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Is there a middle way in recovery?

Opi_Kid_Rock

Opi_Kid_Rock

Bluelighter
Joined
Sep 13, 2018
Messages
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Is it common to say, be clean for one year, chip for 2 weeks, and then get back onto the wagon for years? Thanks BL Community.
 
i did this twice but then started drinking again and since then my life has got way worse cos those old addict tendencies came back.

i will say there is probably way more people doing shit like this in NA than will let you know that's what happened.
 
In my 30 year on and off again experience, I’ve come to the conclusion that staying off permanently leads to greater joy in life than having the occasional on. Especially since it’s never just 2 weeks.
 
Atelier3 said:
In my 30 year on and off again experience, I’ve come to the conclusion that staying off permanently leads to greater joy in life than having the occasional on. Especially since it’s never just 2 weeks.
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Same here.
 
There is a middle way and it's called mathadone/suboxone maintenance.

In my opinion chipping doesn't work ánd almost always leads up to a binge. Of course there always will be a few anomalies that do well with chipping but it's more than likely that you're not one them. I thought for a long time chipping isn't a problem. I had to learn the hard way that for me it is and always will be a problem.
 
Opi_Kid_Rock said:
Is it common to say, be clean for one year, chip for 2 weeks, and then get back onto the wagon for years? Thanks BL Community.
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Not in my experience. In my experience if I start using again. I'm not gonna just stop again 2 weeks later. And from what I've seen from others, that's the usual outcome.

As others have said, the middle way is maintenance therapy. You aren't totally clean but your life is generally still under control.

In all honesty. Thinking "I'll just use for 2 weeks" sounds like junkie reasoning to me. If it were me that's definitely what it'd be anyway.
 
I think I would take 2 weeks of using if there were no consequences. But after 3 years of opioid replacement therapy (and morphine/oxy prior) I think I would be waking up in minor withdrawal at day 3, and full blown after 2 weeks. 2 weeks on for withdrawal and stabilisation (sleep, energy...) that would last more than 2 weeks that I was on is not such a great gamble so I am passing.
 
Psycho_Logic said:
I think I would take 2 weeks of using if there were no consequences. But after 3 years of opioid replacement therapy (and morphine/oxy prior) I think I would be waking up in minor withdrawal at day 3, and full blown after 2 weeks. 2 weeks on for withdrawal and stabilisation (sleep, energy...) that would last more than 2 weeks that I was on is not such a great gamble so I am passing.
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While I don't want to say anything to encourage you to do this, I will say that it's unlikely to happen that fast.

I relapsed with heroin after 2 years on methadone so I have a bit of experience using it after getting stable on methadone.

And well, for me. I haven't found my tolerance increased at all if I used for say 3 or 4 days.

I haven't used in a continuous stretch past the 3 to 4 day mark so I can't say how long exactly it'd take.

I will say this though, when I've used heroin for a few days, then stopped. The next day after I will be a LOT more likely to feel sick in the hours before my next dose.

But it only lasts for that day. After that things pretty much return to normal.

Although obviously I can't promise that other people's experiences won't differ to mine.

EDIT: just to clarify, what I'm saying is you may well wake up a bit sick if you stop at day 3. But IME. it won't last. And it's not cause your tolerance has increased. It's cause the drug is wearing off at the same time your substitution therapy is wearing off and it's making it feel worse as a result. In my experience by the next day I feel back to normal.
 
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LivingOnValium said:
There is a middle way and it's called mathadone/suboxone maintenance.

In my opinion chipping doesn't work ánd almost always leads up to a binge. Of course there always will be a few anomalies that do well with chipping but it's more than likely that you're not one them. I thought for a long time chipping isn't a problem. I had to learn the hard way that for me it is and always will be a problem.
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Same here.
 
JessFR said:
I relapsed with heroin after 2 years on methadone so I have a bit of experience using it after getting stable on methadone.
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You're most certainly will not gonna encourage me but can you just make clear were you in the middle of MMT and instead of methadone u used H? And than got back on methadone?

Cause I think it makes a big difference if a person is totally opioid clean with tolerance reset and waiting to jump fast. But I could be wrong. Been wrong multiple times today for instance.

Don't want to derail the thread just curious.
 
Psycho_Logic said:
You're most certainly will not gonna encourage me but can you just make clear were you in the middle of MMT and instead of methadone u used H? And than got back on methadone?

Cause I think it makes a big difference if a person is totally opioid clean with tolerance reset and waiting to jump fast. But could be wrong.

Don't want to derail the thread just curious.
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The experience I'm referring to here, is I was on methadone, stable at 80mg a day. That's where I was at nearly a year ago. And I had been stable for 2 years at that point with no use of any other drugs.

I then relapsed on heroin. And have used heroin for up to 3-4 days, a bunch of times since then. I was still using methadone throughout that time.

So what I'm essentially saying here, is that in my experience, if you're stable on a dose of methadone, using on top of it, at least with heroin, will not increase your tolerance after only 3 to 4 days.

The first day after I stop the heroin I might feel a bit sick before my next dose of methadone. But I believe it's because of the heroin wearing off, not because of an increase in tolerance. I didn't need to increase my methadone dose as a result of using heroin for a few days on top of methadone.

That's what I'm saying.
 
Thanks for clarification. But yeah, 2 week binge for me it isn't something I would play with. If a doctor would be willing to prescribe opioid painkiller for legit purposes that got me in the trouble when I was younger it would be a different calculation.
 
When I relapse on meth I take it variably from a few days to a month during which I’m totally functional except for doing any serious intellectual work.

During this time I can 2-3 day breaks during which I get a bit of work done and tell myself I’m not addicted, or am walking a middle way. However, beyond 2-3 days of total abstinence I enter soul destroying and pschologically unbearable comedown/withdrawal during which I seriously think about committing myself to a mental hospital. It’s that bad.

If I make it through (which I always do) then I feel flat and low lovel akathaesia for however long I stay clean. Though I usually start up exercise which improves things greatly. However, i don’t seem to be able to push these totally abstinent periods past 2 months.

Then it all starts. Right now I’m 4 days into stopping from 2 month’s being on daily using 1g. It’s fucking torture but if I follow my patrern I’ll forget how bad it is next time I’m tempted to pick up whether that is in 2 weeks or 2 months.

And then I’ll lose a few more months of my life before I go through the trauma of putting down again. Rinse. Repeat. I have no why I pick up.

But I know there is no middle ground with methamphetamine for me. Other amphetamines, maybe. Meth, definitely not.
 
Atelier3 said:
But I know there is no middle ground with methamphetamine for me. Other amphetamines, maybe. Meth, definitely not.
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I am truly grateful that where I live even amph sulphate is questionable quality at best and meth is not to be found. I am tweaker in my soul and if there is amph sulphate or cocaine it doesn't matter how long I haven't slept or does it even do anything for me anymore, I finish it every time. When I was quiting opioids, after few years of morphine/oxycodone and 3 years of mostly buprenorphine maintenance sprinkled by 6 months of methadone, I successfully stopped with more than 150 Subutex pills in my house and more than 10 grams of Oxycontine (OC) pills stashed at my friend's house. I was going through a torture especially with chronic back /butt/leg pain due tu multiple issues but I have managed to not use. If I now had 5 grams of cocaine and I already finished two in 24h period, I KNOW that I couldn't stop and save those 3 grams for later and would use rest up in 12-24 following hours. That is stimulant addiction and I am truly grateful that meth isn't around cause there would sure be no middle way for me as I read the stories about it.
 
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