New water guidelines for licensed venues

[RaveSafeVIC]

New voluntary guidelines to provide free or low-cost drinking water on licensed premises!

On 20 January 2004, the Victorian Government launched Voluntary Guidelines to provide free or low-cost drinking water on licensed premises.

The Guidelines were deemed necessary following concerns raised that a lack of available free or low cost water on some licensed premises was impacting on the health and welfare of patrons in Victoria. The guidelines outline the requirement of operators and owners of licensed premises to ensure:

• free or reasonably priced drinking water is readily accessible to patrons on any premises where liquor is sold or supplied.
• When free drinking water is not feasible the charge must be less than the lowest price at which any alcoholic or non-alcoholic drink is sold.
• Cold unadulterated water should be available in all bathroom and toilets at licensed venues.

To monitor the success of these guidelines, it is encouraged that punters contact RaveSafe on 9419 3633, [email protected], or DirectLine (24hours) on 1800 888 236 if they have concerns about a venue not implementing these recommendations.

If venues would like to know more about these guidelines please contact the Department of Human Services on 9637 4007, or [email protected].

Although at this stage the guidelines are voluntary, Minister Pike has stated that the Government would assess compliance with the guidelines and, if they weren’t working, would seriously consider introducing legislation making the provision of free or low-cost drinking water compulsory.

Therefore, it is important that if you have concerns with particular venues that are not implementing the current voluntary guidelines, please inform either RaveSafe on 94193633 or Directline (24hours) 1800 888 236.

If evidence demonstrates that we need to move to legislation, then it is definately an option.

 

[Cowboy Mac]

Originally posted by RaveSafeVIC
Cold unadulterated water should be available in all bathroom and toilets at licensed venues.

Voluntary? Are any clubs with warm water and overpriced bottled water going to abide by these voluntary laws? No - because they are already money hungry whores. The clubs that don't limit the cold water in the bathrooms approach are the ones which probably will abide by the law, the ones which don't are the ones that need to.

I've been waiting years for a law to be passed that would make it illegal for clubs to have only warm water available in toilets. I don't mind paying a few bucks for one bottle, as long as I am able to refill it with cold water from the bathroom for free! It is one step closer to law now with this move, and lets hope its only a matter of time before they can be fined and forced to look after their patrons.

 

[Psychadelic_Paisly]

I've a million and one of these articles on this site unfortuantely.....and it never gets acknowleged by the clubs ...well some anyway. It's such a high killer when you're happy, then stick your bottle under the tap and it's hot :'(

 

[haste]

Although at this stage the guidelines are voluntary, Minister Pike has stated that the Government would assess compliance with the guidelines and, if they weren’t working, would seriously consider introducing legislation making the provision of free or low-cost drinking water compulsory.

Start considering cause whats the point of guidlines if they don't have to be followed?

Still, a step in the right direction

 

[apollo]

Let's hope this makes a difference for you guys...

I doubt the situation will ever change in NSW.

 

[The Earth Method]

how about this, get yourself fucked up dehydrated and pass out and then sue the bastards.

ok maybe a stupid idea but th eonly way theyll give a shit if someone takes their money.

And yeah melbournes pretty much the same in a lot of places which is why i only stick to the one club ..

 

[phase_dancer]

get yourself fucked up dehydrated and pass out and then sue the bastards

If what's profit today, is not to be taken with interest tomorrow; then *duty of care* needs to be viewed as the most essential priority. Especially since there wouldn't be many club managers silly enough to deny drugs are being taken/used on their premises.

With such an issue (H & S related), it's important to remember that;
what is, and isn't law today, may make no difference in court tomorrow when it's the DOC of the manager/ owner, and what was provided, which is being challenged.

I reckon that unless the laws are changed, we will be seeing law suites brought against clubs in the future. Whatever science proves MDMA can do- damage wise - will more than likely be claimed for. Especially if the claimant has ever bought pills inside the club. How does he/she prove it? The odd photo or club employee conviction with enough testimonies, may be all it takes.

How many of todays 18-25 year old regular clubbers will be feeling the general pinch of age at 35-40, but will believe it to be damage done by drugs? It may even be felt as a *genuine resentment* towards the clubs, bars etc. that "condoned" and acknowledged drug use, yet didn't provide an environment which is/ was safe to punters.

Lots of potential there I'd imagine.

You can scream all you like about alcohol being worse etc... ...and people do everyday. Thing is though, that's the government's responsibility in that alcohol is legal. But illicit drugs are different entirely. No-one has ever said it's OK to take em....and history says, that down the track, someone will be held accountable if it's at all possible get the shit to stick.

Sadly, it probably will take a law suite or death to shake the industry proper. I believe it could well be determined by the direction drug policies and legislation move in, as to the likely effectiveness of such future legal actions. However, like most legal precedents, one win could start a frenzy of claims, blame and accusations.

It's more than obvious that we need to arrive at sensible legislation and government supported assistance to regulate minimum provided provisions in acknowledged drug "houses" (clubs, etc.) Think about it: You advertise pumping DJ's, incorporate metaphorical titles etc. The punter knows the promoter is accommodating for the use of drugs, at least visually and aurally.

Yet lower temperatures, clean air, cold water, and more importantly, someone specifically employed to locate and assist attendants, are the known survival tools. Water is just the beginning. Having a registered medic on hand is the next important big step as far as duty of care goes. Hats off to those clubs who are doing this already

If you think this is all ridiculous, think about the past. An unconnected but possibly very relevant story was when the book Silent Spring by Rachel Carson changed the global face of chemical industry and environmental management. On a massive scale, companies sunk. Billions went to payouts, and the world has (thank goodness) never been the same again. Out of all this, the companies which were poised to survive were those who had either already been ethically or otherwise conscious of the environment, or as most probably did, simply foresaw their fate if environment management wasn't adopted as being crucial economic practice.

Preparation breeds Confidence. Time and the w0rd is approaching.

 

[Jubas]

Let's hope this makes a difference for you guys...

I doubt the situation will ever change in NSW.

amen to that.

although i guess i'm lucky.. most of the clubs i frequent do have cold water in the bathrooms.
i think it would be pretty hard to dehydrate yourself on purpose, and then prove liability against the club. besides, room temp water, as opposed to cold water affects the body faster doesn't it?

 

[apollo]

If I recall correctly Jubas, it's actually the other way around - cold water is absorbed quicker than warm water. That seems counter-intuitive somehow...

I'll look it up when I've got a bit more time!

 

[evandar]

Theres a nightclub in brisbane that has hot & soapy water running from the taps.

 

[Jubas]

If I recall correctly Jubas, it's actually the other way around - cold water is absorbed quicker than warm water. That seems counter-intuitive somehow...

I'll look it up when I've got a bit more time!

hehe, aight!
i thought the body had to warm up cold water before it could be absorbed.. i'd be interested to find out the truth though :D

 

[phase_dancer]

It's probably easier to think of it as energy. If you're hot, perspiring and already trying to rid the excess, what do you think will happen to the heat of the water. My bet is that you'll perspire just that little bit more.

 

[The Earth Method]

Jubas, proving that the club had only hot water would be spot on easy.

Convincing a judge/jury ( i actually have no idea how this sort of legal case would work in aus so correct me if im wrong ) would seem to be a case of connect the condition of the punter, ie passing out from dehydration to the fact that warm water contributed in any way to the condition of the punter would put obvious liability on the desicion of the club to only run warm water..

Well it works in logic.. dunno about in court.

 

[Jubas]

Convincing a judge/jury ( i actually have no idea how this sort of legal case would work in aus so correct me if im wrong ) would seem to be a case of connect the condition of the punter, ie passing out from dehydration to the fact that warm water contributed in any way to the condition of the punter would put obvious liability on the desicion of the club to only run warm water..

yeah, thats the bit i thought you might find difficult to do
i'm no legal expert either, but i think convincing a conservative jury that a club only providing warm water is dangerous to a drug user (oh my god! a drug user! addict! etc) makes the club liable, could be hard.

*scratches head*
did that make sense?

 

[Chubba75]

Yeah, give us damn ravers some cold water :D

It's a positive step for sure, for alcohol drinkers and also drug users (stimulants the majority).

 

[shakra]

wow! must be my age.. I've never had a problem getting a nice glass of water with ice in it from the bar at a club..

i guess theres no option other than to buy bottled water when you go to a huge event with thousands of people.. but I can't say that raving in Sydney have I ever experienced warm/hot water in the washrooms..

nor are they very dirty considering the number of people there on the night..

??? i may be in my own little world!

 

[Urbanhog]

Ya know sometimes at clubs they have a "tap" in mens toliet near where you piss? for hoses to wash off the piss smell from drunken/munted punters? I usually use that tap, jesus, I have forgetten the number of times people looked at me like a dickhead "collecting water" near where men piss.... that pissing wall/urial whatever its called, know what I mean? while the basin taps are warm.

 

[Jubas]

http://www.ifafitness.com/book1/hydration.htm

that site suggests cool water is absorbed faster than warm.. but doesn't refer to room temp water.
*Jubas continues his hunt
(and sorry for going slightly off topic)

edit:
annnnnd

Exercise Physiologist David Costill studied the effect of water temperature on absorption rate. (J. Appl. Physiol. 37:697, 1974). The research subjects who drank about two cups of ice water absorbed half of it in twenty minutes, as compared to those who drank warm water (900) and absorbed only one quarter of the amount. Despite popular belief, the cold water did not cause stomach cramps.

from http://www.nederland.k12.tx.us/lu/1272raw.htm

that site doesn't look like the most reliable, but the reference doesnt' appear to be fake. i wonder if i can find the actual study.

 

[beech]

Yeah hot water is a bitch. At recent event at in melbourne at club near Crown Casiono on the saturday of australia day weekend at which the worlds biggest trance dj played the tap water was hot. Not so hot you couldn't drink it but yeah still hot. You could go to the bar and get a glass of ice to put into your bottle to cool down the water. I wont I understand is that if the bar club is happy to give you a glass of ice to cool down your water why wont they just give you a glass of water, doesn't make a lot of sense. Bottled water was being sold for $4 for a 300ml bottle.
I can kinda see it from the venue's side. Compared to a pub or club with a non-drug taking crowd the would make sweet fuck all over the bar if they didn't charge for water. Not too many ravers drink alcohol all night. I think $4 for 300mls of water is a bit steep. I think it would be a better system to maybe pay like $10 or something for a bottle of water which can then be refilled with cold water from the bar or a water station throughout the night. This way the punters get their cold water for what i think is a reasonable price. $10 isn't a lot of money for your drinking requirements for the evening, and the venue is happy because they make the money required for them to run/survive. I think you gotta give a little to get a little.


Beech out

 

[Soma]

Guys,

Remember you can make a difference instead of just coming on here and complaining about it.

Next time you are on a licensed premises, and the cold water is hot, or you order a glass of soda and it is half the price of a bottle of water, then use the phone numbers provided or the email address.

By doing that you will have far more input into the matter than could ever be done by posting a message here.