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More On MDMA-Induced Neurotoxicity

nuke

nuke

Bluelighter
Joined
Nov 7, 2004
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So, today I finally had the time to look into MDMA induced neurotoxicity a little more, and while a lot of questions have been resolved, I'm still a little confused.

1.) Do DA and MDMA both get taken up by SERT? And why/how does DA get taken up by SERT in the first place? (as according to this study)
2.) Why does the neurotoxicity only seem to arise in the axon terminals of serotonergic neurons?

If any of these are repetitive, point me to a thread. I did search beforehand.

I sure wish I had read all this stuff before eating pills. But I guess, you can't change the past!
 
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Recent studys suggest that dopamine being broken down by enzymes(MAO) isn't the cause of oxidation, rather that dopamine plays a role in increasing body temperature(which plays a role in neurotoxicity). The chemical that causes the oxidation is still a mystery (I believe), but a theory on theDEA.org is:
My personal theory is that the chemical being broken down by MAO is in fact MDMA itself. After all, MDMA is an amine, MAO attacks amines, and MDMA is clearly being attacked at the amine by something in brain tissue.
Click to expand...

I would imagine the answer to 2 is because the MDMA is taken into the axon and broken down there by MAO. (If that's what is being broken down. Regardless, whatever the mystery chemical is being broken down, it's happening in the axon).
 
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1) Dopamine CAN get taken up by SERT; we do not know if it does. It gets taken up because the the SERT and the DAT are very similar machines, and serotonin and dopamine are relatively similar chemicals.

2) Good question. Probably because the SERT is enriched in that area.
 
cainnabelspawn said:
dopamine plays a role in increasing body temperature(which plays a role in neurotoxicity)
Click to expand...

Does this mean dancing (or other strenous activities - sex, exercise) on MDMA could contribute to neurotoxicity?
 
Sprinklervibes said:
Weed has been shown to lower body temperature. Weed on the comedown is always a good idea IME :)
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References? I just can't see it being significant.
 
Sprinklervibes said:
Weed has been shown to lower body temperature. Weed on the comedown is always a good idea IME :)
Click to expand...

That's interesting. But is that as a direct result of THC intoxication or is it more that your less likely to dance like a nuttah when stoned?

EDIT: "Co-administered Delta 9-THC, CP 55,940 and SR 141716 all tended to decrease MDMA-induced hyperactivity." ah. that would be a sort of then. Still something to consider.
 
http://www.druglibrary.org/schaffer/...ords/15104.htm
. THC takes effect by acting upon cannabinoid receptors. Two types of cannabinoid receptor have been identified: the CB1 receptor and the CB2 receptor. CB1 receptors are present on nerve cells in the brain and spinal cord as well as in some peripheral tissues (i.e. tissues outside the brain); CB2 receptors are found mainly on cells of the immune system and are not present in the brain.
The roles played by CB1 and CB2 receptors in determining the various effects of cannabis in the whole organism remain to be established. Among the effects of cannabinoids known from animal experiments to be mediated by CB1 receptors are pain relief, impairments in memory and in the control of movements, lowering of body temperature and reductions in the activity of the gut. As CB1 receptors are the only ones known to exist in the brain, it is assumed that they mediate the intoxicant effects of THC. Little is known about the physiological role of the more recently discovered CB2 receptor, but it seems to be involved in the modulation of the function of the immune system.
In common with many other drugs, the effects of THC result from its ability to activate special proteins known as receptors found on the surface of certain cells. The drug binds specifically to these proteins and activates a series of processes within the cells, leading to alterations in the cell's activity. Drugs, such as THC, that are able to "switch on" a receptor are known as agonists at that receptor
Click to expand...

And also here
Synthetic THC shields brain from damage following head trauma

About MDMA and weed

Another one about MDMA and weed

And then there's a thread somewhere where they said it lowered your body temperature by 0.2°C (average I suppose)
 
Does anyone think that taking a moderate dose of acetaminophen would help to reduce the potential for neurotoxicity then? Say around 500mg? Or would that be too much of a load on the liver do you think?
 
well, you're probably better off with co-enzyme q10, alpha lipoic acid, the essential vitamins, cocoa powder, green tea, 5htp (about 3-4 hours in), glucosamine, eugenol...there's lots and lots of antioxidants out that that could help. Eugenol is one of the strongest food borne ones.
 
Acetaminophen? Oh, because it can control fevers? yeah, I wouldn't count on it, and as you say MDMA + acetaminophen doesn't exactly sound like a picnic for your liver.
 
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