Sometimes, it is okay to narc

[Psychubus]

I realize that there is a taboo among many members of the young generation on snitching somebody out. This belief is widespread and prevalent especially in the drug community.

And before everybody flips out on me, please refrain from comments until the end while keeping in mind that I personally have never ratted anybody out (I am far too paranoid to contact an agent myself lol...). But my stance on feeding some so-called dealers and cooks to the sharks has changed greatly as of late, especially after crossing international borders and observing law in other countries.

The truth is, because drugs are illegal, our products will often be unclean and impure. This is due to people who cut their products, or outright lie about a drug's quality or even the product itself, just to make a few measly dollars. And those who rip off other people unknowingly to the person's consent are just worthless scum. They should therefore be rid of for a safer drug environment.

I respect salespeople who respect their customers and do not cheat or outright lie to them. And considering I am all for drug legalization to create a SAFE reliable market... WHY is it that we are protecting the thieves and criminals that only contaminate the market with total shit?

I for one, don't think it would be violating any of my moral codes to tip off the law enforcement agencies of these criminals. I certainly don't want to protect the people who keep helping to obstruct a common goal for harm minimization.

Lastly (a bit of a rant, sorry), dealers of all people shouldn't have inflated egos. They are salespeople and should treat their work like a business, and their customer's safety should be the number one priority.

We cannot allow this heinous activity to continue anymore. Wise up or suffer the consequences.

 

[I-Love-Marijuana]

And before everybody flips out on me, please refrain from comments until the end while keeping in mind that I personally have never ratted anybody out

Why are you stating that? Like all of the sudden, your "cool" just because you've never snitched? Does it really make a difference if you've snitched or not if your giving your opinion? Damn, why don't you just say your black so it's okay?

Just commenting as I read through your post, seems like it has potential - I like to read stuff that is different than the usual preaching to the choir you see here. But the value of your opinion is based on just that, I don't care what your history is. Besides, you wouldn't tell people your a narc on this website if you wanted a smooth time, so you could just be lying.

I respect salespeople who respect their customers and do not cheat or outright lie to them

A drugdealer, or any black market dealer, is cheating the people of taxes. We work and pay our fucking share, why shouldn't they? Don't mean to come off as harsh, nor do I really care, but this was a bit contradictory.

I for one, don't think it would be violating any of my moral codes to tip off the law enforcement agencies of these criminals. I certainly don't want to protect the people who keep helping to obstruct a common goal for harm minimization.

And so I get to the thesis of your post...

Well, interesting. But if we all adopted this logic, we would have something similiar to a communist nation, or the USSR, where we would be calling in everyone for everything. No drug dealer would be safe, legit or not. A drug dealer, just like any legitamate counterpart, will always have enemies and disgruntled customers - and people in general, alike.

Sorry, just too hard to judge.

As for ratting on dealers because they are sketchy... eh. Why waste the time? Just don't go to them, spread the word they are sketched. Just like any legitamate business, they will go out of business if they don't have a customer base.

And have you ever been to jail or prison? As fucked up as Mr. Sketchy may be, he might be the family provider. Sure, you might think your doing a good one for the drug community and teaching him a lesson, but why should you make his kids and spouse suffer?

Just don't buy from them, spread the word. Most effective, only limited to Mr. Sketchy themself, and keeps their shit off the street.

And a message from the Baltimore Drug Dealers....

 

[Abraxus]

It is NEVER okay to be a rat. Period. Justify it any way you want, but a rat is a rat, plain and simple. There are other ways of dealing with a sketchy dealer, the most effective of which is not using them.

 

[Psychubus]

Why are you stating that? Like all of the sudden, your "cool" just because you've never snitched? Does it really make a difference if you've snitched or not if your giving your opinion? Damn, why don't you just say your black so it's okay?

Just commenting as I read through your post, seems like it has potential - I like to read stuff that is different than the usual preaching to the choir you see here. But the value of your opinion is based on just that, I don't care what your history is. Besides, you wouldn't tell people your a narc on this website if you wanted a smooth time, so you could just be lying.

First of all I want to thank you for your thought out response. However, I can assure you that I posted this at the expense me looking "cool." hehehe...

A drugdealer, or any black market dealer, is cheating the people of taxes. We work and pay our fucking share, why shouldn't they? Don't mean to come off as harsh, nor do I really care, but this was a bit contradictory.

Income tax in itself is theft, and I do not know enough about politics and economics to argue about this. I realize I myself was a bit harsh in my post, but you must consider some of the people I have come across. People who keep selling RC's as LSD DESPITE the fact that I have brought evidence showing otherwise. Dealers who not only push their products on young minors, but take advantage of them and rip them off.

Well, interesting. But if we all adopted this logic, we would have something similiar to a communist nation, or the USSR, where we would be calling in everyone for everything. No drug dealer would be safe, legit or not. A drug dealer, just like any legitamate counterpart, will always have enemies and disgruntled customers - and people in general, alike.

But that is the purpose. Why should drug dealers feel that they are safe? When they start feeling too safe, this is when they start taking advantage of customers and taking them for granted. If they know that they carry a responsibility to issue common decency for their clients, the drug environment would be a much safer place.

As for ratting on dealers because they are sketchy... eh. Why waste the time? Just don't go to them, spread the word they are sketched. Just like any legitamate business, they will go out of business if they don't have a customer base.

Unfortunately, this is never how it works in the black market. Many times, people will never resort to ratting somebody out, but they will often partake in violent methods to settle the problem. This only perpetuates the vicious cycle.

And have you ever been to jail or prison? As fucked up as Mr. Sketchy may be, he might be the family provider. Sure, you might think your doing a good one for the drug community and teaching him a lesson, but why should you make his kids and spouse suffer?

Perhaps he should have thought about that before making countless other people his victims.

I believe that this can work, but like abortion, should only be used as a last resort, of course.

 

[Psychubus]

It is NEVER okay to be a rat. Period. Justify it any way you want, but a rat is a rat, plain and simple. There are other ways of dealing with a sketchy dealer, the most effective of which is not using them.

And what do you suggest as a more effective method of getting rid of a sketchy dealer? Beating the shit out of him? Hiring somebody else to do the dirty work? Because I can assure you that is not the answer.

I'm sorry, but people like these only harm the drug scene more than ANYTHING.

 

[Khadijah]

Anyone ever heard of KARMA?

you DONT TAKE IT INTO YOUR OWN HANDS.

it AINT UP TO YOU to get rid of sketchy dealers. it AINT up to YOU to "fix" the problems in the drug trade.

IT WILL COME BACK AROUND TO THEM WITHOUT YOUR HELP.

When you narc youre taking something into your own hands that aint your business.

The viewpoint that "its OK to narc if someone is a bad dealer" is the most retarded shit i heard all day.

All your arguements are hot, steaming, ignorant bullshit.

You can laugh at the code of dealing and the rules of the streets like "hahaha, oh yea, code of the streets ROFLLOLOL well guess what i aint ghetto, that means nothing to me" but it does whether you understand it or not.

You PLAY BY THE RULES OF THE GAME YOURE IN.

The LAW of police is not the law of the streets or the law of the drug game. Straight up. its that simple.

 

[Psyko_dk]

Lacey K > I don't believe in Karma.

Anyway I think there are at least one situation in which snitching is okay.
That is if the dealer is knowingly selling a lethal drug without the proper "labelling." I.e a dealer selling carfentanyl cut so poorly that people die of it. You tell him that and he just laughs at you and keep selling the product.
Or a dealer knowingly selling PMA pills as esctasy without telling anyone about the dangerous content.

I've never snitched on anyone though and don't think I ever will.

 

[topekoms18]

my favorite is when the other guy in your area rats on you because you're competition.
as for ok to rat, no, no its not. plain and simple, if they really are that bad then tell your friends tarnish his cred and move on.
Sure, you narc he goes to jail, and whats he gonna do when he gets out, other than come looking for ya, start selling again. And this time he will be worse, because you got him popped with outstanding debt, now hes gotta start from scratch.
stupidity.
And ratting is not just a underground moral value type deal, its common decency. you dont tell your boss you coworker was late. you dont report your neighbor for drinking on his front lawn. You dont tell your friends girlfriend you saw him kissing another woman.

 

[topekoms18]

Oh and as for the lethal drug thing, the minute people start dropping dead, that guy is now narcotics number one priority. as for pma, the club owners going to find out who's behind it, whether someone snitches or not. say what you will, its nearly impossible to get away with dealing in the club if someone actuallly wants to find you.

 

[Psychubus]

my favorite is when the other guy in your area rats on you because you're competition.
as for ok to rat, no, no its not. plain and simple, if they really are that bad then tell your friends tarnish his cred and move on.
Sure, you narc he goes to jail, and whats he gonna do when he gets out, other than come looking for ya, start selling again. And this time he will be worse, because you got him popped with outstanding debt, now hes gotta start from scratch.
stupidity.
And ratting is not just a underground moral value type deal, its common decency. you dont tell your boss you coworker was late. you dont report your neighbor for drinking on his front lawn. You dont tell your friends girlfriend you saw him kissing another woman.

You don't report those things because they quite frankly, are personal affairs and not your business to be sticking your nose in. However, I believe anybody who is quite passionate about keeping a safer community in drug legalization would at least be able to consider my perspective (though they may not agree with it).

And don't you realize that if somebody dies, that is already too late?

 

[Abraxus]

And what do you suggest as a more effective method of getting rid of a sketchy dealer? Beating the shit out of him? Hiring somebody else to do the dirty work? Because I can assure you that is not the answer.

I'm sorry, but people like these only harm the drug scene more than ANYTHING.

My intent was not to imply that violence was the answer, because it never is. Attacking a shady dealer physically would lead to retribution and so on, so no good could come of it. I was referring to getting the word out there that Dealer X's product is shit, and not to buy it. Word travels fast, and if a dealer gets a bad rep, he can be effectively shut down in a given area.

I don't exactly know how I became "people like that", and I truly fail to see how I am "harming the drug scene" by telling someone not to rat someone out. If anything it's the rats who "harm the drug scene" more than anything else by adding the paranoia and mistrust that is already so prevalent. Ratting out a sketchy dealer can easily translate in to ratting out dealer that one simply doesn't like, or for any number of reasons.

Again, I was not advocating violence and I would appreciate it if you didn't put words in my mouth.

 

[Psychubus]

Anyone ever heard of KARMA?

you DONT TAKE IT INTO YOUR OWN HANDS.

If you study about karma in buddhism, it is actually merely the state of cause and effect. My belief still adheres to this principle of karma, as we are ALL actually partaking in it now as we speak.

it AINT UP TO YOU to get rid of sketchy dealers. it AINT up to YOU to "fix" the problems in the drug trade.

Of course it is up to you, you are a citizen of the country! If it isn't THEN WHO THE FUCK'S IS IT?!??! Should we leave it all up to the DEA, the police, the lawmakers? By being passive you are only allowing them more power for control.

All your arguements are hot, steaming, ignorant bullshit.

And I suppose that rat picture had a lot of merit behind it.

You PLAY BY THE RULES OF THE GAME YOURE IN.

The LAW of police is not the law of the streets or the law of the drug game. Straight up. its that simple.

Actually it is. The reality is that in many cities, corrupt police officers are actually working incahoots with some of the dealers--to say that law enforcement officers are actually not working with the law of the streets or "da game" is nonsensical.

 

[l]evil]

im srry from your personal experience you've had bad dealings and such, and cut shit. but there are respectable dealers with a certain 'code' you can call it. and are about quality not quantity and treat you like a customer at wal-mart.

 

[l]evil]

but i still hate rats

 

[topekoms18]

if you found out about someones selling fentanyl/analogs, then either someone died/nearly, or you are the one that should be in the paddy wagon. legalization would make it so that there were stiff regulations on drug quality. as for safer community, you know what your getting into, nobody does drugs without knowing the risks, its not my buisness if you want to ruin your life. and yeah, i do see your point of view, but the reality is if we all started telling on the bad dealers there would be serious consequences in so far as, hey you roll, 50 dollars. no thanks, i can spot a most shady dealers a mile off, and if i for some reason i get screwed then i learn and dont deal with them.

hey do you by any chance support the patriot act too? if you see your neighbor buying fertilizer and hes got no yard do you call the feds?
Obviously im being sarcastic, but really, where does this sort of reasoning get us?

 

[Khadijah]

Of course it is up to you, you are a citizen of the country! If it isn't THEN WHO THE FUCK'S IS IT?!??! Should we leave it all up to the DEA, the police, the lawmakers? By being passive you are only allowing them more power for control.

ITS UP TO THE PEOPLE WHOSE BUSINESS GETS FUCKED UP BY SOMEONE ELSES SHITTY BUSINESS NOT SOME STUPID ASS FUCKIN "GOOD CITIZEN" KID WHO BELIEVES THAT HES CAPTAIN PLANET OF THE DRUG WORLD.

The shottys will come out and the shit gets taken care of. and it works fine that way without punks with no respect for how shits done tryina interfere with their "save the drug community" crap.

did your mama never teach you to MIND YOUR OWN BUSINESS?

 

[Psychubus]

My intent was not to imply that violence was the answer, because it never is. Attacking a shady dealer physically would lead to retribution and so on, so no good could come of it. I was referring to getting the word out there that Dealer X's product is shit, and not to buy it. Word travels fast, and if a dealer gets a bad rep, he can be effectively shut down in a given area.

I don't exactly know how I became "people like that", and I truly fail to see how I am "harming the drug scene" by telling someone not to rat someone out. If anything it's the rats who "harm the drug scene" more than anything else by adding the paranoia and mistrust that is already so prevalent. Ratting out a sketchy dealer can easily translate in to ratting out dealer that one simply doesn't like, or for any number of reasons.

Again, I was not advocating violence and I would appreciate it if you didn't put words in my mouth.

I apologize. I misread your last sentence, as I can have poor comprehension at times. By people like these I wasnt talking about you either, I was talking about the shady dealers... looks like you misread me too hehehe %)

To reflect on what you just posted, the long term goal in mind was that ideally, the dealers being ratted out would keep the narcs busy enough so that undercover busts would become less common. Which means that now, the dealers must focus their attentions on providing what their customer wants.

Now I realize that all customers will not be happy with their product, especially the newbies out there who are trying it out of curiosity. As somebody out there mentioned, a dealer will always have enemies and spiteful customers. But we need to dig deeper--WHY would a dealer have such enemies?

One reason could be that he lied about the product or shafted his clients, and now they feel cheated. Granted, it might not be his fault--after all, some people's bodies reject substances due to allergies and other personal problems, and this could be interpreted as the effect of a poor quality substance. But don't you think that it is a dealer's responsibility to STATE the potential problems, that every body reacts in different ways--THE SAME WAY THAT EROWID AND BLUELIGHT DOES--instead of just advertising his product as candy for better profit? TO IMPLEMENT HARM MINIMIZATION! Isn't that what this website is about?!?!?!!?!

This is how it works in a legal business, right? If it leaks out to the feds that a corporation is partaking in unsafe practices, what happens? They shut it down, thereby keeping standards for safety high.

 

[l]evil]

ITS UP TO THE PEOPLE WHOSE BUSINESS GETS FUCKED UP BY SOMEONE ELSES SHITTY BUSINESS NOT SOME STUPID ASS FUCKIN "GOOD CITIZEN" KID WHO BELIEVES THAT HES CAPTAIN PLANET OF THE DRUG WORLD.

The shottys will come out and the shit gets taken care of. and it works fine that way without punks with no respect for how shits done tryina interfere with their "save the drug community" crap.

did your mama never teach you to MIND YOUR OWN BUSINESS?

word

 

[Psychubus]

ITS UP TO THE PEOPLE WHOSE BUSINESS GETS FUCKED UP BY SOMEONE ELSES SHITTY BUSINESS NOT SOME STUPID ASS FUCKIN "GOOD CITIZEN" KID WHO BELIEVES THAT HES CAPTAIN PLANET OF THE DRUG WORLD.

The shottys will come out and the shit gets taken care of. and it works fine that way without punks with no respect for how shits done tryina interfere with their "save the drug community" crap.

did your mama never teach you to MIND YOUR OWN BUSINESS?

Lacey K, I have not resorted to childish name-calling or throwing temper tantrums, and simply because you are frustrated does not mean you have to either. Acting so emotional only detracts from your main point.

Try to think more long term. This is not just about taking care of bad dealers, it goes beyond that. Refer to my previous post.

If you truly believe in minding your own business, then it is none of your business whether I rat on somebody or not. So let it be.

 

[Abraxus]

I have never had a dealer tell me of possible side effects and body chemistry and any possible bad effects from a particular drug. I make this my business as a drug user to learn this information. I don't rely on a delaer to tell me this information, and neither should anyone else. A drug dealer's job is not Harm Minimization, by a long shot. Their one and only job is to sell drugs to people that want to buy drugs. Plain and simple. Drug Dealers aren't Erowid or Bluelight, that's why erowid and Bluelight exist. Should a Dealer hand you a FAQ with every bag of substance X? I don't want that from a dealer and I don't think most people do. I want to hand them the money and I want them to hand me drugs. That's about the extent of the relationship. If I am disattisfied with the product, I don't go back. End of story.