Natural Supplementation and Weight Gaining Tips

S

Son ov Belial

Greenlighter
Joined
Jul 1, 2011
Messages
13
Location
Hell
Hi guys,

I was hoping some of you with your vast experience might be able to help me out a bit.

Height: 5'8"
Weight: ~135lbs
Bf %: Unsure but at under 10% at my most, probably under 6% now.
Workout: light, but have created a very effective one utilizing a variety of muscle groups, and has proven effective given my limited means.
Final word: I look pretty close, proportionally, to Stallone, but I'm a short Asian.

I'd like to gain a little bit more lean muscle, strength (workout aimed at powerlifting now), and maybe a little bit more fat...
Please don't tell me to just "man up and eat more". I am raising a family under severe mental illness and am poor. As well, the drugs I am on make it difficult to gain weight. I gain muscle at the cost of bf. I cannot stop my mess as I can't even take care of my own basic needs without them. Roids are not an option, as I cannot afford the risk of violence (not that I think they are right for me anyway).

I have a very unusual body by the way. After a year of sitting on my ass smoking pot (therapeutic) and eating a lot of fatty foods with poor dental hygiene, I get an 8-pack and applause from my dentist... All indicators seem to point to very high natural test for an Asian.

Currently I am supplementing with a few CHEAP supplements I've found. I use creatine, whey protein, calcium, magnesium, and vitamin d and can't afford to get anymore fish oil and glutamine.

My queries:
1. Anyone else found that taking creatine with a protein shake about 30 min post workout stops any muscle soreness the next day?
2. I did some research and both ZMA and Fenotest seem to have gotten rave reviews. Found the zinc and B6 cheap, no idea how much Fenotest costs. I'm sure most of you have tons of experience. Any good?
3. Looks like I'm on a solid Supplementation regimen, but would like any helpful suggestions or at least what the best supplements are.
4. Any general constructive suggestions would be much appreciated.
 
Son ov Belial said:
My queries:
1. Anyone else found that taking creatine with a protein shake about 30 min post workout stops any muscle soreness the next day? Yes, this is due to the insulin spike which is necessary post workout. When you're done, mix some creatine with a glass of gatorade. Wait 15 minutes, then drink the protein. Have a full meal about an hour later.
2. I did some research and both ZMA and Fenotest seem to have gotten rave reviews. Found the zinc and B6 cheap, no idea how much Fenotest costs. I'm sure most of you have tons of experience. Any good? Both of them are bullshit. ZMA wakes me in a cold sweat in the middle of the night, and neither of them have ever been proven to raise Test in any controlled scientific study. Ever.
3. Looks like I'm on a solid Supplementation regimen, but would like any helpful suggestions or at least what the best supplements are.The best supplements will always be food and water. You pretty much have it down as far as the basics go, whey, creatine, etc. That's all that's really necessary. Avoid shit like Muscletech and natural test boosters. They are a scam.
4. Any general constructive suggestions would be much appreciated.Eat a lot and lift heavy. Stay away from any drug that you aren't prescribed.
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...
 
The best tip and can give to someone who wants to start gaining weight, it to adjust your diet. It's simple, if you eat 2000 calories a day, change it to 4000 calories a day. Unless you are burning mad calories every day, you are sure to gain weight with this method. Up your protein intake as well, 2.5gr for every pound that you weigh. Lift, eat, sleep, and repeat. Use "heavy" weight to train with.

What does your diet look like now? We can help you fix it.


/V
 
Try to focus on eating the best type of foods possible. Grass fed beef, organic food. Try to work on yourself in therapy, as you have less anxiety, you will be able to eat more and more often.

Focus on making the eating experience enjoyable so you are more likely to repeat the experience in the future.
 
Captain.Heroin said:
Try to work on yourself in therapy, as you have less anxiety, you will be able to eat more and more often.
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I had no idea how large of an impact anxiety has on appetite until recently. It really does make a huge difference, I believe this is especially true for people with fast metabolisms.
 
phactor said:
I had no idea how large of an impact anxiety has on appetite until recently. It really does make a huge difference, I believe this is especially true for people with fast metabolisms.
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I was in a car accident (caused by someone else's recklessness in busy traffic, they made an illegal maneuver) and then while I waited for that to play out, I started eating my food, haha.

I have learned to be able to eat no matter what, it is a nice skill to have. %)
 
zma works well actually, so does melatonin. creatine, multivitamins, and protein powder are also good returns for your money. glutamine helped me with soreness but others have had no effects. I got nothing from glucosamine/chondrotine and other joint sups. The best thing to do is just try things out and see how you feel after a few weeks.
 
The only supplements you really need are whey protein and a multivitamin. Although creatine has performance enhancing properties, it's generally not worth taking because it's hard on the kidneys and it requires the athlete to consume much more water to stay properly hydrated. But to answer your question, creatine won't mitigate muscle soreness; more to the point, at your level of fitness, you'd be stupid to expect not to get sore if you work out properly.

I strongly recommend you stay away from "medications" (except as necessary), which are essentially toxins, at the end of the day. They will interfere with your progress and inhibit your ultimate growth potential.
 
i gotta disagree w/ eating 'healthy' foods- you gotta up those calories, that's the only way skinny bastards (or anyone, but especially us skinny folk!) gain weight. even if money's a limiting factor, just spend it better. get about-to-expire meats instead of fresh, ground beef and shredded pork over lean cuts, etc - just focus on finding the most calories for your buck (to the extent that you're comfortable with. eating healthy is, obviously, a very good/important thing, I'm speaking *strictly* in terms of muscle/weight gain.)

agreed w/ aannalien re supps, except glutamine does shit for me. nothing else is worth the $ imo, just keep it extremely basic in this dept when $ is an issue. i definitely think creatine provides solid bang for the buck, but if you're strapped for $ when you're buying your food, don't even consider creatine! All the supplements in the world cannot/will not overcome even mild deficiencies in your diet. as far as the zma, i take a magnesium/zinc mix (it's not magnesium aspartate, i can't recall what form it is but that's getting petty) that i get from walmart for like $4 or $5 a bottle, and it lasts quite a bit. definitely don't spend 10-20$ / bottle for a zinc/magnesium product if you're not buying the foods you need, the food is the MOST important part here, then training, and then a TINY bit of difference from supplements (*very* tiny! and w/o looking at what 'fenotest' is, if it's OTC i can almost promise it's shit). The zma really only helps you make sure you get the zinc you need, if you're not deficient at all then the zinc won't do anything, and take it at nighttime since that's when your body's producing most of its test. I personally like the magnesium for muscular tension, but if you're broke and unsure on zinc, i'd just take that by itself, it's an incredibly cheap mineral.

your comment about no soreness the next day makes me wonder if you're training sufficiently hard. any elaboration on your routine?
(edit: you haven't posted back since you started the thread, but if/when you do i can find the link to an awesome, long-ass list of foods that may help you when you go shopping)
 
Snarky91 said:
I strongly recommend you stay away from "medications" (except as necessary), which are essentially toxins, at the end of the day. They will interfere with your progress and inhibit your ultimate growth potential.
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I disagree. Obviously some drugs have the potential to induce toxicity, but not all of them do.

Some drugs, again, will obviously interfere with gains (meth, other stimulants) or testosterone levels (full agonist opiates, especially methadone) and others won't have these negative side effects (buprenorphine, cannabis, etc).
 
Creatine is not bad for your kidneys at all. Proof of both of my claims (zma and creatine) below.


Test levels before using ZMA daily:

Testosterone free 128.8 35.0 - 155.0 pg/mL
Testosterone free/testosterone 1.89 1.5 - 2.2 %
Testosterone, TOTAL 682 250 - 1100 ng/dL
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Test levels 2 months later after using ZMA daily:

Testosterone free 169.5 35.0 - 155.0 pg/mL
Testosterone free/testosterone 1.91 1.5 - 2.2 %
Testosterone, TOTAL 888 250 - 1100 ng/dL
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Creatinine panel using 5-10grams daily for 3-4 straight years:

Creatinine 1.34 <1.34 - mg/dL
GLOMERULAR FILTRATION RATE - NONAFRICAN AMERICAN >60 >60 - mL/min
GLOMERULAR FILTRATION RATE - AFRICAN AMERICAN >60 >60 - mL/min
Comment, glomerular filtration rate **
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For those confused on what those results are showing - 30% increase in total testosterone levels in 60 days and completely 100% normal creatinine levels (healthy kidney activity). I've had full kidney profiles done as well and they've all come up normal. Also have had an abdominal ct scan and mri - organs are all fine.
 
were the subjects in that zma study zinc-deficient to begin with, at least slightly? has to be the case...what other mechanism could there be? simply timing one's zinc for a bedtime dose versus a morning one?

and yeah, creatine is completely safe in healthy individuals. they used to put CYA advisories on the product advising ppl to cycle it, they don't even bother w/ that anymore lol
 
Those were my test results. I might have been zinc deficient but I doubt it. I was taking a multi every morning prior and during the test period. The timing is the important part. Normally when you intake zinc it is with calcium as well and the calcium will bind to the zinc (magnesium also). By taking them on an empty stomach before bed you get better absorption of zinc and zinc is an important ingredient in testosterone production.

As others said as well.. there's virtually no reason NOT to take ZMA. Don't buy an overpriced pre-made, simply buy bulk zinc tabs, magnesium tabs, and b6 tabs. It should be 4-5$ per jar and the jars have like 300 tablets.. a year should cost no more than 15 bucks. Incredibly inexpensive and you get better quality sleep as well so it's a double bonus.
 
I use ZMA and I'm sensitive to the "effects" of it, I guess. Taking the recommended dose of 3 pills wakes me up every 30 minutes and then being satisfied with only 6 hours of sleep. I'm not sure if this shit actually makes you recover better or just masks being tired. I take 1 pill before bed and I'm fine. Some pretty wacky ass dreams. Whether it boosts Test levels or not, I don't give a shit. Zinc and magnesium are very important minerals when it comes to building muscle.
 
the 'wacky' dreams are, by far, the most notable characteristic i've ever experienced from them... typically they're enjoyable, sometimes they scar me for the rest of the day LOL!!
 
Voxide said:
I use ZMA and I'm sensitive to the "effects" of it, I guess. Taking the recommended dose of 3 pills wakes me up every 30 minutes and then being satisfied with only 6 hours of sleep. I'm not sure if this shit actually makes you recover better or just masks being tired. I take 1 pill before bed and I'm fine. Some pretty wacky ass dreams. Whether it boosts Test levels or not, I don't give a shit. Zinc and magnesium are very important minerals when it comes to building muscle.
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Very correct Voxide! I think 6 hours of sleep per night is normal. Typically adults can get 5 to 7 hours of sleep per night. People closer to their early 20's, and people who are bodybuilders, are more likely to get 8+ hours of sleep per night, but it isn't bad to get less than 8 hours of sleep.

Magnesium tends to boost my energy levels in a noticeable kind of way, I think this is a normal effect of the mineral.
 
Bundle of thanks to sharing with all.I hope you will come again here with useful material like this..
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