Ondansetron for 2C-T-x nausea
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perpetualdawn
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I was literally just wondering the same thing.
Limpet_Chicken
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Ondansetron AFAIK isn't a 5HT2c agonist, it's primary mode of action is as an antagonist of 5HT3 receptors (trivia-as is known thus far at least, 5HT3 is the only one of our serotonin receptor types which is ionotropic, rather than metabotropic)
Not tested it with 2C-T-x, but it is one hell of an antinauseant. It isn't the easiest thing to get a script for, but if one can, or get it online, either way, it IS bloody effective stuff. Probably the most effective antinauseant/antiemetic I've ever used. It's brought me from curled up in the foetal position vomiting first torrential gouts of gone-off pea-soup shade of dark green, stinking slime that definitely was NOT 'vomit' as one usually pictures the word, after a severe bout of food poisoning that landed me in the ER, got discharged later, then it put me right back in there the next day, collapsed in the toilets, then again in the waiting room.
Then after the green, acidic horrendous toxic waste material was all puked out, blood-streaked bile, every few minutes. Couldn't so much as take a sip of water, could barely take enough cold water to wash the acid from my throat, which at the time, was way, way more corrosive-feeling than puke ought to be. I've thrown up as has more or less anyone, enough times to know it when I do it, lol, but that, it felt as if my stomach lining had stopped secreting HCl and decided to switch to highly concentrated HClO4. Sort of stuff that'd strip the enamel from a shitter bowl and leave smoking, steaming pits in it.
Got given a dose of ondansetron, immediately threw it right back up there, whole, seconds later, so they shot me up with more, and damn, took tens of seconds to minutes, to go from the foetal position, spewing up things that have no business ever being within 20 meters of a human body, much less inside one, to sitting propped up and reading.
As for scripting, docs seem to HATE giving it out on rx, especially either repeat or 'as requested' basis, it took me quite a lot of attempts, only succeeding when I had that testimony of efficacy first hand, to give my GP (I'd been having a lot of nasty GI issues anyway), because it is HORRENDOUSLY expensive to the NHS. Don't get why, but fucking hell, it can't be costing as much to make as big pharma are charging for it.
Not that much short of 90 quid, for a weeks supply of tablets, 4mg I think. My copy of the BNF lists suppositories as one form it can be dispensed in, for the obvious reason of being unable to puke via one's anus (although that bout of food poisoning looked like it had other ideas, and anatomy be damned....) and the cost of ONE dose, is about a tenner,
One of the biggest ripoff scams for any conventional medicine IMO (by conventional, I mean, not counting things like gene therapy, antisense antiviral agents based on morpholino mRNA transcripts, vaccines available in very small amounts grown in transgenic plants, etc.), but something that comes from chemical ingredients, being reacted in laboratory equipment, by chemists, rather than biotechnicians with fermenters and bioreactors; the kind of thing where yields are desired in kilograms or multiple tens or hundreds of kilos, not micrograms of MABs and RNA interference agents, retroviral vectors to deliver gene therapy to the cell nucleus, rather than potentially unstable plasmid expression. Goggles and gas masks, not micropipettes and rt-PCR.
Ondanstron is disgustingly, obscenely offensively expensive and overpriced to health services. To the point it isn't making a sale by big pharma, it's demanding the health system bend over and shout 'rape me with a splintery old broomstick studded in rusty razorblades and nails hammered in, do it hard and make my eyes fucking bleed because I WANT IT!!!'
Not tested it with 2C-T-x, but it is one hell of an antinauseant. It isn't the easiest thing to get a script for, but if one can, or get it online, either way, it IS bloody effective stuff. Probably the most effective antinauseant/antiemetic I've ever used. It's brought me from curled up in the foetal position vomiting first torrential gouts of gone-off pea-soup shade of dark green, stinking slime that definitely was NOT 'vomit' as one usually pictures the word, after a severe bout of food poisoning that landed me in the ER, got discharged later, then it put me right back in there the next day, collapsed in the toilets, then again in the waiting room.
Then after the green, acidic horrendous toxic waste material was all puked out, blood-streaked bile, every few minutes. Couldn't so much as take a sip of water, could barely take enough cold water to wash the acid from my throat, which at the time, was way, way more corrosive-feeling than puke ought to be. I've thrown up as has more or less anyone, enough times to know it when I do it, lol, but that, it felt as if my stomach lining had stopped secreting HCl and decided to switch to highly concentrated HClO4. Sort of stuff that'd strip the enamel from a shitter bowl and leave smoking, steaming pits in it.
Got given a dose of ondansetron, immediately threw it right back up there, whole, seconds later, so they shot me up with more, and damn, took tens of seconds to minutes, to go from the foetal position, spewing up things that have no business ever being within 20 meters of a human body, much less inside one, to sitting propped up and reading.
As for scripting, docs seem to HATE giving it out on rx, especially either repeat or 'as requested' basis, it took me quite a lot of attempts, only succeeding when I had that testimony of efficacy first hand, to give my GP (I'd been having a lot of nasty GI issues anyway), because it is HORRENDOUSLY expensive to the NHS. Don't get why, but fucking hell, it can't be costing as much to make as big pharma are charging for it.
Not that much short of 90 quid, for a weeks supply of tablets, 4mg I think. My copy of the BNF lists suppositories as one form it can be dispensed in, for the obvious reason of being unable to puke via one's anus (although that bout of food poisoning looked like it had other ideas, and anatomy be damned....) and the cost of ONE dose, is about a tenner,
One of the biggest ripoff scams for any conventional medicine IMO (by conventional, I mean, not counting things like gene therapy, antisense antiviral agents based on morpholino mRNA transcripts, vaccines available in very small amounts grown in transgenic plants, etc.), but something that comes from chemical ingredients, being reacted in laboratory equipment, by chemists, rather than biotechnicians with fermenters and bioreactors; the kind of thing where yields are desired in kilograms or multiple tens or hundreds of kilos, not micrograms of MABs and RNA interference agents, retroviral vectors to deliver gene therapy to the cell nucleus, rather than potentially unstable plasmid expression. Goggles and gas masks, not micropipettes and rt-PCR.
Ondanstron is disgustingly, obscenely offensively expensive and overpriced to health services. To the point it isn't making a sale by big pharma, it's demanding the health system bend over and shout 'rape me with a splintery old broomstick studded in rusty razorblades and nails hammered in, do it hard and make my eyes fucking bleed because I WANT IT!!!'
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Well fuck, I'll try one day. They give me Lyrica and that only costs them 50 eur for 54x75mg afaik.
I just have to figure out what to say to get it. Or maybe try asking one of my friends who are doctors now lol.
Idk, Slovenia is weird when it comes to this. Some medications you can get by the truckload even if you don't need them (neighbour had a Xanax auto refil script for 30 or 60 1mg pills per month and sold them). Dude I went to school with had adhd and got huge Ritalin doses. I got 1 month of Clindamycin for a knee infection. Grandfather got some experimental anlzhimers meds (sorry idk which ones, but they literally reversed his disease by two years). But on the other hand I have to argue about 5 mg zolpidem during a heat wave since it was so hot I couldn't sleep (told her to write me a script for ac instead). Friend who's only 32 gets free Viagra (or Cialis idk), grandma had bad anaemia before she died and got more EPO than Lance Armstrong ever saw.
And then you have people on the low en of normal test lvls with symptoms of low test getting trt almost impossible and even if they get it it's something stupid like 100 mg every two weeks. Not something that would put them in the high normal during the lowest periods.
My gp already thinks I just want to get fucked up so why nod ask for ondansetron.
I just have to figure out what to say to get it. Or maybe try asking one of my friends who are doctors now lol.
Idk, Slovenia is weird when it comes to this. Some medications you can get by the truckload even if you don't need them (neighbour had a Xanax auto refil script for 30 or 60 1mg pills per month and sold them). Dude I went to school with had adhd and got huge Ritalin doses. I got 1 month of Clindamycin for a knee infection. Grandfather got some experimental anlzhimers meds (sorry idk which ones, but they literally reversed his disease by two years). But on the other hand I have to argue about 5 mg zolpidem during a heat wave since it was so hot I couldn't sleep (told her to write me a script for ac instead). Friend who's only 32 gets free Viagra (or Cialis idk), grandma had bad anaemia before she died and got more EPO than Lance Armstrong ever saw.
And then you have people on the low en of normal test lvls with symptoms of low test getting trt almost impossible and even if they get it it's something stupid like 100 mg every two weeks. Not something that would put them in the high normal during the lowest periods.
My gp already thinks I just want to get fucked up so why nod ask for ondansetron.
Limpet_Chicken
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Well he can't use that excuse for ondansetron, it isn't recreational in the slightest. It stops people throwing up, it stops people feeling miserable because they are about to throw up, and it stops them being nauseous. What it doesn't do, is get anyone high, in any way, ever.
It's just very, very, VERY good at doing exactly what it says on the tin, so to speak. This stuff has even killed off 70cl and 1l bottles of rum/vodka in a night hangover-yarks. The sort of thing where you cannot hold ANYTHING down, at all. Including meds to make one feel better.
So a few tablets of ondansetron pulverized and liquefied, stuck up the theresa may. and nausea? horrendous exorcist-esque yarking my insides outside? WHAT yarking my insides outside?
Reason docs don't like giving it out, isn't because it is abusable, it isn't, but because it is disgustingly, freakishly, fucked-up expensive.
What it costs the NHS, according to my (admittedly a few years out of date, and rather badly iodinated in places, a few pages chewed up by bromine, but still, most of it's alright, or in on piece, at least) copy of the BNF, it's shockingly expensive.
I have to wonder, being a cynical cunt, is if this is because ondansetron is often used for treating people who are on chemo regimes for sickness accompanying the chemotherapy. Chemo meds have a bit of a sick and twisted history of being massively overpriced IMO.
Not in slovenia myself, UK (obviously, from the NHS and BNF references of course), and I don't think it's unique to there. Perhaps it is more prevalent, but not unique. It depends partly on country, partly on individual doctors too.
Some of them are just plain weird.
Fr.ex my GP, I had no problem whatsoever getting on chlormethiazole (old, old OLD-school wallbanger depressant, barbiturate-like action, nasty reputation in OD and interacts with alcohol to potentiate each other hugely and dangerously), to prevent and treat my seizures, despite that it's ancient, and not even licensed here for seizure control or relief. Only short term anxiety, insomnia, and alcohol detox, the latter being mainly in-patient.
Got a nitrazepam rx, asked for a temporary one, specifically asked them for a TEMPORARY benzo rx, specifying ideally nitrazepam, as from experience, basically it's the benzo I do best with out of the ones available to doctors. Told them exactly when the problem would be going away, it came, it went, and they never bothered stopping it. At first, for 4-5 weeks, maybe 3-4, they had me come in once a week, not to do anything, just to sit down, ask for the script, get it, thank them, and go. Then someone somewhere decided, I presume, that was taking up appointment slots needlessly. so hey, lets stick it on repeat. 10mg/d, for the last few years. Or at least, that is what they believe I am taking; since I don't actually take it anything anywhere near close to that frequently. Rather, I use it at higher dosages, for 2, maybe 3 days in a week, when my pain meds run low and I can't sleep otherwise, I'll take enough to knock me out cold, when mixed with my evening dose of chlormethiazole (not reccomending doing that, mixing the latter with other downers, unless one is familiar with both, AND how both interact with you, personally, already, in your own body. and not just familiarity, but absolute certainty)
That's from one doc at that practice. Another, quite simply, after being asked for ONE DAY's dosage of a benzo for a known and unavoidable event to come shortly, a single tablet would have been enough, assuming the benzo in question was of sufficient potency that the tablet sizes made would work at that dose, of course, and he flat out just told me not a chance, he doesn't prescribe benzodiazepines, to anybody, ever, for any reason. Why? because he doesn't like them. And they are addictive.
Surely logic dictates that a single unit dosage, for a hyper-acute requirement, does not a benzo physical dependency make.
Others, it varies, some would shove them down your neck given half a chance, another, once literally told me 'go have a seizure then' when informed that her refusal to provide that which was already on repeat and set up for rescue-pack dosing (to ensure I can treat a seizure, if I have one that breaks through, without that eating into my maintenance therapy supply.
Berated me, shouted and blew her ass ring out of her eyeteeth for taking a dose of the maintenance meds, and coming to get a rescue pack the next day, asked her, literally, 'so, what should I have done then? simply just ignored it and had a seizure? is this what you want me to do, do you know that the consequences of failing to keep with the plan already in place, for rescue-packs will be? explaining what said consequences would be, and if that was what she wished to happen to me.
She actually said 'yes, you should just go have a seizure then' Unbefuckinglievable. And SHE gets a wasp nest up her twat over a remark on leaving, along the lines of 'fucking christ, you aren't FIT to treat patients, and have the bedside manner and all the appeal of a sex offender in a paediatric oncology ward'
So it varies a LOT. Some docs are decent people, kind, humane, and get things done.
Some are all that, only they aren't great at getting shit done.
And right at the other end of the spectrum, there are those who's only interaction with medicine in any form whatsoever, ought to be confined to cytopathology labs, running blood cultures, flow cytometry, ELISA immunoassay testing, etc. because they have the compassion of a puff adder, and the bedside manner of jimmy saville, the competence of a decaying badger carcass, and are about as fit to be in the presence of a living, breathing patient, as it is good medical practice to bring round packs of half-starved rottweilers on hospital wards to lick up spilled food from around patient's beds.
Some of the worst, one step above dr.harold shipman, one tiny step away from actively murdering patients, the real arseholes, the shocking, unbelievably disgusting, knowingly endangering patients and not giving a shit, just want you gone somewhere else, even if it means, such as happened after a heart scare the other week, screaming in my face, and endlessly repeating himself, demanding I go and see my own GP.
After, that is, being politely informed (I had been both polite, and neither verbally nor physically threatening to the guy in any way whatsoever) that the doctor's surgery is closed on sundays, meaning it is impossible for me to comply.
Threatened first to call security, then the actual pork. All the while, after I'd told him, politely, for some reason, to get out of my face, that I'm autie, and I really, do not like people up in my face. Lost my cool with him in the end though, I confess. Some people just should not be practicing medicine at ALL, not even fucking looking at cell lines under the microscope.
Then there is say, my trying to get on memantine..its cheap enough to the NHS, I know for a damn fact the stuff is a near enough lifesaver for some neurological issues, it also STAMPS on opioid tolerance, with an iron-shod jackboot, both tolerance I have, tolerance I'd be incurring, as a chronic pain patient, treated (and berated for being one) by the same doc. Even more or less stops reinforcing effects as long as it isn't shot together in a 'memantine version of a speedball, opioid/memantine, that, IS reinforcing as hell, but otherwise, it fixes so many things, that it is hard even to determine how many. AND then there is that opioid long term therapy bonus.
Yet the damn doctor keeps saying 'yes, I'll support that', he's seemingly having to seek something from higher up the foodchain. It's not been months, it's been years. I've made presentations featuring research articles from respectable journals (even if they did need lifting from Elsevier, the bastards
) and sat down with him, explained how the rapid on-off binding kinetics, the low trapping at the NMDA receptor, and it's partially voltage-sensitive blockade means that it preferentially inhibits overactive channels, in other words, it does what it's meant to do, but unlike most NMDA antagonists, knows WHEN to do it as well as a lot better idea of HOW to do it.
Keep getting promises, but the only memantine I've gotten, has come from the fucking internet and I'm getting really damn annoyed with him quite frankly. Even after I lent the doc some of my old historical medical books from the 17th century to read for interest value, still not the script he keeps saying he is all for my having.
Surely, if I believe I should be on it, and know from experience that I respond extremely well, at what doses, what dosage intervals, know what it does and how it does it, and the doc, the senior GP who owns the practice, believes I ought to be on it also....then there ought to be a script issued accordingly.....
Because damnation take it, I cannot be treated with promises and hot air.
But it took walking to the very gates of hell to get an ondansetron rx.
Only after that horrendous bout of food poisoning (as if food poisoning comes in any other kind than horrendous, lol. That one was worse than any I've had before though, I was actually scared that it might finish me off) did they give me a script.
It's just very, very, VERY good at doing exactly what it says on the tin, so to speak. This stuff has even killed off 70cl and 1l bottles of rum/vodka in a night hangover-yarks. The sort of thing where you cannot hold ANYTHING down, at all. Including meds to make one feel better.
So a few tablets of ondansetron pulverized and liquefied, stuck up the theresa may. and nausea? horrendous exorcist-esque yarking my insides outside? WHAT yarking my insides outside?
Reason docs don't like giving it out, isn't because it is abusable, it isn't, but because it is disgustingly, freakishly, fucked-up expensive.
What it costs the NHS, according to my (admittedly a few years out of date, and rather badly iodinated in places, a few pages chewed up by bromine, but still, most of it's alright, or in on piece, at least) copy of the BNF, it's shockingly expensive.
I have to wonder, being a cynical cunt, is if this is because ondansetron is often used for treating people who are on chemo regimes for sickness accompanying the chemotherapy. Chemo meds have a bit of a sick and twisted history of being massively overpriced IMO.
Not in slovenia myself, UK (obviously, from the NHS and BNF references of course), and I don't think it's unique to there. Perhaps it is more prevalent, but not unique. It depends partly on country, partly on individual doctors too.
Some of them are just plain weird.
Fr.ex my GP, I had no problem whatsoever getting on chlormethiazole (old, old OLD-school wallbanger depressant, barbiturate-like action, nasty reputation in OD and interacts with alcohol to potentiate each other hugely and dangerously), to prevent and treat my seizures, despite that it's ancient, and not even licensed here for seizure control or relief. Only short term anxiety, insomnia, and alcohol detox, the latter being mainly in-patient.
Got a nitrazepam rx, asked for a temporary one, specifically asked them for a TEMPORARY benzo rx, specifying ideally nitrazepam, as from experience, basically it's the benzo I do best with out of the ones available to doctors. Told them exactly when the problem would be going away, it came, it went, and they never bothered stopping it. At first, for 4-5 weeks, maybe 3-4, they had me come in once a week, not to do anything, just to sit down, ask for the script, get it, thank them, and go. Then someone somewhere decided, I presume, that was taking up appointment slots needlessly. so hey, lets stick it on repeat. 10mg/d, for the last few years. Or at least, that is what they believe I am taking; since I don't actually take it anything anywhere near close to that frequently. Rather, I use it at higher dosages, for 2, maybe 3 days in a week, when my pain meds run low and I can't sleep otherwise, I'll take enough to knock me out cold, when mixed with my evening dose of chlormethiazole (not reccomending doing that, mixing the latter with other downers, unless one is familiar with both, AND how both interact with you, personally, already, in your own body. and not just familiarity, but absolute certainty)
That's from one doc at that practice. Another, quite simply, after being asked for ONE DAY's dosage of a benzo for a known and unavoidable event to come shortly, a single tablet would have been enough, assuming the benzo in question was of sufficient potency that the tablet sizes made would work at that dose, of course, and he flat out just told me not a chance, he doesn't prescribe benzodiazepines, to anybody, ever, for any reason. Why? because he doesn't like them. And they are addictive.
Surely logic dictates that a single unit dosage, for a hyper-acute requirement, does not a benzo physical dependency make.
Others, it varies, some would shove them down your neck given half a chance, another, once literally told me 'go have a seizure then' when informed that her refusal to provide that which was already on repeat and set up for rescue-pack dosing (to ensure I can treat a seizure, if I have one that breaks through, without that eating into my maintenance therapy supply.
Berated me, shouted and blew her ass ring out of her eyeteeth for taking a dose of the maintenance meds, and coming to get a rescue pack the next day, asked her, literally, 'so, what should I have done then? simply just ignored it and had a seizure? is this what you want me to do, do you know that the consequences of failing to keep with the plan already in place, for rescue-packs will be? explaining what said consequences would be, and if that was what she wished to happen to me.
She actually said 'yes, you should just go have a seizure then' Unbefuckinglievable. And SHE gets a wasp nest up her twat over a remark on leaving, along the lines of 'fucking christ, you aren't FIT to treat patients, and have the bedside manner and all the appeal of a sex offender in a paediatric oncology ward'
So it varies a LOT. Some docs are decent people, kind, humane, and get things done.
Some are all that, only they aren't great at getting shit done.
And right at the other end of the spectrum, there are those who's only interaction with medicine in any form whatsoever, ought to be confined to cytopathology labs, running blood cultures, flow cytometry, ELISA immunoassay testing, etc. because they have the compassion of a puff adder, and the bedside manner of jimmy saville, the competence of a decaying badger carcass, and are about as fit to be in the presence of a living, breathing patient, as it is good medical practice to bring round packs of half-starved rottweilers on hospital wards to lick up spilled food from around patient's beds.
Some of the worst, one step above dr.harold shipman, one tiny step away from actively murdering patients, the real arseholes, the shocking, unbelievably disgusting, knowingly endangering patients and not giving a shit, just want you gone somewhere else, even if it means, such as happened after a heart scare the other week, screaming in my face, and endlessly repeating himself, demanding I go and see my own GP.
After, that is, being politely informed (I had been both polite, and neither verbally nor physically threatening to the guy in any way whatsoever) that the doctor's surgery is closed on sundays, meaning it is impossible for me to comply.
Threatened first to call security, then the actual pork. All the while, after I'd told him, politely, for some reason, to get out of my face, that I'm autie, and I really, do not like people up in my face. Lost my cool with him in the end though, I confess. Some people just should not be practicing medicine at ALL, not even fucking looking at cell lines under the microscope.
Then there is say, my trying to get on memantine..its cheap enough to the NHS, I know for a damn fact the stuff is a near enough lifesaver for some neurological issues, it also STAMPS on opioid tolerance, with an iron-shod jackboot, both tolerance I have, tolerance I'd be incurring, as a chronic pain patient, treated (and berated for being one) by the same doc. Even more or less stops reinforcing effects as long as it isn't shot together in a 'memantine version of a speedball, opioid/memantine, that, IS reinforcing as hell, but otherwise, it fixes so many things, that it is hard even to determine how many. AND then there is that opioid long term therapy bonus.
Yet the damn doctor keeps saying 'yes, I'll support that', he's seemingly having to seek something from higher up the foodchain. It's not been months, it's been years. I've made presentations featuring research articles from respectable journals (even if they did need lifting from Elsevier, the bastards
) and sat down with him, explained how the rapid on-off binding kinetics, the low trapping at the NMDA receptor, and it's partially voltage-sensitive blockade means that it preferentially inhibits overactive channels, in other words, it does what it's meant to do, but unlike most NMDA antagonists, knows WHEN to do it as well as a lot better idea of HOW to do it.Keep getting promises, but the only memantine I've gotten, has come from the fucking internet and I'm getting really damn annoyed with him quite frankly. Even after I lent the doc some of my old historical medical books from the 17th century to read for interest value, still not the script he keeps saying he is all for my having.
Surely, if I believe I should be on it, and know from experience that I respond extremely well, at what doses, what dosage intervals, know what it does and how it does it, and the doc, the senior GP who owns the practice, believes I ought to be on it also....then there ought to be a script issued accordingly.....
Because damnation take it, I cannot be treated with promises and hot air.
But it took walking to the very gates of hell to get an ondansetron rx.
Only after that horrendous bout of food poisoning (as if food poisoning comes in any other kind than horrendous, lol. That one was worse than any I've had before though, I was actually scared that it might finish me off) did they give me a script.
perpetualdawn
Bluelighter
- Joined
- Nov 20, 2013
- Messages
- 2,920
If you don't want to try to get a Rx for ondanstron, you can find it reasonably priced through one of the well known rC vendors.