My question is, have any of you guys actually went all out and taken all of the individual ingredients, in the right dosages, at the right times? (During the roll) Is it worth it?
no.
that site does make an impression of being well founded by giving all those precise figures, but in reality they're just making it up. there's no research to suggest that supplementation is beneficial. people have had the idea of taking antioxidants because mdma showed neurotoxicity in animal studies (apparently mediated by heightened oxidative stress). but research since has shown that the doses where we find neurotoxicity in animals do not correspond to the doses humans use, but rather to doses ten times higher (and that hyperthermia is the main factor in neurotoxicity).
so we are now left with no suitable model that would predict neurotoxicity in humans (which makes it pretty unlikely that such a thing exists) and therefore (in that case that there is in fact neurotoxicity even though we have basically no data that points that way) also have no model to test for compounds that would be beneficial in that case.
when the site says take 100mg of ALA before and every 2 hours this is not based on facts, but they're just pulling those numbers out of their ass.
but let's have a look at the things they recommend:
2.Na-R-ALA: Stabilized Alpha Lipoic Acid: This is a powerful supplement that will mitigate the ill-effects of MDMA to a great extent. ALA is known to prevent neurotoxicity induced by MDMA.
3. Vitamin C: Vitamin C is known for its antioxidant properties. It protects against neurotoxicity and organ toxicity. Best part – it’s water soluble so it’s difficult to overdose on it.
4. Grape Seed Extract: This extract has properties that prevent MDMA from converting it into other toxic and harmful chemicals.
5. Melatonin: Manages your sleep cycle and continues to protect your body from toxicity.
6. EGCG: Helps your body to manage and flush out toxins.
7. Magnesium Glycinate: Magnesium Glycinate enables your body to protect itself against excitotoxicity.
8. Acetyl-L-carnitine: This supplement works with ALA and reduces strain on the body by protecting against neurotoxicity
9. 5-HTP: 5-HTP helps your system restore the depleted serotonin levels.
10. CoQ10: This substance has properties that enable it to protect your neurons against excitotoxicity.
2. "mitigate the ill-effects of mdma to a great extent" wtf is that supposed to mean. what kinds of ill effects? the description couldn't be more wishi-washi than that. see my paragraph above for neurotoxicity.
3. antioxidant for neurotoxicity — see above.
4. grape seed extract prevents mdma from converting what into toxic chemicals? this makes no sense. maybe they mean that it blocks enzymes in your liver from turning mdma. grape seed extract besides being an antioxidant (see above) contains reservatrol which can inhibit some liver enzymes and activate others. it turns out that can inhibit CYP3A6 and CYP2D6 (the latter of which is the main enzyme in the metabolism of mdma) and induce CYP1A2 [
source] (which metabolises caffeine and is a minor pathway for mdma, turning it into mda) [
source]. so if there were actually enough quantities of reservatrol inside their supplement kit to make any difference (which i doubt), then you'd increase your risk by hightening your blood levels of mdma (slightly, mdma is already a potent inhibitor of CYP2D6 itself) and by increasing the amount which gets metabolised to mda (which is more toxic than mdma in animal models).
5. melatonin can be useful in jet leg (which is not something that one night of clubbing will give you), but if your mdma is not adulterated with amphetamines then you'll have no problem sleeping afterwards anyway. "protect your body from toxicity" how? what toxicity? sources? it's so vague it's meaningless.
6. "flushing out toxins" another claim that's so abstract as to be completely devoid of meaning. what kinds of toxins? mdma? mdma is metabolised in the liver and it and its metabolites are excreted by the kidney. since the grape seed extract is already inhibiting the liver enzymes that only leaves is with the kidney. so how would you increase excretion by the kidney? by increasing blood flow to the kidney i.e. increasing blood pressure (which it not something that egcg does - taking egcg over longer peroids of time (best done by drinking green tea) can actually decrease blood pressure) or by acting as a diuretic (which egcg again isn't). what "flushes out" things (mostly water) is the caffeine in green tea which you don't get by taking egcg. and tbh you wouldn't want to prematurely flush out your mdma, would you?
7. even if it does, what does that have to do with mdma? excitotoxicity is the mechanism of neurotoxicity at work with alcohol or benzo withdrawal, or which has been proposed for dissociates like dxm or ketamine. but that has nothing to do with mdma or the mechanisms proposed for putative mdma-mediated neurotoxicity.
8. we've been over ALA. and wtf does "reduces strain on the body" mean? i begin to wonder why they don't just write "it's good for you. don't ask how just buy it.".
9. only if it gets to the brain which is doubtful if not combined with a decarboxylase inhibitor like carbidopa. and even if it gets to the brain (there are some indications that high doses of egcg could help here) people sometimes report unpleasant side effects nausea, vomiting or dizziness. we also have no data to show that taking 5-htp is effective at all.
10. excitotoxicity again, see above.
they have a lot of useful info mixed with and a lot of arbitrary recommendations (complete with links to where to buy the supplements. i wonder how much commission they get...)
