Heroin Ive been clean for 8 days was if i use once one day will i start over detox

[drewski1114]

Hello all,

this is the deal i was clean off H for 6 months then relapsed and used for a year. Keep in mind not everyday and i really didn't use too much 2-3 bags at once no more. The days i didn't use could be 2,3,4,5 days in a row depending on my money situation, i used suboxone. Never more then 2mg a day though. I finally decided enough is enough and am serious about being sober for good ive been off H for about 8 days for those 4 of those 8 days plus on and off the last year i used 2mg or less of suboxone a day. I stoped using the suboxone about 4 days ago and still feal lingering w/d anxiety and leg pains. Not terrible but im a big sissy when it comes to w/d period. I have experienced w/d from both so i can kind of tell if im w/d from h or suboxone and right now its def the suboxone. I was wondering if i did a couple bags just this one time after 8 days clean so i can feel some kind of relief will i reset the detox process and have to start from the beginning again. Or will it help eliminate the last of the suboxone w/d and ill be in the clear after. And i understand that doing it one time might bring back cravings to do more i really don't want to hear that bc i have no interest in being a dope head anymore so i don't think ill get cravings. Any fast response would be nice thank you!!

 

[The Doc.]

Can't say for sure but chances are you will be setting yourself back your not even through with withdrawal the sub is just leaving your body so if you introduce another opiate there's a good chance you will regret it.

But we are all different for me even when done detox if I used once the next day withdrawal is present then if I use again I'm usually back to square one how I was before detox.

 

[drewski1114]

sheesh bc I don't really have bad sub w/d right now bc I think I used them the right way Im just a sissy when it come down to even the most minor w/d and I just want some sense of relief and def don't want to take any piece of a sub bc those w/d suckkkk

 

[mew4]

its different for each person, and every time is different, sometimes i could use for a week without starting gettin sick again, other times id just use once and wake up in withdrawal. u can never tell thats the problem.

 

[The Doc.]

Yea that's the thing you never know and a Suboxone is an opiate so the proper way to use those to ease withdrawal is to taper them down to 0.25-0.5mgs a day then Juno off with minimal withdrawal symptoms. That would've been better than taking 2mgs (a moderate sized dose) for a few days then dropping right off without tapering. Now if you add more heroin its going to be a risky thing to do that will most likely leave you worse off in the long run. Suboxone is easier than H in my opinion but everybody has their own opinion on that topic i supose.

 

[drewski1114]

I decided to do three bags yesterday to get a little relief at like 8 p.m its 730 the next night and I feel completely fine better then I did before I did the dope. No anxiety and no leg pains but well see what happens when I wake up tomorrow

 

[mew4]

hey i tried to msg u but it said ur things are exceeded, clean that up so i can hit u up. peace.

 

[drewski1114]

I cleared it..go for it... id like to hear what you have to say..

 

[drewski1114]

mew im only allowed to answer one message per 180 minutes makes no sense im gonna get back to you a.s.a.p

 

[The Doc.]

So you did the dope before you made this thread???

Haha so you were hoping one of us would say you'll be fine kinda thing.

Just wait and see i guess. What else can you do its already done.
And remember an opiate is an opiate whether its Suboxone or dope. Suboxone is just easier to taper with so next time taper the Suboxone down instead of jumping off at a high dose and being really sick and then going back to heroin right away. Doing heroin to get through Suboxone withdrawal doesn't make sense because their both opiates and its not a good idea if you want to get clean. I always have to tell people who use Suboxone to get over heroin withdrawal they can't just escape withdrawals by taking Suboxone for a week then dropping off when the think the H has left their body. All the time people ask me "I've been taking suboxone for a week when do you think my heroin withdrawl will be done so i can stop taking suboxone?"
I have to tell them the Suboxone is simply putting withdrawals on hold the same way you do heroin to get well then you feel sick again after it wears off. Many people actually do this to escape opiate withdrawal thinking Suboxone is not an opiate but now with you its the other way around cause you want to take heroin to get over Suboxone withdrawals.

First time for me but if you find heroin withdrawal to be not as bad as Suboxone withdrawal then who knows mabye this method works for you.

Good luck.

 

[drewski1114]

Well I made a thread some where else and they ended up not even posting it and I found out today and really wanted to hear what people had to say. But yeah your the only person ive ever seen or heard that would say suboxone w/d is easier the dope w/d that's crazy....ive gotten over both before and H w/d lasted about 5 maybe 6 days where I have withdrawn from suboxone for over a month... but everyone is entitled to there opinion. I feel like 8 days of me being off dope that its more then completely out of my system...it might not make sense to use dope to get off suboxone it was just an idea b/c ive seen a ton off ppl say they took percs during suboxone w/d and it helped a lot so dope is basicly the same thing. But who knows im kind of disappointed I did it anyway... thanks for your responses though I appreciate it.

 

[The Doc.]

Well percs are a lot weaker than heroin but yes I've heard that too. Suboxone withdrawal is usually worse because people generally end up using a higher dose of opiates while taking Suboxone than they were on heroin due to the fact Suboxone doesn't carry the same euphoria making users take more than is nessesary. The reason I say that about finding sub's so much easier to come off compared to heroin is because Suboxone is tapered so much easier due to the long half life it carries.

Anything with a longer half life is much easier to taper (heroin is next to impossible to taper) but if you don't take Suboxone correctly and taper it then yes it will probably be worse to withdrawal from than you found heroin to be. The reason is because you most likely were on a higher dose of opiates than you ever were on heroin while taking the Suboxone. Another reason is the long half life means that the withdrawals will be longer but not as intense. Some prefer a quick blast of intense withdrawals that last a short while but leave you nearly completely incapacitated. Others prefer to withdrawal slowly having it not be very intense but lasting a long time.
The analogy I like the most is to think of short acting opiate withdrawal (heroin) as one big shotgun blast that takes you out right away whereas long lasting opiates (Suboxone) are more like being shot with a Pellet gun over and over for a long time. Some people prefer one blast to get it over with while other prefer a long drawn out process. Different strokes for different folks as they say.Either way though it ain't fun we can agree on that part I hope.

But when you taper Suboxone you can make the withdrawals hardly visible when done right and when the Suboxone isn't used for longer than nessesary to taper with.

I've been through the detox facility here in BC many times and the last 3 times I was in there Suboxone was finally on the market in Canada so they tapered every opiate addict with Suboxone. They would start you on 4 or 8mgs once you got sick then would keep you on that dose for 2 days, and taper you down to none quite easily. It went like this-

Day1 -8mgs
Day2- 8mgs
Day3- 6mgs
Day4- 4mgs
Day5- 2mgs
Day6-1mg
Day7- 0.5mgs
Day8- Nothing
Day9- 0.25mgs

Everytime I did this I couldn't even consider the way I felt after detox to be withdrawal. All that was felt was mainly mental cravings, some sleep disturbances and some slight diereah but never much of a need to medicate. But Every time i came off heroin cold turkey I went through 15-30 days of absolute relentless hell. All I would do was puke, shit, sweat through every pair of clothing I had, and flail my legs all day and night unable to sleep. Of course being an addict you still want to get high after a quick taper of Suboxone and stopping but the physical aspect was hardly there after a week of sub tapering. Everyone else in there agreed with me that the sub made withdrawals 1000× easier when compared to the hell I described above, you just have to take the Suboxone the proper way and taper it as quick as possible.

Don't stay on one dose for a long time then drop off or else it'll be the same as a cold turkey Heroin withdrawal or worse due to the long drawn out nature of Suboxone W/Ds.

Suboxone is also easier to become addicted to than heroin because it stays in your body a long time so a person could use heroin a few days in a row and not become addicted. The reason is because heroin is very short acting so you feel high then it wears off, leaves your body and your back to normal quickly. Whereas Suboxone you take it a few days in a row and it keeps building up in your body even after the high is gone then your body gets used to having this constant flow of opiates flowing through your serum levels. Having this steady flow of opiates instead of a short high here and there makes physical dependacy comes on much quicker than if you took H once or twice a day for a few days.

This is why Suboxone is best left for people with a big heroin dependacy not someone who only uses a bit of heroin here and there because Suboxone will most likely make things worse in those situations. This could also be the reason you found a few days of suboxone harder to come off then a few days of heroin use. But of course someone who already has a dependency to opiates wouldn't have to worry about this because well they already have a dependency to opiates.

 

[Erikmen]

Well percs are a lot weaker than heroin but yes I've heard that too. Suboxone withdrawal is usually worse because people generally end up using a higher dose of opiates while taking Suboxone than they were on heroin due to the fact Suboxone doesn't carry the same euphoria making users take more than is nessesary. The reason I say that about finding sub's so much easier to come off compared to heroin is because Suboxone is tapered so much easier due to the long half life it carries.

Anything with a longer half life is much easier to taper (heroin is next to impossible to taper) but if you don't take Suboxone correctly and taper it then yes it will probably be worse to withdrawal from than you found heroin to be. The reason is because you most likely were on a higher dose of opiates than you ever were on heroin while taking the Suboxone. Another reason is the long half life means that the withdrawals will be longer but not as intense. Some prefer a quick blast of intense withdrawals that last a short while but leave you nearly completely incapacitated. Others prefer to withdrawal slowly having it not be very intense but lasting a long time.
The analogy I like the most is to think of short acting opiate withdrawal (heroin) as one big shotgun blast that takes you out right away whereas long lasting opiates (Suboxone) are more like being shot with a Pellet gun over and over for a long time. Some people prefer one blast to get it over with while other prefer a long drawn out process. Different strokes for different folks as they say.Either way though it ain't fun we can agree on that part I hope.

But when you taper Suboxone you can make the withdrawals hardly visible when done right and when the Suboxone isn't used for longer than nessesary to taper with.

I've been through the detox facility here in BC many times and the last 3 times I was in there Suboxone was finally on the market in Canada so they tapered every opiate addict with Suboxone. They would start you on 4 or 8mgs once you got sick then would keep you on that dose for 2 days, and taper you down to none quite easily. It went like this-

Day1 -8mgs
Day2- 8mgs
Day3- 6mgs
Day4- 4mgs
Day5- 2mgs
Day6-1mg
Day7- 0.5mgs
Day8- Nothing
Day9- 0.25mgs

Everytime I did this I couldn't even consider the way I felt after detox to be withdrawal. All that was felt was mainly mental cravings, some sleep disturbances and some slight diereah but never much of a need to medicate. But Every time i came off heroin cold turkey I went through 15-30 days of absolute relentless hell. All I would do was puke, shit, sweat through every pair of clothing I had, and flail my legs all day and night unable to sleep. Of course being an addict you still want to get high after a quick taper of Suboxone and stopping but the physical aspect was hardly there after a week of sub tapering. Everyone else in there agreed with me that the sub made withdrawals 1000× easier when compared to the hell I described above, you just have to take the Suboxone the proper way and taper it as quick as possible.

Don't stay on one dose for a long time then drop off or else it'll be the same as a cold turkey Heroin withdrawal or worse due to the long drawn out nature of Suboxone W/Ds.

Suboxone is also easier to become addicted to than heroin because it stays in your body a long time so a person could use heroin a few days in a row and not become addicted. The reason is because heroin is very short acting so you feel high then it wears off, leaves your body and your back to normal quickly. Whereas Suboxone you take it a few days in a row and it keeps building up in your body even after the high is gone then your body gets used to having this constant flow of opiates flowing through your serum levels. Having this steady flow of opiates instead of a short high here and there makes physical dependacy comes on much quicker than if you took H once or twice a day for a few days.

This is why Suboxone is best left for people with a big heroin dependacy not someone who only uses a bit of heroin here and there because Suboxone will most likely make things worse in those situations. This could also be the reason you found a few days of suboxone harder to come off then a few days of heroin use. But of course someone who already has a dependency to opiates wouldn't have to worry about this because well they already have a dependency to opiates.

How about methadone for a long term off opiates? There is a lot of posts talking about Suboxone but that´s temporary.
With methadone people normally get better and stay off opiates for a long time, sometimes for ever. In my case for 7 years (couple of relapses) but, not worthy at all, as opiates in general have no effects. It easier to cope.
Of course everyone has its own opinion about that, I respect it but don´t really understand Suboxone as a solution.

 

[The Doc.]

Why is Suboxone temporary???

I've been on it for 2 year's and I don't even think about using heroin or other opiates just the other day I turned down a cheap bottle of oxycodone my buddy was selling because I chose Suboxone. Its a great matinence drug and isn't as hard on the body/mind as methadone is. Suboxone also doesn't raise your tolerance unless you add more to your dose. I know people who have taken the same dose of Suboxone for a decade without having to raise their dose to get the same effects they first got from the drug. Other drugs raise tolerance quite quickly leaving the user to raise their dose until they have an a huge habit they can't support.
Methadone does help people too but is much harder to taper than Suboxone and tends to have worse side effects. Suboxone is great to do a quick taper with as I said above but is also great to stay on for extended periods in order to keep yourself away from heroin / other opiates if your an addict who has lost control.

 

[Erikmen]

Good that Suboxone is working for you and that you are off H. Temporary maybe in terms of how long it stays in your system and how often you have to use it. I never used them, that was never an option for me. As understand, someone may still use and I wonder if the effects of H are blocked in comparison with Methadone (?)
Anyway, doctors have always told me that Methadone stays longer in the system and, many years ago to nowadays, it´s still the most effective solution - in my case though.
All the best,
Erik

 

[drewski1114]

What I have found to be a miracle for getting of relieving w/d symptoms and I finally went to a doctor and got prescribed these two. Clonidine and Librium...Clonidine is a blood pressure medication and for me and as for a lot of people that I read about it gets rid of most of the uncomfortable symptons such as the rls, and anxiety. And it knocks you the F out. For me it was amazing and Librium im not too positive about but im pretty sure its a ver mild Benzo. Any way these two for is abosolutly amazing and I would recommend anyone that's about to go through w/d to ask a doctor about these two.