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Mushroom Visuals

GoombaMan

Greenlighter
Joined
Aug 6, 2009
Messages
14
Location
520, AZ
so i fell in love with mushrooms a few months back and did them way to much
there was a point where i shroomed 8 times within 8 days.

now its been about a month since i shroomed but every now and then i'll have subtle visuals, like i'll be reading a book and the words will start creeping to the left and things similair to that.

should i be worried?
 
i don't think that's it... the visuals explained there are not like what i see.
And the visuals only come when I'm focusing hard on something.
 
i already researched Hallucinogen Persisting Perception Disorder (HPPD) and that is not it and im sure its not flashbacks since if i focus hard enough i can make myself see the visuals and from what i've heard of flashbacks they're are sudden and unexpected.
 
Flashbacks are something different from HPPD despite what many people may think. I know what you mean by having visuals when sober that grow in intensity while concentrating or staring (I have had them after frequent LSD use) and I'm pretty sure that falls under HPPD. Actually if you check the HPPD thread you will find that there are a lot of people who only find it a little distracting but overall they like the touch of free psychedelia or even easier dissociation. Of course this doesn't hold true for everyone.

Flashbacks though, are strictly speaking not directly causal regarding psychedelic drugs. They are rooted in experiences in your life that are so intense that the memory of it is ingraved deeply into your mind. These experiences can be caused by serious accidents, witnessing of traumatic events and things of similar weight.
After that, when there is a trigger that bears an association with the memory you can get a flashback. The trigger is often a sensory stimulus like a smell, a sight or sound that is about identical to something within the intense memory. When you activate this memory by association you can relive the whole thing in various intensities as if you were there again to some extent. It's almost like a song that you can't get out of your head, if you hear a part of the melody you can automatically hear the rest of it clearly in your mind.

The association with psychedelic drugs is that they can occasionally be intense enough as to become these powerful memories and the same rules apply that can give you a flashback at any time henceforth.
I've had one once, the trigger was a song, the experience was my most intense trip ever the second time I tripped (on mushrooms) and had a mystical experience. Since then I've tripped many hundreds of times but none were strongeror more life-changing.
The flashback lasted for 5 minutes and was not unpleasant, it was unlike anything I'd ever experienced before though and pretty intense.

so i fell in love with mushrooms a few months back and did them way to much
there was a point where i shroomed 8 times within 8 days.

now its been about a month since i shroomed but every now and then i'll have subtle visuals, like i'll be reading a book and the words will start creeping to the left and things similair to that.

should i be worried?

In all probability you don't have to be worried but if you don't want to effect to become stronger or more persistent you should really cut back or stop with tripping for a while. I don't know the numbers but in most cases after a while it should then decrease. I never really worried about it even though it is a sign that I've been tripping too much, but now that I don't trip as frequently it went away a bit. I don't mind, it's kind of nice if you get used to it. I can understand that people could freak out and think in terms of what they see and what they 'should be seeing' i.e. everything clear and undistorted. If my HPPD would be so that it would impair my sight or judgment I really would not like it, but I can understand the world just fine through these slightly trippy goggles.
 
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This is perfectly normal, you don't have HPPD. It's not a flashback either.

http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/10331418/page/1

If you read through the thread, you'll see that most people agree it's normal to experience "visuals" even when they're sober, after having a psychedelic experience (whether it be a couple or many). There are even plenty of people who experience visuals who have never taken psychedelics before.

Similar story:

http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/10748295/page/2

Another similar story:

http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/10867224/fpart/1/vc/1

Similar discussion:

http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/10877638/fpart/6
 
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Exactly how strong and persistent does it have to be to call it HPPD? Who cares about drawing the line somewhere saying 'you have it' and 'you don't', personally I prefer it to use a scale of 'no signs of HPPD' to 'extreme HPPD' and it certainly sounds like he has some light signs. However light they might be they are there are they not?
And yes if you apply this scale you could call it pretty common to experience 'some signs'.
 
Dude I get this . I know what you mean . Like I stare at a wall for a while and I start to see faint LSD patterns on it .. Pm me if you want
 
HPPD can't be proven as an actual disease because there are people who experience the same "symptoms" as those who claim to have HPPD, but they either haven't taken psychedelics or don't complain about it...

People for the most part, just never noticed their own visual perception until after they have used psychedelics. They were always there. The only cases where HPPD could be called HPPD is when a substance that actually can cause neurotoxicity is the culprit; tryptamines cant be responsible for "brain damages," since they have no toxic effect on the body.
 
Well I was just considering the DSM-IV definition of a sexual disorder, it appears that you cannot call it a disorder until either the person himself or the people in his environment start to be bothered by it. You can be a sexual maniac but if you are at peace with it in your life and no one else has a problem with it it is not a disorder by definition.
If we take HPPD in which the D stands for disorder, we also might say that it becomes a disorder at the point that either the person in question or the people around him or her starts to be bothered by it.
If you talk about a disease then we're dealing with the distinction of a pathology i.e. is it a disorder or not?
That is the line you can draw, for the symptoms there is no line but there is the scale I mentioned.

Agreed?
 
If it begins to interfere with the persons life then yes, but how can you call it a disease or disorder if these people who say "it interferes with my life" experience the same symptoms as those who say "it doesn't interfere with my life" or "I like it." Meaning the person who says it interferes with their life that's claiming they now suffer with HPPD experiences the same level or frequency of "symptoms" as a person who says they don't mind it, like it or aren't bothered by it?

It's like someone with a "Widow's peak" saying I suffer from a disease known as Widow's peak syndrome, I have a Widow's peak and therefore this is a disease that I suffer from because it interferes with my life because I rather not have a "Widow's peak." When although there's a minority of people who don't like their Widow's peaks, the majority wouldn't classify it as a disease. Some might like it, some might not be bothered by it, ect. It's just this one group now saying that it is a disease when in fact it's just something that you happen to notice more because it is a feature you have yourself.
 
No way, you are going much too far past this.
There are DSM-IV defined disorders and HPPD and certain sexual disorders I don't the name of are among them. Widow's peak has nothing to do with pathology because it is nothing psychological, to start with and physically there are no sensible medical disadvantages.

I get what you're saying about the same level of symptoms being a disorder or not but the point is: the pathology is not about the symptoms at all but rather what they cause i.e. being burdened by not seeing and thinking clearly. These are actual psychological / neurological anomalies. And it's virtually impossible to say peoples symptoms are of the same degree, even if you could... the moment someone has a real problem with it that is not only disliking it but being hindered for an actual reason it is not of the same level anymore, it logically couldn't be.

And humoring your suggestion of Widow's Peak syndrome, if you actually had such a problem with your hair that it would cause real serious problems for you in everyday life, there is a possibility that it could be diagnosed as a body identity disorder. This is a really far stretch, but I just want to illustrate something. It takes more than a little for something like this to be pathological but it is possible.
I think that's just the way lines are drawn.
 
The fact of the matter is if you want to use logistics, by asking actual people (like in a poll that I presented and the other threads) who experience what the OP is talking about. You will discover that the greater majority are all in agreement on it being normal to have "lingering visuals" after using psychedelics, whether it be habitual or occasional use (obviously the more often or frequent, with less time inbetween uses, means more pronounced "lingering visual effects"). The OP is not experiencing HPPD or "flash backs." This is a completely normal phenomenon, that cannot be explained by "doctors" or "psychologists" or "psychiatrists" who have no experience with psychedelics or how they react on the mind or how psychedelics affect endogenous DMT levels - which therefore effect perception, or the fact that tryptamines can't cause physical damages to the brain, which would be the "result" or "consequence" of a disease such as HPPD. These "professionals" typically are anti-drug, and therefore their agenda is obvious. Especially to those who are scared and afraid that they "messed up their brains." Whether you want to go by the big book of bullshit aka. DSM-IV or whether you want to look at the evidence provided by the psychonaut or tryptonaut community is entirely up to you.
 
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And the visuals only come when I'm focusing hard on something.

Trust i get that too since i did LSD... and recently i went on a 13 day 1 gram 2C-E binge with 2 days where i didn't take any... and i've still got little strange visuals from time to time;) it used to bother me but doesn't anymore, its like normal

maybe itl go away with time
 
This happens to me as well and It doesn't bother me really

After taking alot of psychedelics over the years Ive become kinda spaced out. I lose myself in my thoughts all the time and my eyes will drift off to the clouds and Ill watch them make patterns and what not. Or Ill notice all these cool fractal patterns hidden in the asphalt. Whenever I'm reading anything the words always squiggle around a bit. Whether or not HPPD will bother you depends on the type of person you are

I actually enjoy it quite a bit especially when I smoke pot :)
 
I think after occasional or single use these signs are pretty limited, but read the OP again. There was definitely very frequent use, and a month has passed so we are talking persistent here. Sure, just a little bit of lingering visuals can be called normal, then you wouldn't wonder if you should worry. I'm not saying that he has actual HPPD but he does have mild signs of it that go beyond a little linger.
I think it is prudent to say that there is no need to worry but I wouldn't shrug it off as nothing either.
 
I had mild HPPD years ago like hes describing and after a few more years of tripping it got worse

I'd say if doesn't like it to stop eating drugs , it'll probably fade away

Mine sort of did before I went on an epic acid binge
 
So is it appropriate to call this HPPD if it is this common? I highly doubt everyone in the psychedelic community has "mild to moderate HPPD" and that is normal. That's my only issue on automatically labeling it as something incoherently "wrong," or a disorder, but rather instead, as it being a typical or standard "side effect" if that's what you want to call it (whether it be positive in some or negative in others) of using psychedelics; that affects the stimulus for visual perception. It fades in time for most, and Cannabis makes the effects of it more apparent. Also, it usually is controllable by focusing on an object or what you would actually describe as "defocussing." Then of course there's the "effects" that are not controllable; like glares, trails, "fuzzies," flowing patterns, static, etc. that many people happen to remember experiencing when they were younger (perhaps because children have higher or elevated levels of endogenous DMT).
 
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