Drugs and shamanism

[PsychedelicWizard]

Yeah, I've always wondered what a western shaman looks like. I would have liked to spend some time studying with a traditional shaman, but ultimately I didn't see myself living in the Amazon or trying to recreate the role of a traditional shaman in the west. I wanted to be a facilitator for healing spiritual experiences, which we all need in our live, more so in the west. Alexander Shulgin had all the characteristics of a western shaman. I found myself helping people get through some difficult situations and when I tripped with them my focus was able to elevate their own focus and allow them to go deeper. One person claims I helped him get over his panic attacks. I rarely tripped with others however. Anyways, it was all new to me and I started tripping with that focus, reading everything I came across, keeping an experiential diary and doing all kinds of practices. When I started to hint to those around me that this might be my path instead of the all the schooling I had gone through up to that point and the promise of a good career, they rejected it. I wasn't strong enough then and now to take a difficult step like that without the support of the people I love and in the face of all the support they gave me. My brother went so far as to throw away a large part of my collection of substances. That rejection of what I saw happening in my life was painful and it leaked into my subsequent experiences and I got half-assed about it. I can't say my life was ordinary at the time. I had free-roam on a private piece of land. Nightly camp fires and always pursuing practices that would look weird to someone looking in. That said, people didn't know that when I was about in the world. I dressed normally, talked normally and respected peoples boundaries. So anyways, I'm not gonna take a high and mighty attitude, it was both ordinary and extraordinary, but ultimately felt like just another path a person with a calling can take with their lives.

Western Shamans were called Druids.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Druid

It is just that Christianity suppressed this heavily when it violently took over Europe. White people are just as, if not more so, shamanistic than the other races of the world, it is just that Christianity took over our beliefs and burned at the stake anyone who was a pagan "heathen", even though the "heathens" were here first. They also weren't savages, that is just Christian/Roman propaganda. In fact, they were not unlike the Native Americans in many ways, and if you Google "Kennewick Man", you'll find that Natives and Europeans have a similar ancestry.

 

[Jabberwocky]

Thanks PsychedelicWizard, I'll read up. Knew very little about the Druids. I've read a bit about the European witchcraft practitioners whose used belladonna alkaloids to develop altered perception, but unclear how much of it is folklore.

I was completely joking when I said that a shaman is some dude that just likes to trip balls - sarcasm doesn't translate onto my keyboard sometimes.

lol, that's the best part of the job though. got me .

thanks guys for letting me blab away, appreciated the outlet.

 

[PsychedelicWizard]

Thanks PsychedelicWizard, I'll read up. Knew very little about the Druids. I've read a bit about the European witchcraft practitioners whose used belladonna alkaloids to develop altered perception, but unclear how much of it is folklore.



lol, that's the best part of the job though. got me .

thanks guys for letting me blab away, appreciated the outlet.

You are not alone. Christianity is far more evil than Satanism in terms of what damage it has done to the world, and paganism is the European people's first true religion.

It didn't spread by love like modern revisionist Christians would have you believe, it spread by the sword, and burnt people at the stake who held unto the beliefs their ancestors had for hundreds of thousands of years before the cult of Abhram followed suit.

 

[rujex]

No need to argue that Christianity brought a lot of suffering, but the pagan religions it replaced where not much more better. I cant imagine to pray below a oak clustered with dead body remains.

 

[Jabberwocky]

Christianity is far more evil than Satanism in terms of what damage it has done to the world

I don't identify as Christian but it was my upbringing so the symbolism influences my perception. I believe everyones religion affects their perception of spirit in a unique way, yet the underlying experience is actually quite common and not exclusive to any religion. I don't really understand Satanism but agree it can be just a valid a path. I think all religions when filtered and purified through our perception will lead us to the same place. That said, I struggled against my own identification with Satan during different peak experiences. I fought it. If my perception of Satan were different, perhaps the experiences wouldn't have been so difficult.

 

[Bluuberry]

I am a Westerner and I consider myself to be a shaman in training. I feel this because, to me, a shaman is someone who facilitates spiritual experiences or healing, as well as someone with extensive knowledge of the natural world (plants, animals, minerals, fungi). I have been on this path for 7 years now, sometimes losing focus a bit. I also studied for a few years on and off before I started to really take steps on what I consider to be my path.

Most of the work I do does not involve hallucinogens actually, though occasionally they come into play. I use them more as a catalyst to understand how to live in harmony with the forces around me, and to facilitate certain workings that I want to be particularly potent, or if I feel like I need the extra help to get to , for example, a deeply rooted problem. I mostly use herbs, incense (which I make from scratch from specially selected botanicals designed to fit the purpose), and a bastardization of various forms of Eastern mystical traditions and Western ceremonial magick, plus a few other tools.

I don't make a big deal about it or anything, I don't really bring it up to most people, it's generally a private thing I am doing currently for personal growth and transformation but I cautiously offer what I can do to help when I think someone would benefit from it. Often times where I live, there are people that want to understand magick and the nature of reality, experience contact with the divine, etc. I like to be able to facilitate life-changing experiences for myself and other people. Similarly, I've been studying herbalism for about 5 years and I like to help people's healing with that knowledge as well.

It's just my path in life, it's something I can't ignore.

 

[PsychedelicWizard]

I don't identify as Christian but it was my upbringing so the symbolism influences my perception. I believe everyones religion affects their perception of spirit in a unique way, yet the underlying experience is actually quite common and not exclusive to any religion. I don't really understand Satanism but agree it can be just a valid a path. I think all religions when filtered and purified through our perception will lead us to the same place. That said, I struggled against my own identification with Satan during different peak experiences. I fought it. If my perception of Satan were different, perhaps the experiences wouldn't have been so difficult.

Lucifer I see as the left-hand path to God as Christ is the right-hand path. Not an evil entity at all, but rather, hedonism of the self's pleasure, versus altruism of other's pleasure. The two together are needed for happiness.

 

[Jabberwocky]

Thanks for explaining. You clearly have purified your perception of it because I've found others explanations of Satanism to be lacking and yours satisfies me. In unity-consciousness the separation between self and other becomes very small, and I believe all religions eventually become obsolete because all religions eventually lead to a state of unity-consciousness. Until that happens they keep evolving.

It's just my path in life, it's something I can't ignore.

Thanks for sharing Bluuberry. Lucky the person who seeks you out for help

 

[PsychedelicWizard]

Thanks for explaining. You clearly have purified your perception of it because I've found others explanations of Satanism to be lacking and yours satisfies me. In unity-consciousness the separation between self and other becomes very small, and I believe all religions eventually become obsolete because all religions eventually lead to a state of unity-consciousness. Until that happens they keep evolving.

Thank you. Indeed, the separation between the self and others is like the separation between one atom and another. We are all One, we all connected, every sentient Soul, every non-sentient Soul, as well as the Source, which some would call God. However, that separation from one atom to another, no matter how small, is significant, and we all need to learn to love ourselves as well as each other, because if we don't love ourselves, then we wither, which damages the whole, but if we don't love others, then the connection withers, which damages the whole. That's basically the gist of reality.

This is why altruistic people who are always giving end up getting killed (like Jesus) or running out and becoming charity cases themselves. That's not the smart path to life. But also egoistic people are equally as fucked, because they end up destroying everything around them and end up dying out because of it as well (like Lucifer). Basically, we are all caveman in the same clan. If one of us suffers, we all suffer, so we all must take care of each other, but we also must grow as individuals. So we are all connected, but also, all separate, at the same time.

To use a Star Trek metaphor, we shouldn't be like the Borg or the Ferengi, but find a middle-ground approach.

 

[Voyager3]

Christianity was introduced by a rather clever, devious and deeply dishonest (IMHO) mixture of stealth, political machinations and secretive practice, as well as violence and suppression of all who opposed it. Up the road from me is a church which has been there since Saxon times, and was no doubt built upon a Pagan site - traces still remain. Rather than use massive bloodshed to enforce the 'New Faith', it did attempt to use subversion and persuasion, and often adopted Pagan practices and even rituals, rather than ban them out of hand and appear as what they actually were, i.e., a conquering New Religion.


You can still see evidence of this to this day.... "The Holly and the Ivy...." goes the hymn, Churches are often decorated with ancient symbols such as corn dollies, a mass of stuff at the Harvest Festival and Easter (eggs and bunnies - fertility symbols?), Maypoles for dancing round etc etc.

Most obvious was the adoption of the BVM (Blessed Virgin Mary), revered as a goddess in her own right - almost - in a religion totally dominated by men, unlike almost any other. She was needed to replace the Mother Godess, the Female Principal - Hecate, Aradia or whoever, which of course all reasonable religions rely on absolutely. They then adopted Cerunnous, Bacchus and other loveable, harmless, fun loving goat footed gods as The Devil....


Look at your local church, festooned with gargoyles, demons and Pagan idols aplenty, and ask who you are really worshipping?

 

[Jabberwocky]

sorry to keep interjecting here, obviously I am really interested in topic. I like the way you guys think about this. It takes a lot of the drama out of it. I had some odd experiences where I felt tremendous identification with the beast in me. It was power, it was heat, it was will empowered with strength and it was satanic. I literally felt like I was sprouting horns and had dreams about it after. It was terrifying and I struggled with it long after the experience faded. Had we had this discussion before then, I might have allowed myself to experience it more as a part of myself and likely would have come out of it stronger. Religion is a seed planted in our soul that goes deeper than we will ever know. It is a form of mind-control, of commandeering the meaning of symbols, of intermediation between man and divine. I agree with everything you guys are saying while also admitting that I am not free from religion — as much as I think outside of its confines. In moments of transcendence I still struggle with religious views, despite having the opportunity for direct experiential knowledge. It's hard not to think of religion as a poison, but fortunately religions can evolve. Every major religion has esoteric sects that focus less on imparting rigid views and rules and more on direct experiential knowledge of the divine.

 

[Voyager3]

Hello LevelsBeyond. I suppose there is 'a beast' in all of us? That does not mean you are evil, cruel or damned... I live with mine quite comfortably. The problem you seem to have is equating that 'beast' with the Christian idea of religion? The sort of nonsense we are stuffed with as kids, which is very hard to shake off sometimes - it uses pointless, useless and destructive emotions like guilt, shame and fear of damnation to enforce what is (IMHO) a very vague, tenuous and entirely corrupt version of what was originally a rather good message of love, tolerance and forgiveness. I have no 'religion', my beliefs are in a constant state of flux, but I can honestly say I am a 'follower of Jesus', not from the canonical gospels, but from the original source.
And should you have horns and goat's feet, so what? So did Bacchus, Cerunnous and a myriad of good and wonderful gods, satyrs and whatever? Who would not be in awe of a loving little god who comes with dancing and sex, and turns all the water into wine? The only problem I see is getting shoes to fit...

God and gods bless you! XXXXX