lithium, depakote, bipolar disorder, and rec. drugs

[ebola?]

Okay...I have a friend who takes lithium and depakote regularly for bipolar II disorder. I'm just wondering what rec. substances are OK for her, and what are not?
Okay, I checked RX List, and found that depakote is not supposed to be mixed with CNS depressants, but why is this? What kind of a synergy is there? If my friend were to say drink or take vicodin, would she be liable to get very dizzy and unusually "fucked up," or would she be liable to stop breathing??
What about CNS stimulants? Would methamphetamine trigger a manic phase? I think it could because the meth high resembles the manic state...at least somewhat. FYI, my friend has a VERY weird response to MDMA. She rolls for 3 DAYS off of half a "triple stack".
Pot seems to be okay for her.
What about psychedelics? Obviously, LSD is a no-no. Does psilocybin react with the lithium too? How about other serotonergic agents?
THanks!
ebola

 

[fairnymph]

Ok... my ex had severe BP type II so I can tell you what worked for him and what didnt...
First off, I don't rccommend meth, like you said, I think it's too likely to trigger a manic episode.
Weed, I also don't recommend, as it triggers depression (yeah, she may THINK she seems fine but weed is really one of the worst drugs for bipolar people).
E can be used, but she should so with caution and not too frequently...yeah, bipolar people get alot out of rolling, my ex could roll off half a pill.
Psychedelics, while they could always trigger some sort of wierd psychotic episode (something you always have to consider with bipolar people), are actually among the safer recreational drugs for bipolar patients. Shrooms, acid, 2-ct-7...they should all be fine.
Regarding depressants (alcohol, opiates, benzos), they CAN be used (even on Depakote...my ex was taking the maximum allowed dose of the stuff and drank like a horse, loved my codeine too), but your friend should exercise caution as she is much more likely to become addicted to such substances than the average person.
[This message has been edited by fairnymph (edited 25 October 2001).]

 

[~edemon]

Hey, what the hell is bipolar II? Is it some sort of terrible sequel? I was told I have rapid-cycling bipolar, is that bipolar part 2?
-----------------------------------------
Possibly dangerous opinion concerning the non-existant benefits of amphetamines for people with bipolar disorder edited out in the name of saving hapless, innocent victims of meth psychosis.-FoX & fairnymph
--------------------------------------
[This message has been edited by FoX (edited 26 October 2001).]

 

[ebola?]

Yes, Bipolar II, the legend contiues, is indeed synonymous with rapid-cycling bipolar disorder. Thanks for your input! You prolly know more than anybody I'm likely to come across.

Ebola
np: Depeche Mode

 

[~edemon]

I'm sorry about that, guys. I really wasn't thinking at all. I will refrain from dispensing such irresponsible advice in the future.
P.S. What in the world is this bipolar to the second power?

 

[~edemon]

P.S. I cannot read.

 

[HerbinMike]

Funny, my friend who was bipolar had the same reaction to E, she could eat a third of a pill and roll for two or three days... and INCREDIBLY hard, too, the kind where she would just be staring into space gnawing viciously on a pacifier and quivering... we all thought that she was just a hype who was faking it, but seeing as your friend's story is so similar...

 

[~edemon]

By the way, ebola!, after some careful reconsideration, I have decided that unless your friend couldn't give a fuck less- much like me- he/she probably shouldn't monkey around with meth. What I was attempting to convey in the above reply, which I failed disasterously at I might add, was that many bipolar bears rely completely upon their naturally occuring manic episodes to be creative, to be who they are. At least, that's the way I feel. I started this lithium and just went flat. I love to write, and I feel that I'm pretty good at it, but I haven't been able to write anything. No creativity.
So I guess what I was getting at is while the high of methamphetamine in many ways resembles the positive mania of bipolar disorder and as tempting as it can be to manually initiate a simulated mania, it is far from a good idea to assume the inherent risk of meth while suffering from a psychological and mood disorder as serious as bipolar.
That said, I do speed sparingly, but I still do it. I think it's my attempt at self-medication. Also, I don't give a fuck, really.
Well, that's it for me. We'll be back in two and two.

 

[thinctwo]

as diagnosed with this disorder, i shit you not, i believe that it doesnt exist. nor does depression. i mean, yeah, you get depressed, or you cycle fast, but i dont think that drugs need to be taken for these things, or that theyre representative of anything other than an extreme on a gaussian distribution of human behavior and emotions. in other words, free will means you can manage w.o those drugs, the disease doesnt really exist, and uh, do whatever drugz you want.
i hope not to offend, just stating my opinion.
------------------
You shouldn't feel the way you feel about us players, we true
Dress code, stay throwed in everytheng dat we do
RIP Fat Pat

 

[Furious]

Thinkctwo.... however the hell you spell that. You think it doesn't exist eh? Well, when I get in my depressive phases, in order to function, I just build up hatred, and that motivates me. Now, would you like me to take out this hatred by tracking you down tearing your arms off with my bare hands? Or would you rather I talk to a shrink, get some medication, and act fairly normal? Take your pick.

 

[~edemon]

He realizes and deals with his condition as he feels appropriate, that's all. Much like I'm desperately attempting to find some sort of viable medium, the right mix of medications- a disposition fit somewhere comfortably between robot and fucking maniac. I don't think he was trying to tell anyone that they don't have bipolar or they should stop going to therapy and taking their medication. At least, I don't think he was trying to say that. But psychological abnormalities such as this are very real, of course. It's impossible to disprove such a blatant and overbearing condition, you know? Not everyone cuts their arms open with razor blades or cries uncontrollably for no apparent reason or is suddenly overcome by excessive energy and creativity having taken no substance at all. If there was no bipolar, everyone would be doing these things, but they're not. I'm certainly no expert and I'm not trying to come off as one, but I do feel like I have a somewhat intimate insight on the subject.
Peace.

 

[lattrommi]

darn tootin. unless you have it, you don't know what's it's like. people think your exagerating when you say that you feel like your in love and that you want to kill yourself aat the same time. but that's just me ranting.
back to the topic. most uppers will trigger varying levels of manic attacks, most longer and for the better

. the down time however may kill us bipolars. so watch yourself, don't take too much, and if you do, stay with friends and poeple who will keep you somewhat sane.
and on one final note, i've heard that constant use of ephedrene over a long period of time can create bipolar. so if any of you out there think that it's a 'fake' disease, maybe you should test that out.

 

[special k]

Bipolar type II is not as severe as Bipolar.
The person normally the person will suffer from major depression but they will "only" suffer from hypomania not full blown mania.
Type II's have racing thoughts, obsessive needs, elation/anger, and cant sleep but its on a much scaled down version.

 

[~edemon]

Where does rapid-cycling bipolar come in? Is it more severe or less than bipolar or bipolar II? From my understanding, it is fairly self-explanatory in that it's bipolar with much faster cycles.

 

[special k]

The cycle type just breaks it down more so they know how to treat.
Rapid cycle and mixed cycles are two "breakdowns"
For instance to be classified Bipolar you have to have at least one manic episode.
That leaves ALOT out, they cant treat someone who always is manic the same way as someone who is always depressed but has gone manic once.
To me its like car options, you all own a ____(pick a car), but someone has the base model, someone has the supped up version and yet another person has the all tricked out model.
There are Bipolars that rapid cycle, there are Bipolars that have mixed cycles (they are up and down at the same time), there are Bipolars who also become schitzo affective....the list goes on and on and on.
It just becomes very compartmentalizied.
In my opinion the only reason you need to know any of the "extra stuff "is that it becomes a pattern and the sufferer can see it and take the steps that will help them with the least damage done.

 

[~edemon]

Thanks, K. I guess I'm not fully aware of all the options I can get with my bipolar. I want a one that's tight, y'know? And fast. Just kidding.
I kind of wanted to get an understanding of some of the different sub-catagories of it to ensure a proper diagnosis as well as proper treatment. So, rapid-cycling sounds close and is as I was diagnosed, but mixed sounds a little closer, if it has any bearing at all.

 

[special k]

I have mixed cycles.
The mixed cycles mean that you have both sides happening at once. I never have the pure elation and the "I can conquer the world" feelings that happen during true mania Instead when I am manic I am angry, severely anxious and all the other things that happen to a depressed person.
Basically it means you exhibit both sides of the coinat once.
If you are a rapid cycler you may be going up and down so fast that you feel like you are mixed but mixed usually stay pretty steady, they are always nuts

Another thing about mixed cycles is that sometimes youll exhibit something that normally happens when someone is manic but your depressed....for instance many manics become hyper sexual while those with mixed cycles may be hypersexual during depression or all the time or not at all.
Its hard to muddle through it all but to me is worth it.

 

[~edemon]

It's worth it to me, too. I'd really like to know exactly what is happening with myself and hopefully why it's happening when it happens. I certainly think I am mixed, though. I would just like to medicate or do whatever else necessary accordingly so that I may control, or attempt to control myself and my moods at any given time. I am just entering this world of bipolar, well, have just discovered that I am blessed with it, so I definitely have MUCH to learn and come to terms with. I, too, am crazy much of the time. I am going to quit the lithium soon, too. It's doing what it is supposed to do, but I really dislike it quite a bit and think that I would be much better off with something else or, what I've been thinking, with nothing at all. I'm far more creative and expressive, interesting, funny, energetic and intelligent that way. I'm becoming tired of suppressing myself and my many emotions as well as my personality. This is the way I'm supposed to be, not a dull, lethargic robot. Peace.

 

[thinctwo]

cycles, bipolar blah blah blah
the mind is a monkey
some monkeys are harder to control than others
none need to be doped up to sling shit @ other monkeys, which is all we as people do, so...
dont be 'up' or 'down' or 'manic' or 'depressed' just be. and then youll have control of the monkey.
and even monkeys like drugz. ive seen video on the discovery channel of monkeys gettin drunk off fermented fruit and falling thru trees and shiz... pretty damn cool.
once again, i dont mean to offend, but you really problems in your head come when you overanalyze things, whether it be conscious or not.
------------------
You shouldn't feel the way you feel about us players, we true
Dress code, stay throwed in everytheng dat we do
RIP Fat Pat

 

[Furious]

Thinctwo... if I ever could find you, I'd tear your arms right off, and happily beat you to death with them.