Misc Pregabalin (Lyrica) as an Anxiolytic?

[pharma-sutra]

I just want some opinions (maybe even with scientific support and evidence) about using Lyrica for GAD and even as an anti-depressant. I know it is approved by EU and Russia, and has been starting to udergo a widespread popularity in N. America, because of it's effectiveness for it's off-label remedies.
I am also aware of the downsides/negatives to this drug. Many users (theraputic and recreational) both report to have an insane increase in tolerance and the need to up the dose within days. The consensus for the theraputic users was that after daily use, within couple of months they reach a point of 'diminishing returns' or when the negatives (high tolerence and dependecy) outweights the positives (mood-lift, anxiolytic effects). I don't even want to bother talking about those who use this for recreation, because simply i'm not going to meddle with any herioc doses such as going above 600mg to a couple grams! This med is expensive and if it does it job so wonderfully as described by many, who take the risk and INTENTIONALLY lose its magic?

So here's my question, I'm going to my doctor and maybe get a dx of GAD and social anxiety, which she already suspects and i have already mentioned to her when she dx me w adult ADD. At first she wanted to me to put on an SSRI but i said fuck that! well, not literally but i explained to her about all the negative stories i've heard and even she admits that its not for everyone. Currently have a rx for Dexedrine and Adderall. During out last appt, I mentioned to her during the comdown of the adderall I feel more anxious ontop my already anxious personality and I get even more self-conscious in social settings. I told her it wasn't anything unbearable since Adderall (15 xr) still helped me alot with confidence and anti-depressant properties, but its just those damn come downs. She actually recommended me to dose my dexedrine (5mg) as a tape before I start coming down the the Adderall if it has been a long day. I only take my ADD meds every other day and only when I need them (usually leave them out during wkds). However I do use adderall recreationally every now and then by rushing up those beads.

So if i was supposed to get the rx for Lyrica, I think I'll start very low like 75 mg/ day and only go onto 2x a day if I really had to. And It would be every other day, since I hear the linger effects continue on to the following day and i won't be as effective if i dosed consecutively. Won't be taking them in weekends, unless theres a presentation or an important social meeting/gathering. I'd also alternative lyrica with kava kava every other week. Like this:

Wk 1 - day 1(lyrica), day 2 (n.a), day 3(lyrica), day 4 (n.a), day (lyrica)
Wk 2 - BREAK (kava kava or kratom)

Would this regime still rack up my tolerance and dependency? I don't want build any depedency and suffer those dreadful wd's ive been reading. And I really think this med can really benefit me, as my anxiety has really affected my social life. Adderall/Dex for my ADD has improved it to some what extenxt, but once it wears off I don't like to be around anyone.

 

[Jrhguitarist1]

I completely understand what your askin I hope lol, but really lyrica isn't gonna help a lot with anxiety I say this because I was on lyrica for a year before starting anti-D's I found that yes the first couple of weeks it will work wounders for you but even at a slow pace as your stating the drug stays in your system for so long the natural tolerance builds. And tolerance to lyrica is what a doctor actually looks for as a good sign they know it's gonna make you loopy for couple weeks till your body regulates it and then your to your plateau per say and that's when they look at you again and say how much is this dose helping, if your fine then they'll stick with it if not they up it and so on. I just know when I got regulated that all my anxious and mood swings came right back and I wound up still needing anti depressants and they worked for me. But don't hold your breath to think it'll rid you of problems that other meds are there to take care of. But hell give it a go it just maybe that little bit your lookin for go into it with no expectations.

 

[pharma-sutra]

thanks for your heads up. I'll probably be weary about dosing too often then, implement an even longer spacing between my doses. But I'm definitely going to give it a go.
Anyone else have anything to add or input? Much appreciated. Thanks

 

[syntheticbreakfast]

Sorry I really have not input here nor experienced with the substances named..however im quite interested in using pregabalin as an anxiolytic. How did you find it in terms of fighting anxiety and as a social lubricant? I noticed you said that you managed to not build any tolerance to pregabalin even though you've been on it for over a year now, how did the process go? I assume that you must've started dosing around 75mg x3 a day? then built up to 1200-1500mg and was able to control it from going up by restricting yourself from using for only a max of 4x / month? I'm not looking for any "recreational high" so I won't dare to go up any heroic doses and might follow a similar regime like a couple times a week tops. Would I be able to maintain a tolerance of only 600mg?

I thought I'd reply in your thread instead of mine, to keep the topics separate. Anyway, I've always used pregabalin recreationally. My first dose of PGN was something like 525 mg, and I fell in love with it from the start. But the most days I've ever taken it consecutively was four. The reason for that is because by the fourth day, the effects are significantly diminished, especially the recreational effects. And that's what I was after. So I don't take the drug daily. Not only is it really addictive (apparently the withdrawals can be hell), but it may or may not suppress the ability of your brain to create new synapses. That might be the explanation for why some daily users of gabapentin or pregabalin complain about a mind-fogging effect.

As far as its ability as an anxiolytic goes, I think it's one of the best, at least when you don't have a high tolerance. In low doses, benzos work better for me, but if I take 600 mg or more of PGN, benzos don't even compare. I cannot experience anxiety at such a dose. Another comparison (to give you an idea of its anxiolytic ability) would be alcohol. I think pregabalin is a better anxiolytic than alcohol. One thing to keep in mind is that pregabalin is really a hit or a miss drug. Some people love it, others don't understand how it could ever be euphoric or recreational. So you'll have to try it for yourself to decide. And you should try a range of doses (unless you plan to take it every day, of course).

You definitely wouldn't get much tolerance from taking it twice a week, but that wouldn't be the best therapy because you'd only have relief 2/7 days. And if you really like it, you might be tempted to take it more than twice a week. Honestly (and this is my opinion), I don't think pharmacology is a very good way to treat anxiety at all. Taking benzos, pregabalin, ethanol or opiates works very well for the symptoms of anxiety, but none of those drugs treat the cause of your anxiety. Anxiety doesn't happen because a lack of pregabalin in the brain. I would recommend trying cognitive behavioral therapy and not taking a daily prescription that suppresses anxiety. As long as you don't treat the cause, the anxiety will always come back with a vengeance in the end.

 

[pharma-sutra]

I thought I'd reply in your thread instead of mine, to keep the topics separate. Anyway, I've always used pregabalin recreationally. My first dose of PGN was something like 525 mg, and I fell in love with it from the start. But the most days I've ever taken it consecutively was four. The reason for that is because by the fourth day, the effects are significantly diminished, especially the recreational effects. And that's what I was after. So I don't take the drug daily. Not only is it really addictive (apparently the withdrawals can be hell), but it may or may not suppress the ability of your brain to create new synapses. That might be the explanation for why some daily users of gabapentin or pregabalin complain about a mind-fogging effect.

As far as its ability as an anxiolytic goes, I think it's one of the best, at least when you don't have a high tolerance. In low doses, benzos work better for me, but if I take 600 mg or more of PGN, benzos don't even compare. I cannot experience anxiety at such a dose. Another comparison (to give you an idea of its anxiolytic ability) would be alcohol. I think pregabalin is a better anxiolytic than alcohol. One thing to keep in mind is that pregabalin is really a hit or a miss drug. Some people love it, others don't understand how it could ever be euphoric or recreational. So you'll have to try it for yourself to decide. And you should try a range of doses (unless you plan to take it every day, of course).

You definitely wouldn't get much tolerance from taking it twice a week, but that wouldn't be the best therapy because you'd only have relief 2/7 days. And if you really like it, you might be tempted to take it more than twice a week. Honestly (and this is my opinion), I don't think pharmacology is a very good way to treat anxiety at all. Taking benzos, pregabalin, ethanol or opiates works very well for the symptoms of anxiety, but none of those drugs treat the cause of your anxiety. Anxiety doesn't happen because a lack of pregabalin in the brain. I would recommend trying cognitive behavioral therapy and not taking a daily prescription that suppresses anxiety. As long as you don't treat the cause, the anxiety will always come back with a vengeance in the end.

Hey! Thanks for the reply, I really appreciate your response. Good advice and the answer I was looking for.

 

[Charles Ferdinand]

I used to take 1200mg of Lyrica and 4 of clonazepam daily for 2 years for Generalized Anxiety and Social phobia with panic attacks.
It was amazing, the high felt like 8 hrs of GHB.
Then it stopped working.
Memantine and other NMDA antagonists potentiate the stuff too, not just benzos.
But that was an incredibly HIGH dose.
I think if you are gonna use it at therapeutic doses (up to 600mg) then you're not gonna have problems of it "pooping out".
Try the lowest possible dose, and at least an hour before or after every meal, as food hampers absorption (well just the TMax)
Good luck!

 

[carl0s]

It worked well for me at 75mg twice daily. Anxiety caused by MDMA abuse.
I've since reduced to 50mg twice daily.
I just missed a dose earlier by accident and I feel horrific. I usually take the evening dose at 6pm. At 8:45pm I started to feel very bad indeed. I was with a friend/customer who was asking me lots of things and I became very uncomfortable. I thought it was just my weak stress threshold, so I went to the car and ate 2mg diazepam. I then continued to feel like a shaking nervous alien in the guys house, but I stood up and helped myself to cups of water and stuff.
It was only when I left his house that I realised I had forgotten to take the pregabalin.

I suspect that the withdrawal effects from pregabalin can take some time to recover from. By that, I mean that if you hit the withdrawal, and then take the missed dose a bit later, it doesn't fully sooth the discomfort. It's like you got kicked in the balls by missing the dose, and your balls carry on hurting for a few days afterwards. I'm beginning to think this might be the case anyway, as this is the second time I have felt unwell while lowering or missing a dose, and then trying to make up for it by taking more pregabalin, and it doesn't fully fix the discomfort.

 

[Charles Ferdinand]

Lyrica withdrawal (for me, and from many experiences I've known about people who take it) usually lasts a week at most and is not even nearly as discomforting as benzo wd.
I actually think of it as a piñata compared to benzo wd.
And I don't know why you feel wd symptoms so fast! Yes, pregabalin half life is of 6 hours (terminal life of 12), but its effects last, on some people, well into the other day, just read the pregabalin thread here somewhere, and the thread titled something like 'could Lyrica become a street drug?'
Maybe you need a higher single dose when you start your day, maybe add a (very) little nmda antagonist or benzo. Can't know for sure, ask your doctor and do what s/he says.
Regards!

 

[carl0s]

Lyrica withdrawal (for me, and from many experiences I've known about people who take it) usually lasts a week at most and is not even nearly as discomforting as benzo wd.
I actually think of it as a piñata compared to benzo wd.
And I don't know why you feel wd symptoms so fast! Yes, pregabalin half life is of 6 hours (terminal life of 12), but its effects last, on some people, well into the other day, just read the pregabalin thread here somewhere, and the thread titled something like 'could Lyrica become a street drug?'
Maybe you need a higher single dose when you start your day, maybe add a (very) little nmda antagonist or benzo. Can't know for sure, ask your doctor and do what s/he says.
Regards!

You were correct Charles.

I took advantage of my 1 week vacation abroad with my family, to stop the pregabalin altogether. I think I was on 50mg BID. I stopped it cold turkey and felt no ill effects, other than my usual daily weirdness.

Unfortunately that means that my freakout was simply my usual anxiety/stress weirdness. which is a particular problem if I'm stuck in a stressful environment/being quizzed by a customer/staring at a computer screen with them over my shoulder or something for longer than I'm happy with. This was an evening job that I don't usually get involved in, but because I was going away, I went to the chap's house and was there for a few hours late into the evening.

Thankfully I may have found the right medicine now.

 

[laCster]

yes yes yes yes!!! lyrica is one of the best anxiolytics, especially for social anxiety. it makes me soo talkative and i love it, it brings euphoria to me. even though the recreational effects fade quickly, if you take it daily it is a great anxiolytic on par with benzos, while having a lower addiction risk possibility, and limited withdrawals IME. i never experience withdrawals when i came off daily lyrica, i had sleeping issues for 2-3 days, maybe a little lethargy, and a little aches, but nothing compared to opiates or benzos IME. it also makes colors rreally bright and fascination

 

[carl0s]

yes yes yes yes!!! lyrica is one of the best anxiolytics, especially for social anxiety. it makes me soo talkative and i love it, it brings euphoria to me. even though the recreational effects fade quickly, if you take it daily it is a great anxiolytic on par with benzos, while having a lower addiction risk possibility, and limited withdrawals IME. i never experience withdrawals when i came off daily lyrica, i had sleeping issues for 2-3 days, maybe a little lethargy, and a little aches, but nothing compared to opiates or benzos IME. it also makes colors rreally bright and fascination

It really wasn't doing anything for me any more when I stopped it. Yes I was on a low dose, but still, it had stopped doing anything.

Not long after I started taking it, I tried larger doses, and didn't get much excitement from them. I did however find that I couldn't ejaculate...

 

[helium-4]

yes yes yes yes!!! lyrica is one of the best anxiolytics, especially for social anxiety. it makes me soo talkative and i love it, it brings euphoria to me. even though the recreational effects fade quickly, if you take it daily it is a great anxiolytic on par with benzos, while having a lower addiction risk possibility, and limited withdrawals IME. i never experience withdrawals when i came off daily lyrica, i had sleeping issues for 2-3 days, maybe a little lethargy, and a little aches, but nothing compared to opiates or benzos IME. it also makes colors rreally bright and fascination

I've never had pregabalin unfortunately, but I've had/used gabapentin for a long time (about a year or so) and I found its anxiolytic effects for social anxiety to be extremely solid. Its not the best for general anxiety, like benzos are, but I found its effect for social anxiety to be superior to benzos.

 

[laCster]

I've never had pregabalin unfortunately, but I've had/used gabapentin for a long time (about a year or so) and I found its anxiolytic effects for social anxiety to be extremely solid. Its not the best for general anxiety, like benzos are, but I found its effect for social anxiety to be superior to benzos.

i completely agree! gabapentin is the same pharmocological properties, but the body abosrbs extremely weird, and it is not as lyrica.
the only way i got a buzz of gabapentin is if i stacked it throughout the day reaching like 2400-3000 mgs, if i tried to do it ttwo days in a row, i did not feel any effects. tolerance to euphoric effects grows extremely rapidly, more than drug;. i found it worked best is if i only did it 1-2 times a week witha minimum of 3-4 days not taking itl

lyrica is hands down better. i love this drug, but it is the most expensive pharm like ever, even with insurance. jesus christ i cannot even explain how much i pay

 

[carl0s]

i completely agree! gabapentin is the same pharmocological properties, but the body abosrbs extremely weird, and it is not as lyrica.
the only way i got a buzz of gabapentin is if i stacked it throughout the day reaching like 2400-3000 mgs, if i tried to do it ttwo days in a row, i did not feel any effects. tolerance to euphoric effects grows extremely rapidly, more than drug;. i found it worked best is if i only did it 1-2 times a week witha minimum of 3-4 days not taking itl

lyrica is hands down better. i love this drug, but it is the most expensive pharm like ever, even with insurance. jesus christ i cannot even explain how much i pay

The generic is cheap in 75mg form from some well known internet pharms. It's even cheaper if you have a friend who lives in India. I think I gave my mate £30 for 300x50mg. The higher dosages cost about the same, it's just that I wanted 50mg to reduce my dose.

 

[Choosing_Positive]

i completely agree! gabapentin is the same pharmocological properties, but the body abosrbs extremely weird, and it is not as lyrica.
the only way i got a buzz of gabapentin is if i stacked it throughout the day reaching like 2400-3000 mgs, if i tried to do it ttwo days in a row, i did not feel any effects. tolerance to euphoric effects grows extremely rapidly, more than drug;. i found it worked best is if i only did it 1-2 times a week witha minimum of 3-4 days not taking itl

lyrica is hands down better. i love this drug, but it is the most expensive pharm like ever, even with insurance. jesus christ i cannot even explain how much i pay

IDK how expensive it is because I got sample bottles. I tried it one day and felt really good but bad loss of balance. So I stopped. Here it is a week or so later and I missed something really important due to my pain level (stayed in bed all day), so I tried the Lyrica again. I just took 225mg's so I will wait an hour to see how they treat me.

Wish me good luck and relief, if you can spare the few, please fellow BL's...

 

[Choosing_Positive]

Well, here it is...a few hours later. I feel energized and the pain has subsided a little bit, enough to get me up and around. Still have a little balance issues, even with the lower dosage, but not bad at all. I am pretty impressed with this drug (lyrica), but I also have some reservations about using it daily, for pain control maintenance...

 

[pharma-sutra]

Hey, sorry for bumping the thread, but I talked my doctor about social anxiety and he offered me samples of Cipralex 10mg. Told me to try out 5mg and I should see effects within 3 days. And wanted me to go back in a week to talk about the progress. We talked about newer medications and Gabapentin was mentioned, along with Quetiapine. Now from my research, I know Gabapentin just isn't as effective as Pregabalin and I have a family member who has bipolor and is one Quetiapine and I don't know...I feel sketched out to even try that. I told my doctor that I didn't want to try any SSRIs because all the horror stories I've read about such as serotonin syndrome and suicidal/homicidal tendencies. I'll see him next week again, how should I bring up that I'd rather try out Lyrica than these other options he's offering?

 

[RobotRipping]

i don't think any SSRIs are known for causing serotonin syndrome on their own. They aren't meant for anxiety though, even though they are heavily marketed as anxiolytics, there is no proof that more serotonin in the synapse = anxiolysis. So i wouldn't bother with the cipralex, especially if you aren't depressed. I was prescribed cipralex at 10mg up to 20mg for anxiety and it flat lined my emotions, murdered my sex drive, creativity and didn't do anything for my anxiety. The discontinuation syndrome (withdrawal) was pretty bad too. It's one of the better SSRIs though so if you have to be on one, i'd go with it.

Quetiapine is a heavy fucking drug, it will turn you into a zombie and worsen your anxiety if anything. I can see who it's useful for psychotic patients but it really should not be prescribed for anxiety to anyone in the world. I am currently prescribed 50mg/night for anxiety and i actually can't take it because 1) i end up sleeping for 12-14 hours then wake up suicidal 2) have terrible nightmares. Other than money for pharm companies i dont see any reason why this shit should be prescribed for anxiety.

Gabapentin isn't as potent as pregabalin but it may work okay for anxiety, i know it hits me really hard but tolerance builds too quickly for daily use. It also has the problem of weight gain (same with lyrica), which is a huge issue. Ask your Dr. for lyrica but i'd take the gabapentin out of those 3 options, at least it helps. If he is willing to prescribe gabapentin then i can't see why he wouldn't go for lyrica.

 

[carl0s]

Try low dose (5mg, increasing to 10mg a week later) clomipramine. For me, there is no point of existence for any other antidepressant.

 

[pharma-sutra]

@RobotRipping

Thanks brother! That really helps and yeah I might just tell him that I'd rather not go on SSRIs, because 1.) I don't have depression 2.)decreased sex drive, unstable emotions are contradictory to the desired anxiolytic relief that I am seeking, only reason I'm seeking an effective anxiolytic is because of my social withdrawal!

I'll probably go for the Gabapentin if he doesn't prescribe Lyrica. I'm not even going to bother with Quetiapine, because I know about the drowsy, shit mornings that one suffers when waking up. Even the doc admitted it, but he said to use my ADD meds to counteract that! wtf! I can't believe a doctor actually recommended using another drug to counteract the peripheral effects of another...talk about insane crashes

Try low dose (5mg, increasing to 10mg a week later) clomipramine. For me, there is no point of existence for any other antidepressant.

How does clomipramine compare to pregabalin as anxiolytics? by the way, how does SSRIs/antidepressants react if you are also a chronic pot smoker?