I have fibromyalgia and arthritis, and the doctors just aren't much help. They have tried me on just about everything that isn't a controlled substance at this point. Right now I manage my pain the best I can on my own, but I am looking for something natural that actually works as a pain reliever for me. If I get a little energy or mood boost with it that would be great, but pain relief is my top priority. The only thing I have found in my research is Kratom, which is illegal in my state, and poppy seed tea, which I would like to avoid. I recently got some wild lettuce extract. It doesn't do much for me. Any ideas would be greatly appreciated.
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H&R Moderators: VerbalTruist
Natural effective relief for chronic pain?
- Thread starter ra1ndrop
- Start date
Burnt Offerings
Bluelight Crew
Marijuana and kratom are what immediately come to mind...kratom is illegal in your state? That's messed up.
Fibro is primarily defined by neuropathic pain, right? Cannabis would really be ideal, I would think, as it's effective at treating that (opiates are of limited effectiveness as analgesics when it comes to neuropathy). Have you been on pregabalin yet?
Fibro is primarily defined by neuropathic pain, right? Cannabis would really be ideal, I would think, as it's effective at treating that (opiates are of limited effectiveness as analgesics when it comes to neuropathy). Have you been on pregabalin yet?
No that is probably what they will try next. I'm on nuerotin and last thing I tried was savella. It helped some at first, maybe a 50% improvement but after a few months it stopped working and made me extremely nauseous. The nuerotin helps with some aspects, but I have a lot of muscle and joint pain and fatigue. Tried marijuana in my younger days and it made me extremely paranoid, heart racing, etc.
AZBlueeyes
Greenlighter
Newly Moved to Indianapolis Indiana...looking for pain dr
Hello, New to Indianapolis Indiana, from Phx Az. I have been in pain mgmt for years due to fibro, scleroderma, bad neck/back problems, neuropathy etc. I recently moved to Indianapolis and have had no luck finding a dr that will prescribed my 15mg oxycodone. I have already dropped my dose in half. I also have already had to fly back to phx to see my Dr to get my right meds. They will work with me in Phx, as long as I can find a dr here in Indianapolis. I have even gone to the er because my pain was so bad and didn't have my meds, they refused to prescribe me anything and would only give me a Vicodin and a xanax. I have tried asking around. I have a print out of my records and mri. Please help! Thank you all!
Hello, New to Indianapolis Indiana, from Phx Az. I have been in pain mgmt for years due to fibro, scleroderma, bad neck/back problems, neuropathy etc. I recently moved to Indianapolis and have had no luck finding a dr that will prescribed my 15mg oxycodone. I have already dropped my dose in half. I also have already had to fly back to phx to see my Dr to get my right meds. They will work with me in Phx, as long as I can find a dr here in Indianapolis. I have even gone to the er because my pain was so bad and didn't have my meds, they refused to prescribe me anything and would only give me a Vicodin and a xanax. I have tried asking around. I have a print out of my records and mri. Please help! Thank you all!
caseyg.hatchell
Greenlighter
Treatments like antidepressants, and anti-seizure drugs can help reduce symptoms like pain, fatigue.
Kittycat5
Bluelighter
There are quite a few supplements that may be beneficial for the types of pain you are suffering from, and while vitamins and herbs are not regulated like actual drugs so there is a higher degree of caveat emptor with them, I will list some that may help but will leave it to you to find quality products.
1. Multiple vitamin with extra B vitamins (or you could just buy a B-100 vitamin and take with the multi) Chronic pain, especially fibro is taxing on the body and can lower your immune system. A daily multi helps provide the vitamins and minerals the body needs to run more efficiently and boost immunity. Plus several of the antioxidants(Vitamin E) can have anti-inflammatory effects and the extra B's may help with neuropathic type pain.
2. Fish Oil. Take a higher dose, maybe 1 gram four times a day for battling inflammation. Also beneficial for the brain and cardiovascular system as added benefits.
3. Tumeric. A wonderful natural anti-inflammatory agent that possibly works similarly to Celebrex. If you cook, try to also utilize it to season your food. Great stuff and I rarely would praise a natural product like this.
4. SAM-e. Helps with fibro pain and to elevate the mood/provide energy.
5. Melatonin. I am not a proponent of melatonin for most people with sleep issues, but for fibromyalagia there is sufficient evidence to me to recommend it to regulate your sleep. Also may provide some analgesia as well.
5a. Vitamin D. I forgot this before and definitely think it belongs in the necessary items. Probably at least 1000 IU daily. So many benefits for pain, mental health, bone health etc. This can be prescribed as well in a mega dose of 50,000 IU taken once or twice a week.
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I am going to list some more, but dont want to bankrupt you, so everything above the line would be the ones I would make my personal arsenal against your conditions.
6. Probiotics. I really wanted to put this above the line but it isnt something that is always useful for fibro or arthritis and quality ones are expensive. Many fibro patients have GI issues and probiotics can help alleviate them.
7. Alpha Lipoic Acid. Another one useful for neuropathic type pain quite often given to diabetics with nerve pain
8. Ginseng. Used forever in Chinese medicine and can help reduce pain and boost energy
9. Valerian. An herb that promotes sleep, lessens anxiety, and reduces muscle spasms/pain
10. St. John's wort. A very effective natural antidepressant that may also reduce fibro pain. This is probaby the most dangerous of anything in my list because it carries a lot of the warnings and side effects of pharmaceutical antidepressants and interacts with many drugs. Use this one with extreme caution.
11. Glucosamine/chondroitin. Very heavily utilized for arthritis. I personally doubt it is as effective as others claim, but some data supporting it. Takes 1 to 3 months of daily use to start seeing a benefit.
12. Capsacian. An extract from a chili pepper that is used topically for arthritis pain. Far superior to things like Ben-Gay or Asperecreme.
13. Corydalis. An interesting herb that may have immunomodulating and pain relieving actions with recent studies showing it is quite effective.
Of course lifestyle modifications are beneficial. Try to exercise (swimming or other water exercise would be ideal as they reduce the load on your joints), eat a healthy diet with plenty of fruits/veggies and use lots of various herbs and spices as the best source of any vitamin or other supplement is our food. Things like acupuncture, meditation and yoga work wonders for many and try to get adequate sleep.
While my list is long, it is by no means exhaustive. Talking to an alternative doctor would be a great idea as they will integrate modern medical practices with therapies most doctors never think about.
Also, just because something is natural, doesnt mean there are no risks. Tons of natural supplements (including some I listed) can interact with each other and medicine. Always ask your doctor and/or pharmacist for advice in this regard.
1. Multiple vitamin with extra B vitamins (or you could just buy a B-100 vitamin and take with the multi) Chronic pain, especially fibro is taxing on the body and can lower your immune system. A daily multi helps provide the vitamins and minerals the body needs to run more efficiently and boost immunity. Plus several of the antioxidants(Vitamin E) can have anti-inflammatory effects and the extra B's may help with neuropathic type pain.
2. Fish Oil. Take a higher dose, maybe 1 gram four times a day for battling inflammation. Also beneficial for the brain and cardiovascular system as added benefits.
3. Tumeric. A wonderful natural anti-inflammatory agent that possibly works similarly to Celebrex. If you cook, try to also utilize it to season your food. Great stuff and I rarely would praise a natural product like this.
4. SAM-e. Helps with fibro pain and to elevate the mood/provide energy.
5. Melatonin. I am not a proponent of melatonin for most people with sleep issues, but for fibromyalagia there is sufficient evidence to me to recommend it to regulate your sleep. Also may provide some analgesia as well.
5a. Vitamin D. I forgot this before and definitely think it belongs in the necessary items. Probably at least 1000 IU daily. So many benefits for pain, mental health, bone health etc. This can be prescribed as well in a mega dose of 50,000 IU taken once or twice a week.
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I am going to list some more, but dont want to bankrupt you, so everything above the line would be the ones I would make my personal arsenal against your conditions.
6. Probiotics. I really wanted to put this above the line but it isnt something that is always useful for fibro or arthritis and quality ones are expensive. Many fibro patients have GI issues and probiotics can help alleviate them.
7. Alpha Lipoic Acid. Another one useful for neuropathic type pain quite often given to diabetics with nerve pain
8. Ginseng. Used forever in Chinese medicine and can help reduce pain and boost energy
9. Valerian. An herb that promotes sleep, lessens anxiety, and reduces muscle spasms/pain
10. St. John's wort. A very effective natural antidepressant that may also reduce fibro pain. This is probaby the most dangerous of anything in my list because it carries a lot of the warnings and side effects of pharmaceutical antidepressants and interacts with many drugs. Use this one with extreme caution.
11. Glucosamine/chondroitin. Very heavily utilized for arthritis. I personally doubt it is as effective as others claim, but some data supporting it. Takes 1 to 3 months of daily use to start seeing a benefit.
12. Capsacian. An extract from a chili pepper that is used topically for arthritis pain. Far superior to things like Ben-Gay or Asperecreme.
13. Corydalis. An interesting herb that may have immunomodulating and pain relieving actions with recent studies showing it is quite effective.
Of course lifestyle modifications are beneficial. Try to exercise (swimming or other water exercise would be ideal as they reduce the load on your joints), eat a healthy diet with plenty of fruits/veggies and use lots of various herbs and spices as the best source of any vitamin or other supplement is our food. Things like acupuncture, meditation and yoga work wonders for many and try to get adequate sleep.
While my list is long, it is by no means exhaustive. Talking to an alternative doctor would be a great idea as they will integrate modern medical practices with therapies most doctors never think about.
Also, just because something is natural, doesnt mean there are no risks. Tons of natural supplements (including some I listed) can interact with each other and medicine. Always ask your doctor and/or pharmacist for advice in this regard.
GrymReefer
Bluelight Crew
Thanks for that information KittyCat! Some great food for thought as it's already gotten me looking further into holistic pain management approaches.
Kittycat5
Bluelighter
Yes, how could I have forgotten Magnesium. Iodine I am not so sure about but if I get a chance, will look into.
RhythmSpring
Bluelighter
Oral cannabis and don't forget....
Bone broth!!
Chicken feet makes it really easy. Just ask the butcher behind the counter to see if they have some, if not, order some. It's good for the joints, digestion, and overall well being.
Bone broth!!
Chicken feet makes it really easy. Just ask the butcher behind the counter to see if they have some, if not, order some. It's good for the joints, digestion, and overall well being.
SixBuckets
Bluelighter
- Joined
- Jan 21, 2015
- Messages
- 1,222
I haven't found anything that works. 
I'm desperate enough that I'm considering hippie-woo stuff like saltwater floatation.
I'm desperate enough that I'm considering hippie-woo stuff like saltwater floatation.
Kittycat5 has an extensive list. On her list, tumeric is the one I have experience with, and the one many friends have told me really improved things. Not on kc5'S list but something I here really good reports about is boswellia.
Tumeric is better absorbed when taken with black pepper according to many sources.
The OTC NSAID naproxen has done me great good as far as pain/inflammation relief. But everybody varies in their response to different agents.
Tumeric is better absorbed when taken with black pepper according to many sources.
The OTC NSAID naproxen has done me great good as far as pain/inflammation relief. But everybody varies in their response to different agents.
Foreigner
Bluelighter
I have extensive clinical experience with herbs and I can tell you Ginseng, any variety, has nothing to do with pain. We don't use it for that. It could be called for though if you've had long-term illness, are really weak and fatigued, low appetite, low stamina, and are generally run down from disease. *Never* use it if you get an infection, even the common cold. Ginseng unfortunately tonifies pathogens and makes them stronger. I've seen this have very unfortunate results in people who take those stupid OTC "immune enhancers", like a simple cold turning into a full on chest infection. Ginseng is not a panacea, it has specific indications like anything else. It's usually applied in people whose base metabolic rate has been slowed down by constantly dealing with chronic disease. You take it for 2 weeks max, then stop.
Cordyalis only works for pain if there's severe congestion, like inflammation that won't let new blood in, or an old injury that has scarred over and caused blood and fluids to stagnate at the pain site. Otherwise, it doesn't stop pain.
The medicinal value of capsaicin in peppers is lost once they're cooked or processed in any way. You'll still get the bite of the heat in your mouth but its ability to improve systemic vascular circulation is lost. For that, you need to put fresh cayenne peppers into at least 50% alcohol in a ratio of 2 : 1 alcohol/peppers for 30 days. Don't cook it at all. Once it's ready, you can take up to 10 drops internally and wait a few hours for your whole body to warm up. If you want to apply it topically you need to make the same preparation with at least 70% alcohol (80-90% is better) to form a liniment. When you apply it to the sore area it will seep into the joint, the skin will turn red, and you'll feel more blood flow. Some people make an oil instead but I find the liniment way more effective, probably because the medicines are more readily transferred to alcohol than fat.
One concern in the herbal community is that if arthritis and pain are due to food reactivity (discussed below), and you use something that opens up the entire circulation of the body like cayenne, then you're only going to send the inflammatory agents deeper into the joints. You may want to consider cutting out reactive foods to see if there's improvement, and *then* use cayenne. Not every herbalist agrees with this though.
St. John's Wort is good for chronic pain. It doesn't get rid of the source of the pain but it soothes the nerves around the pain site. The only pain that SJW truly gets rid of is neuropathy, like the sciatic nerve. For that you take a dropper full of tincture every 4 hours. Some people report that sciatic pain never returns after that. But SJW can only do this if the problem is the nerve itself, like "frayed nerves" that have been over-firing forever. If it's any other kind of pain then it's just a mild analgesic. You need to infuse the flowers into a good quality oil like olive, almond, or jojoba. Sunflower is ok. If the flowers you obtain don't stain your fingers red when you rub them between your fingers, they're useless. Warm the dried flowers with oil in a 1 : 4 flower/oil ratio over the stove on low heat for at least 12 hours. If the oil boils the medicine will be destroyed. The oil will turn a deep red and smell awesome, and you're good to rub it on sore spots. Don't have anything major planned after you do because some people get so relaxed that they're basically sedated.
Valerian is good for nerve pain too, but only in a specific kind of patient. They're people that get run down, lethargic and exhausted from pain. (The opposite is people who get hyper, irritable, and become non-stop from pain.) If valerian makes you wired, manic and sleepy but also awake, then it's the wrong herb for you. Switch to California poppy or milky oat seed tincture.
The root cause of pain can be different in each person and too complicated to go into here. If your pain is mostly joint and muscular, but the bone and cartilage structure is in tact (i.e. not osteoarthritis), then the first thing you should be examining is diet and removing reactive foods. Most people with arthritis respond well to removing dairy, wheat and refined sugar, food additives, as well as unhealthy fat like the transfat in fast foods. If you eat meat every single day, then consider cutting back on that too... the nitrates and uric acid of meat metabolism can go to the joints. I'm not saying become a vegetarian, just eat less of it, and eat better quality meat. No fast food meat.
In a nutshell, look up "pro-inflammatory foods" and experiment with avoiding those. If you don't investigate diet and lifestyle then anything herbal will just be a patch, and might not having lasting results.
One Chinese medicine that I adore for joint pain is called "Zheng Gu Shui" (roughly: bone rectifying liniment). It's famous and super common. If you don't have a Chinatown near you, look online. You paint it on the sore joints with a cotton ball. It feels cold going on but then it seeps in and turns warm. You can also use it on bruises and sore muscles. I use this stuff on a regular basis especially the day after the gym.
Good luck.
Cordyalis only works for pain if there's severe congestion, like inflammation that won't let new blood in, or an old injury that has scarred over and caused blood and fluids to stagnate at the pain site. Otherwise, it doesn't stop pain.
The medicinal value of capsaicin in peppers is lost once they're cooked or processed in any way. You'll still get the bite of the heat in your mouth but its ability to improve systemic vascular circulation is lost. For that, you need to put fresh cayenne peppers into at least 50% alcohol in a ratio of 2 : 1 alcohol/peppers for 30 days. Don't cook it at all. Once it's ready, you can take up to 10 drops internally and wait a few hours for your whole body to warm up. If you want to apply it topically you need to make the same preparation with at least 70% alcohol (80-90% is better) to form a liniment. When you apply it to the sore area it will seep into the joint, the skin will turn red, and you'll feel more blood flow. Some people make an oil instead but I find the liniment way more effective, probably because the medicines are more readily transferred to alcohol than fat.
One concern in the herbal community is that if arthritis and pain are due to food reactivity (discussed below), and you use something that opens up the entire circulation of the body like cayenne, then you're only going to send the inflammatory agents deeper into the joints. You may want to consider cutting out reactive foods to see if there's improvement, and *then* use cayenne. Not every herbalist agrees with this though.
St. John's Wort is good for chronic pain. It doesn't get rid of the source of the pain but it soothes the nerves around the pain site. The only pain that SJW truly gets rid of is neuropathy, like the sciatic nerve. For that you take a dropper full of tincture every 4 hours. Some people report that sciatic pain never returns after that. But SJW can only do this if the problem is the nerve itself, like "frayed nerves" that have been over-firing forever. If it's any other kind of pain then it's just a mild analgesic. You need to infuse the flowers into a good quality oil like olive, almond, or jojoba. Sunflower is ok. If the flowers you obtain don't stain your fingers red when you rub them between your fingers, they're useless. Warm the dried flowers with oil in a 1 : 4 flower/oil ratio over the stove on low heat for at least 12 hours. If the oil boils the medicine will be destroyed. The oil will turn a deep red and smell awesome, and you're good to rub it on sore spots. Don't have anything major planned after you do because some people get so relaxed that they're basically sedated.
Valerian is good for nerve pain too, but only in a specific kind of patient. They're people that get run down, lethargic and exhausted from pain. (The opposite is people who get hyper, irritable, and become non-stop from pain.) If valerian makes you wired, manic and sleepy but also awake, then it's the wrong herb for you. Switch to California poppy or milky oat seed tincture.
The root cause of pain can be different in each person and too complicated to go into here. If your pain is mostly joint and muscular, but the bone and cartilage structure is in tact (i.e. not osteoarthritis), then the first thing you should be examining is diet and removing reactive foods. Most people with arthritis respond well to removing dairy, wheat and refined sugar, food additives, as well as unhealthy fat like the transfat in fast foods. If you eat meat every single day, then consider cutting back on that too... the nitrates and uric acid of meat metabolism can go to the joints. I'm not saying become a vegetarian, just eat less of it, and eat better quality meat. No fast food meat.
In a nutshell, look up "pro-inflammatory foods" and experiment with avoiding those. If you don't investigate diet and lifestyle then anything herbal will just be a patch, and might not having lasting results.
One Chinese medicine that I adore for joint pain is called "Zheng Gu Shui" (roughly: bone rectifying liniment). It's famous and super common. If you don't have a Chinatown near you, look online. You paint it on the sore joints with a cotton ball. It feels cold going on but then it seeps in and turns warm. You can also use it on bruises and sore muscles. I use this stuff on a regular basis especially the day after the gym.
Good luck.
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I found your post very interesting. I put capsaicin cream on my hand once (serious arthritis from major injury) and it turned red and swelled so bad I went to er. Was that supposed to happen? Also when you say alcohol do you mean drinking alcohol or rubbing alcohol? Where can you find fresh st. John's wort?