⫸STICKY⫷ PMMA - Reactions to Marquis, Mandelin, Mecke, Simons & Robadope (GC-MS Verified)

[Ekstasis-//7]

Here are the reactions using all 5 reagents to a White Speckled 'e' pill. A couple of these pills were GC-MS tested and found to contain varying amounts of PMMA. A sample was sent to me for reagent testing (by the person who arranged the GC-MS testing). I have now flushed the sample. Below you will find a picture including all 5 reagents with a detailed description of each reaction. If in the future the image is removed from the file server just PM me and I'll re-post it.

I have read as many forensic and law enforcement papers on reagent test kit results as I can find and I would assume from my reading and results that PMA will have the same reactions to Marquis, Mandelin and Mecke as PMMA does here. Obviously Simons should not react to PMA (whereas with PMMA it does). Also Robadope should react pink/red to PMA (whereas PMMA does not).

Below you will find links to two pill reports on the same PMMA pill. Unfortunately you'll see in the second link under the comments of the pill report that one user only tested with Mandelin and in error believed he was consuming ketamine. He even proceeded to tell others he believed it was ketamine. I'm not here to blame this user. I'm only raising this issue to inform people of the great importance of accurately identifying PMMA and PMA. As far as I know these PMMA pills have killed and hospitalised a number of people. If for some reason you cannot afford or get access to all 5 reagents please at least use Marquis and Mandelin (sometimes called E and E2 at smoke shops).

http://www.pillreports.net/index.php?page=display_pill&id=30388

http://www.pillreports.net/index.php?page=display_pill&id=30064

 

[bogman]

http://www.ecstasydata.org/view.php?id=2796

this is a PMA pill I sent for testing.

also sent a pill with a mix of mdma/pmma http://www.ecstasydata.org/view.php?id=2823

 

[Oldred3s]

Yeah that second report was mine.

At first I did think my result was K as the test results are similar.
I ended up doing a second test on another one of these that same night and the result turned
A purple colour then brown. Very weird test results for me. That's why I changed the results to unknown and put a warning on them. I did get back to the guy I got em off and told him told him to dump them or suffer the consiquenses.
(Stupid I know), I ended up consuming them and the effects I got from them were strange,
I had em in quarters and they came on quite quickly cos I racked little lines.
I personally didn't mind ten as I got no bad effects from them, not even over heating. Not even the people who ha em with me had any negative effects. I told my mates not to have them as I wasn't sure what they were.
As I said it was careless but I took them in very controlled doses. I don't need a lecture. I only gave em the pills as they wanted to try them knowing they could be bad ( said they are either K or PMA and made them aware of what PMA was)
We all had lines that were really small (10-15mg)
And only had a few of these.
I understand you weren't having a go at me I just wanted to say my experience.
We all actually got the opposite effects of PMA.
I found they felt exactly like MDMA minus the love. I had eye wiggles, jaw chatters, was heaps chatty
But the weirdest thing was none of us got hot. We all got cold but not freezing cold just got a bit chilli.
In no way do I condone the use of adulterated pills especially ones that condone PMMA or PMA.

 

[Ekstasis-//7]

^^ Thank you for your report. Interesting reading. I did enjoy reading a trip report a couple of years ago on PMA. You are right though the big danger is in overdose and it sounds like you didn't have enough to get any serious overheating or noticeable hypertension. I guess the thing to keep in mind with these compounds it that some people might be fine at a reasonable dose and some could be in a life threatening situation. Unfortunately from my reading of PMA it seems to suggest even the smallest active dose range reported in Pihkal by Shulgin that there were very obvious signs of it being really unhealthy

(with 60 mg) At just over an hour, there was a sudden blood pressure rise, with the systolic going up 55 mm

If my systolic BP went from 120mm/Hg up to 175mm/Hg I'd be like "oh shit" and start worrying about hypertension and whether or not to get paramedics.

It does baffle me that despite Shilgin's early documented negative experiences and commentary about these two dangerous and not really very interesting sounding compounds PMA and PMMA they have continued to become not just synthed by some select few strange enthusiasts but actually sold to the unsuspecting public as (fake) MDA or MDMA. I have no idea why they'd even make it in the first place considering the vast library of other compounds that sounded much more interesting that Shulgin and others created.

Shilgin's comments on PMMA experience does have similarities to your own. Feel free to have a read if you haven't already. Notice though even though the dose is higher than PMA that he comments that in extensive animal tests it caused catatonia and therefore he felt it was unsafe.

Shulgin's Pihkal entry on PMA
Shulgin's Pihkal entry on PMMA

Maybe worth mentioning that feeling hot is maybe not likely what you'd feel when you get start overheating from serotonin syndrome. From reports I've read it's more like a fever where your internal body temperature gauge becomes affected. You feel cold, shiver and want to rug up at the beginning but actually your body temperature is rising. Only later on when it's up you may start to notice you feel like shit from your head being too hot and your forehead is hot to touch with your hand by then it may or may not be at a dangerously high level. It's medically documented in the MDMA trials that MDMA (at 125mg) on it's own even when pharmaceutically pure consistently causes a small increase in body temperature (from memory it was on average ↑0.5°C). I myself even at home resting find I can get a cold shivering feeling at in the initial come up with with MDMA then after a little white my forehead feels warm to touch. When I've taken my temperature using a mouth thermometer it's been a quite safe ↑0.5°C. The thing is since my bodies internal temperature gauge is affected I don't know how hot I am. With there now being a documented report of a pill GC-MS tested by ecstasydata.org containing MDMA and PMMA it would be a wise precaution to invest the 2 bucks or so to get a cheap digital thermometer from ebay and use it if you're at home. If you are out and on a new pill regularly take breaks from dancing. Check with your hand if your forehead feels hot or get a friend to check it for you. If you feel hot or are in a hot club take regular breaks to the bathroom and spash cold water on your face, neck and arms. (Besides it feels great when you're on MDMA anyway ).

 

[uncle_bud]

Here is our research:

PMA,PMEA and PMMA will not react to: Marquis, Ehrlich, p-DMAB-TS. PMA also won't react to Simons.

So there really i no way with reagent's to differentite between them, except PMA from PMEA/PMMA.

All samples are GC/MS verified.