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when do certain drugs exit your system (blood test timing)

C

CuPiD^^

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i have a close friend who is close to getting a very good job at quantas, but in order for him to get it he needs to pass a drug test.
I have read about drug testing and have found out that there r minimal testing that test for k, but they can easily test for heroin, and methamphetamines.
Im not certain why a company like quantas would go to the extremes to test for k use.
BUT if they do, how long would a drug like that stay in your system? and if any1 has info on other drugs such as md(xx) / meth-speed / canabis
I would usually spend hours searching for these answers myself, but im a bit strapped for time tonight, i'll check on in the morning for anyone's information that can help
*looks over at BT*
thnx.
 
Tested for in Standard Drug Tests? NO
Tested for in Extended Drug Tests? NO
Possible to Test for? Yes
Detection Period in Urine probably 2-4 days
It is possible to test for the presence of ketamine metabolites in urine, blood, & hair, but it is an uncommon test to do. In the last couple years Ketamin has become more widely known in the popular media and some testing companies have added it to their "Club Drug" testing battery. Unless there is a particular reason to be looking for it, as in the case of an autopsy, specific ketamine tests are not normall conducted. It is not one of the NIDA-5 standardly tested for in the basic drug test, nor is it included in the extended drug tests.
False Positives: Ketamine may cause false positives for PCP on some drug screens (1), but is clearly differentiable using follow-up confirming tests such as GC/MS.
http://www.erowid.org/chemicals/ketamine/ketamine_testing.shtml
[ 24 April 2002: Message edited by: johnboy ]
Click to expand...
 
To be safe don't have any amphetimines for at least a week beforehand, you just never know.
You would probably be better off finding this info on Erwoid.
 
thnx jb, just 1 more question...
do u know where i can find out all the drugs listes in the NIDA-5 standard test?
or even in an upgraded test that canbe done.
 
http://www.erowid.org/psychoactives/testing/testing.shtml
from: Erowid's Drug Testing Page:
The NIDA 5
Federal government guidelines (by NIDA-The National Institute on Drug Abuse and SAMHSA-The Substance Abuse and Mental Health Services Administration) require that companies which use commercial class drivers licenses for employees must have a testing system in place. Among other things, this required testing program must test for 5 specific categories of drugs (sometimes referred to as the "NIDA 5"). Because of this federal requirement, most drug testing companies offer a basic drug test which checks for drugs in these 5 common categories. Click on the substance name for a description of the laboratory method for detecting the substance.
1. Cannabinoids (marijuana, hash)
2. Cocaine (cocaine, crack, benzoylecognine)
3. Amphetamines (amphetamines, methamphetamines, speed)
4. Opiates (heroin, opium, codeine, morphine)
5. Phencyclidine (PCP)
BigTrancer :)
Click to expand...
 
excellent bt, thnx guys, sorry again to get u guys to do my work for me :( i'll make sure i spend the time instead of wasting a thread...
 
Funny how when you use ketamine that the test results turn positive for PCP. I reckon they are actually the same thing.
 
^^^
Same logic:
my car is white, my cat is white, therefore my cat is a car.
 
FYI
The A1 Medical exam that you have to pass to even apply for Qantas (tests eyes and heart etc) will do a urine sample but that is only for colestrol levels and other stuff.... not drug related.....The drug test is once you are in the company as you get your commercial licence....
It would be a good idea to quit about 3 months before applying simply for the fact that i have been told many varying stories as to the time it takes for things to get out (EG i have been told by my docter that 3 months is a safe time to expect MDMA to be FULLY flushed out...)
In any case if you are thinking of going into that line of work i would give up now....(your friend would be applying in Nov/Dec right??) you are heading into a lifestyle where responsibility is 100% needed and taking drugs cannot be a part of your life if you get into the industry (I am assuming however that your friend is going for a Pilot position rather than ground crew)..... considering the fact that the company policy towards drugs and the tests for them in previous years was they could test you whenvever they wanted but didn't, however now the policy is in process of being changed to regular random checks of all staff....
Is your friend going for the Cadetteship or going in with his licence already??
 
3 months is a safe time to expect MDMA to be FULLY flushed out..
ALL metabolites from MDMA and/or amphetamines should be flushed from your system within 48-72 hours, so in reality a week off should be sufficient to avoid detection. However, three months is a good rule if you are a frequent choof smoker because THC can be stored in your body's lipid cells and be detected in various tests for a long time after stopping smoking regularly.
If it's important to you, err on the side of safety.
BigTrancer :)
[ 01 May 2002: Message edited by: BigTrancer ]
Click to expand...
 
Im very much considering going for a job which does stringent drug tests. I smoke like 5 times a week for years now, and the testing is done at the beginning of April. Im pretty sure i am fucked, but i really wanna apply for this job. Is there anything i can do?
Erowid says that Phernergan (a antihistamine) can give a false positive, and i have popped these for years to control my hay fever. Can i just say that it has beeen the phernergan pills that gave the positive, and be done with it?
Or am i truly fucked? :D
Cheers in advance - Moocho
 
^^^^^
Don't say it's the phernergan, that makes it look like you've done your research. You want to look as clueless as possible.
If the tests show a positive for dope, you have to look amazed/confused, and ask how that could be because you don't smoke that shit. I'd assume then they'd ask you what other medications you're on, and that would be the point where you'd say a bunch of things including phernergan. Then it's up to them to decide if they believe the phernergan could have caused the "false" positive.
It's not just the test that could fuck you, it's the way you behave too... :)
 
Elimination of a drug which is a weak acid or a weak base is affected by pH of the urine.
Ketamine and amphetamines, while classified differently, are both weak bases. Normally your urinary pH is ~ 6.0 although it can swing from 4.5 – 8. By decreasing your urinary pH (making more acidic), elimination of a weak base is faster. (If you were trying to eliminate a weak acid - say aspirin- you would need to raise your pH, e.g. with baking soda. Ketamine has a half-life rating of 1-5 hours. Amphetamine is ~12 hours.
People often try to increase the plasma half life of drugs like speed and E by taking a urinary alkaliser. I would not consider this a safe practice as the longer a toxin or toxic metabolite remains at high concentrations in plasma, the greater the effective toxicity. It would be interesting to see though, which practice would be the more toxic – e.g. extra doses of MDMA against urinary pH increases. Baby Doc or zorn, any ideas?
If you needed to hasten the process of elimination of a weak base, you may consider Ammonium Chloride (NH4Cl). It is an over the counter item at pharmacies, and will greatly assist in reducing elimination time by lowering urinary pH. At pH 5, within the first 24 hours, excretion of amphetamine is over double that at pH7 and within the next 24 hours elimination can increase to over 15 times the normal rate.
In non predisposed people, ammonium chloride is relatively safe when used at low doses (non chronic use). The ammonium ion NH4+ is not nearly as toxic to cells as ammonia NH3, and in fact is normally present in the tubular fluid of the kidneys. (Both are produced in the proximal convoluted tubule of the kidney from metabolic breakdown of glutamine)
It is important to realize that while a little ammonium chloride may help in elimination of some (weak base) drugs, too much could cause a condition known as acidosis, which can be life threatening. It is also contraindicated if suffering hypertension, hypoxia or renal insufficiency.
Metabolic acidosis:
web page
My advice, if this practice were to be employed would be to first speak with your doctor or a pharmacist, telling them what you want to do (read: honesty). And do not take more than one tablet a day. With amphetamine, plasma concentration will essentially be at baseline by the third day, so there’s no point taking NH4Cl past 48 hours after drug administration.
Refs:
Martini 2001 Anatomy and Physiology
Torell T., et al, Pharmacology and Pharmacodynamics
Intravenous Anæsthetic Agents, Ketamine web page
[ 05 May 2002: Message edited by: phase_dancer ]
 
[Edit: Reply to question asked by BANNED aka SirLSD's ghost, on increasing elimination of THC. Question was removed by moderators after this reply- phase_dancer]
My apologies for not replying sooner.
I’m not sure whether I can explain some of the cannabinoid processes well enough in simple terms with my limited understanding. Instead I’ll reason why some talked about methods should hasten elimination.
It is usual to look at pharmacokinetics (what your body does with the drug & the energies associated) of water soluble chemicals via a compartment model where activity of the drug is identified by the time it exists in a ‘central compartment’ (CC). This is viewed as an energy related picture where time spent in the CC is determined by 3 factors - rate of absorption (entering CC ), rate of metabolism and rate of elimination (leaving CC).
Cannabinoids are lipid soluble organic molecules. This means they can stay around by being bound in fatty tissues. Further metabolism is slow because cannabinoids form protein complexes which are easily retained in fat cells i.e. they are energy favoured.
With the compartmental model; retention of highly lipid soluble drugs in fat cells (adipocytes) is represented as a separate compartment ( CC II) where the energy requirements for entering and leaving the CC (to and from CC II) largely determines the time the drug remains in the system. It is rather a simplified picture and only really helps in explaining the stability and slow excretion of metabolites from highly lipid soluble substances.
The chief excretory metabolite of THC is a carboxylic acid conjugate which (I think) is mildly acidic, water soluble and is relatively easy to excrete. The trick is to get the protein bound metabolites to be converted via phase II metabolism into the soluble compounds. Urinary excretion of mildly acidic compounds as mentioned can be hastened with oral administration of sodium bicarbonate @ ~6g /day or five 00 caps.
THC excretion is dramatically affected by your individual metabolic rate.
A fast metabolism will excrete more quickly, but usage is also a determining factor. Heavier users excrete more quickly @ ~28 days, compared to ~40 days for occasional users.
Without loading or altering your kidney function and hormone levels by chemical intervention, the best way of hastening this is via activities and a diet which increase metabolism. Exercise is first and foremost the best and quickest way of increasing excretion. I know of a really fit guy who smoked a joint 4 days before a test and he showed clear - to the amazement of us all.
A high carbohydrate diet with increased water intake is undoubtedly a good and safe way of hastening THC excretion. Dietary supplements which affect metabolism such as L-carnitine and pyruvate (and many others) can aid by increasing fat breakdown along with protein conjugates of cannabinoid metabolites.
Drugs such as caffeine, ephedrine and amphetamine will also increase metabolism, although it must be weighed up whether using these drugs will produce a better test result – time and safety being the deciding factors.
Most excretion of cannabis metabolites occurs through defecation, so supplements and a diet which increase bowel activity and encourage detoxification should also assist.
In summary: Lots of cereals and grains, vegetables and fruits and plenty of exercise coupled with a detoxifying bacteria culture (acidophilus yogurt), lots of water and fresh air, and maybe some bicarb on the third or forth day should do the trick. As for how long it will take? I guess it depends upon factors mentioned.
The best way of assessing what is good for you may be to do the experiment. Buy a couple of urine kits, have the usual bend and test, then try the cleansing diet and test again.
Hope this of some help. Overdue assignments prevent more - feel free to elaborate anyone.
Oh, and ammonium chloride is available at chemists in a 500mg tablets, over the counter according to my pharmacology lecturer.
[ 30 May 2002: Message edited by: phase_dancer ]
 
I dont know about things like cocaine and crap but amphetamines based drugs have a 'half life' of about 6 hours. That basicly means that 6 hours after you first take it, only half of the original dosage is left in your system, and another 6 hour after that, only half of that half, etc. So basicly depending on how much you have taken, any MDMA or speed you have taken should be basicly untracable within 48-72 hours.
THC however (from smoking pot for the uninformed) is a fat soluable chemical. This means that after you smoke it, it can be absorbed by your body fat, and remain in your system for anywhere from 6 months to a year. I am subject to random drug tests for my work and I wont touch pot at all for this reason.
$0.02
 
MODS, for the good of the community please dont delete this until phase dancer has read it. also you should ask phase dancer to compile a FAQ
phase dancer, very good work. i wasnt going to give any info but as youve obviously gone to a lot of effort i will add a little for sake of completeness. take note and repost what of this you wish (my post will be deleted again im sure)
1) i dont feel youve given enough emphasis to the use of urinary alkalisers. this with large amounts of water is an intergral factor.
2) 6g bicarb a day is a low dose. 12g a day is better- see point 3.
3) "ural" (green box) or "citravescent" (yellow box) available otc @ ~$9 a box. it contains other salts also, for a better ballance in the body. better than plain bicarb.
4)take ural etc @ max recomended dose for 5 days straight. if have plenty of time, after the 5 days stop for 2 then start again. MAKE SURE YOU STOP AT LEAST 12 HOURS BEFORE THE TEST. 12-24+hrs
5) drink heaps of water on the day of the test!
have atleast 1 piss on the day of the test before the test. dont have the test as your first piss of the morning.
they say 3 months is safe. if you follow the advice on this thread most will pass with just 2 weeks. many with just one week
thats all i can think of off the top of my head.
good work
SirLSD's ghost
 
Amphetamine can have a half life as short as 5 hours. That is if your urine is acidic enough. From Rang et al;
‘The plasma half-life of amphetamine varies from about 5 hours to 20-30 hours depending upon urine flow and urinary pH’
As SirLSD’s ghost stated, water is important when using alkalisers for increasing acidic metabolite elimination. There's alot of medications which will be affected by this, so if on any check with you doctor first.
There is also potential danger with those suffering heart conditions, especially with alkalising products which contain potassium salts, as prolonged intake could raise plasma levels of the cation. Sodium is of less concern, although it could still be a problem. Know your health in these areas, don’t exceed the recommended dose, and drink sensible amounts of water.
Don’t use any alkalizing aids if you have vomited a lot or are dehydrated. The loss of stomach acid and chloride ions, can effectively shift your pH balance. Severe cases of vomiting and urinary rate increases can produce alkalosis.
MDMA, which can cause hyponatremia, should not be used with alkalisers in an attempt to prolong the effects of the drug. They may cause high absorption of sodium and potassium ions if you become dehydrated.
Be sensible, with regards to these methods of elimination. Urinary/ plasma pH balance - like osmotic pressure and Na/K balance - is extremely important, and if it shifts too far either way, renal failure and death occur.
Do the experiment (read above) so you know in advance how long it takes YOU to eliminate.
 
dont bother asking your doctor about drug interactions. a good pharmacist knows way more about medication interactions than any doctor, and their advice is free.
SirLSD's ghost's final post
 
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