems with heroin. If anything I am strong for defeating it.

I'm fairly passionate about this particular subject. I am lucky in that my family understands and forgives me for all the evil fucking shit I did when I was a true junkie. Things I have not forgiven myself for, to this day. I have done some true evil in the sake of getting high. I'm no Christian, but I have some repentance to do. Call it bad Karma.

 

[Xorkoth]

Yeah drug demonization is a terrible thing. The result of "just say no" and the drug war is that the common non-drug using population tends to think of drug users as almost less than human. When in fact consciousness alteration is a common theme across the history of humanity, and many of the same people who judge see no problems with having a drink every day, smoking, or drinking coffee.

 

[xxfreak187xx]

many of the same people who judge see no problems with having a drink every day, smoking, or drinking coffee.

Exactly.
I just wish it was easier to talk and discuss it with the people around me without most of them being so close minded and ignorant.

 

[2spun4one]

That's likely why most of us do what we can to keep it out of site, spares us the grief of having to defend a way of life

 

[thegreenhand]

Drug war propaganda has reflected drug use as a symptom and even more heinously as cause of mental illness. Is it? Certainly the former in some scenarios but our culture would have you believe the second as stone cold fact. That Illegal use = abuse. Whonu the trauma might start there?

 

[Jabberwocky]

I was first ‘diagnosed’ and 12-stepped by a well-meanIng Family member at age 16. All AA/NA taught me was to feel ashamed of my moral weakness and I generally met this same attitude from people who became aware that I was a drinker/user in the program. I felt tortured for years because of the sheer number of relapses I had despite doing my best to work the program. It became easy to believe I was morally weak (and therefore worthless).

It was not until I was in my early 40s that an intelligent doctor told me I was not an alcoholic or drug addict but that I had bi-polar disorder and lost likely ADD and that the drink and drugs were a symptom, not the main problem that needed to be treated. With effective treatment for those conditions my ability to stay sober if I wished actually became quite strong (years at a time no trouble not drinking/drugging at all or very much).

The big difference was when my family began to see me as someone unwell rather than someone as weak. I couldn’t give a fuck what strangers think though.

 

[thegreenhand]

My parents have recently tried to AA me as well. I guess using mushrooms twice this summer means I’m addicted (yes that was my only substance use). I don’t know how to show them that I am fine and healthy while still using substances. They see it as a symptom (which ofc it can be) of some larger issue not as normal behavior

 

[xxfreak187xx]

I was first ‘diagnosed’ and 12-stepped by a well-meanIng Family member at age 16. All AA/NA taught me was to feel ashamed of my moral weakness and I generally met this same attitude from people who became aware that I was a drinker/user in the program. I felt tortured for years because of the sheer number of relapses I had despite doing my best to work the program. It became easy to believe I was morally weak (and therefore worthless).

I'am sorry that this was the experience with AA/NA. Not that I never had this happen but I found NA and ironically more so with AA an actual shift in my world, I went as far as in my very first public speech for 60 days clean, I looked at a room of 150-200 AA members and told them that they must have brainwashed me. I'm very aware we take what we want from groups and rehabs, such as I did with my first in-patient treatment by sourcing as much as possible but each time I ALWAYS learned something and what I got from actually completing my 12 steps honestly was a new sense of myself worth and the world around me. Cliche I know, but it worked for me and countless others. I also know many that got fuckall from it, and I also had quite a few very shitty experiences with both groups and almost said fuck it, in all honesty I did but peers around me gave me insight.

 

[Jabberwocky]

I'am sorry that this was the experience with AA/NA. Not that I never had this happen but I found NA and ironically more so with AA an actual shift in my world, I went as far as in my very first public speech for 60 days clean, I looked at a room of 150-200 AA members and told them that they must have brainwashed me. I'm very aware we take what we want from groups and rehabs, such as I did with my first in-patient treatment by sourcing as much as possible but each time I ALWAYS learned something and what I got from actually completing my 12 steps honestly was a new sense of myself worth and the world around me. Cliche I know, but it worked for me and countless others. I also know many that got fuckall from it, and I also had quite a few very shitty experiences with both groups and almost said fuck it, in all honesty I did but peers around me gave me insight.

I would still admit that I got a great deal out of my AA/NA experience as well as the rehabs that were 12-step based. It definitely helped me in many ways including helping me greatly reduce the alcohol/drugs I was consuming at the time and which were exacerbating my mental health problems. However, and maybe things are different now, they just completely shat on any notion of dual diagnosis or that substance use was the symptom not the underlying problem to be dealt with. It took me a long time to recognise that treating my bipolar and ADD led to better outcomes (and less substance use) than thinking of myself as a powerless moral failure which I believed for many years thanks to AA/NA. You can't beat a major manic episode by going to a meeting or having a cuppa with your sponsor and exercising a bit of moral fortitude - you need antipsychotics which will ideally remove the mania the causes many to self-medicate uncontrollably.

 

[xxfreak187xx]

You can't beat a major manic episode by going to a meeting or having a cuppa with your sponsor and exercising a bit of moral fortitude - you need antipsychotics which will ideally remove the mania the causes many to self-medicate uncontrollably.

Very true, also if I'm correct is was some years back when you attended, before diagnosed?
The rehabs and groups I attended were within the last 5 years and from what I recall they all looed at dual diagnosis. I can't imagine having to deal with the shit like u had to.

 

[Joey]

I was first ‘diagnosed’ and 12-stepped by a well-meanIng Family member at age 16. All AA/NA taught me was to feel ashamed of my moral weakness and I generally met this same attitude from people who became aware that I was a drinker/user in the program. I felt tortured for years because of the sheer number of relapses I had despite doing my best to work the program. It became easy to believe I was morally weak (and therefore worthless).

It was not until I was in my early 40s that an intelligent doctor told me I was not an alcoholic or drug addict but that I had bi-polar disorder and lost likely ADD and that the drink and drugs were a symptom, not the main problem that needed to be treated. With effective treatment for those conditions my ability to stay sober if I wished actually became quite strong (years at a time no trouble not drinking/drugging at all or very much).

The big difference was when my family began to see me as someone unwell rather than someone as weak. I couldn’t give a fuck what strangers think though.

I have no issue with the peer support aspect of 12 steps but the shaming which occurs so regularly due to the inherent nature of the “day 1” mentality has basically driven me from ever wanting to be a part of the programs in any big way again. I’ve seen a multitude of confessions where guys and gals are claiming how they knew nothing and we’re so screwed up, weren’t thorough in their programs or whatever and they’re talking about a slip after multiple years of sobriety.

There’s no sense in totally discounting your successes because you’ve made the mistake of choosing to use when you’re trying to abstain. It’s addiction, most people have their days. For every person who’s sitting in there with a bunch of years there’s probably a hundred more who will and are struggling. They are no less worthy or desiring to have better lives.

Addictions a bitch. By dictionary definition it’s even the disease AA claims it to be, and chronic diseases are recurring most cases.

I used to flail so hard when I fucked up and had a slip and the shame of it all, losing my sober date and back to day 1 (or zero really) drove me to full on relapse more than once. That whole aspect of AA and the abstinence only model of recovery that’s so prevalent in the industry of addictions treatment is so not harm reduction it’s unreal. It encourages failure by injecting an attitude of failure into anything less than perfection, while simultaneously telling you you’re this spiritually lacking person who’s defective of character over and over and to turn it over to a higher power as your powerless.

There are some people who are very successful within this model but they’re not the rule, they’re the exception. They didn’t want it more, or get it more, or more ready necessarily, they’re just more pliable to total abstinence than average by sheer dumb luck in my opinion. I think the person whos having a hell of a time and is a repeat “chronic relapser” yet continues to try here, despite it not working very well.. more gumption there than the person who managed more easily. Not going to discount anyone’s struggle, but some have it easier than others at the outset from quitting.

All roads lead to AA pretty well too. For a program that’s so unaffiliated, it sure is embedded deep into booming big industry, like medical and addictions; the legal system, television, etc. The whole gamut that’s generally available to the public is so far behind contemporary science and harm reduction practices, that’s unreal too. Only the last few years where I am some real sense is starting to be made with drug policy in Canada where I live; and especially harm reduction prigramming; Good Samaritan law(cops can’t bust you at site of an overdose), things like that.

Addiction is a mental health problem. Whether it’s the only issue, or a subset of another issue as a symptom like you with bipolar and ADD (I have same two things diagnosed btw among others) it’s a disorder of the mind and eventually body (physical addiction) that is chronic and often incurable. Just like the big book says.

Too bad the program in the big book doesn’t really treat it as such, by implying you’re a failure. Or you’re constitutionally incapable of being honest or spiritual and whatever else. If you have this disease, and it flares up like any other it’s a character problem.. Dichotomy of the most damaging order: Fuck 12 steps, bring on the harm reduction!

 

[xxfreak187xx]

There’s no sense in totally discounting your successes because you’ve made the mistake of choosing to use when you’re trying to abstain. It’s addiction, most people have their days

I like the way u put that

 

[Coffeeshroom]

I have no issue with the peer support aspect of 12 steps but the shaming which occurs so regularly due to the inherent nature of the “day 1” mentality has basically driven me from ever wanting to be a part of the programs in any big way again. I’ve seen a multitude of confessions where guys and gals are claiming how they knew nothing and we’re so screwed up, weren’t thorough in their programs or whatever and they’re talking about a slip after multiple years of sobriety.

I have exp with this personal and totally agree on the shaming part. We go there to feel better and get better emotional, mentally and physically and breaking people down from day 1 is not the way forward for me

On the OT: My family know i have an opiate addiction but they prefer me using prescribed meds then street drugs. Though they even know its cheaper of the street, they would rather want me to use something pure and controlled then a street drug.

 

[Celestial_Robot_Cat]

I recently opened up to some people in real life about my drug usage and my struggles with controlling my stimulant usage and really regret doing so, overall. I had a psychotic episode about three weeks back and had told a couple people later that morning about what I had seen (thinking it was real, while I was still actually in that state but unaware of it).

When I snapped out of it I had to backtrack and explain to these people what had actually happened. I got some incredible support from a couple of people but one person at first laughed, basically comparing my experience as equivalent to her weird dreams, and then when I got a bit upset with her for not taking it seriously, she's stopped talking to me entirely. This is why I never bothered to talk about it before except people in my drug-using circle and it will make me extremely hesitant to open up again in the future.

 

[xxfreak187xx]

This is why I never bothered to talk about it before except people in my drug-using circle and it will make me extremely hesitant to open up again in the future.

That sux man, sry u have been made to feel that way. We should all be able to confide in somebody and receive unbiased feedback and advice...without paying by the hour.

 

[GetMeOutOfThisCRAP]

How dare anyone enjoy a joint or a 5 milligram percocet (glares condescendingly while pounding down hard liquor/chain smoking cigarettes).

The USA loves drugs. So much. But they don't like to talk about it.

 

[Celestial_Robot_Cat]

That sux man, sry u have been made to feel that way. We should all be able to confide in somebody and receive unbiased feedback and advice...without paying by the hour.

Thank you. It was the first time I've experienced judgement like that and it really caught me off guard.

I am, though, grateful for the three people that treated me with kindness and concern for my well-being. I know that most drugs are still heavily stigmatized and that many people have an unfavourable and uninformed view of addiction.

I recognize that if you haven't done drugs and have never been addicted, there's no possible way to understand on any level what the experiences are like. It was just really unfortunate to be shut out by someone that I thought was a good friend.

But, hey, that's life.

 

[xxfreak187xx]

But, hey, that's life.

Sad but true, maybae they will come around after things cool off.
Receiving blatant judgment at meetings is a definite way to be thrown off guard and I get that everyone has an opinion and blah fucking blah, no one should be made to feel cast out in a group basically dedicated to those who have been cast out!
I especially hate the self righteous twats that were once a mirror image of any of us who has some sobriety acting this way or like they "are" the key to what works. As if they have forgotten where they came from

 

[Celestial_Robot_Cat]

Sad but true, maybae they will come around after things cool off.

I hope so but we'll see. The awkward part of it is that she's a coworker and sits right behind me. Normally she doesn't stop talking, always gave me a big hello when I came in, we'd hang out outside of work sometimes. All it took was less than 24 hours. I tried to talk to her twice and she blew me off. I might try one more time but if I get the same reaction, it's up to her after that.

I especially hate the self righteous twats that were once a mirror image of any of us who has some sobriety acting this way or like they "are" the key to what works. As if they have forgotten where they came from

100%. You can't erase your past, it's part of what made you who you are and it's arrogant to pretend otherwise.