Benzos benzo withdrawal?

[Znegative]

Hi. I've just got back from a pretty much pointless two week detox where they tapered me off of benzo's, from 2.5 mg a day to .25 mg a day. I had been on the 2.5 mg of klonopin for two weeks prior to the detox, and before that had been taking upward dosages of about 10 mg of xanax/day for at least a month, and then the month before, 6-8 mg, and then before that anywhere from 2-4 mg a day.

I say the taper was pointless because I also wanted to detox off of suboxone, but after a week decided to go back on it, as i felt it was too much to handle the benzo and the suboxone w/d.

I also got back on the klonopin because after three days of abstinence after my last .25 mg dosage I was starting to get pretty bad shakes and was having trouble holding utensiles and just every day items. My doctor put me on one mg max daily dosages. This was given to me two days ago. At first it seemed to help immediately, I felt the klonopin within minutes of taking it, but it seems that now on the third day, I hardly get anything out of the klonopin except relief from the shakes.

My symptoms are the following:
very watery stools
stomach cramps
really bad headaches that make me want to puke (though I havn't thus far)
I still shake after drinking coffee or smoking a ciggarette
depression
restlessness/trouble to sleep

I'm also having some problems with my memory.
Will these symptoms go away soon and just become accustom to this 1 mg dosage of clonazepam? or is there a major deficiency that one mg of klonopin will only relieve for part of the day but I will continue to suffer these symptoms for a while.

I know of course you can't tell me what's going to happen, but if some experienced benzo users could lend me there experiences it would be helpful just to know what I might expect in the future.

 

[laCster]

damn, 10mg of xanax a day is way to much bro...you fucked with your brain's wiring and you have to teach your brain how to live without the drug.......

SMOKING CIGS on almost any benzo will cause your CYP3 enzymes to speed up and thus making your benzo buzz go away almost instantly, atleast for me.....there are a couple of posts on this site that go more in depth, but i don't think this is just a myth...and i stay away from all cig smoke while benzod out

i used to drink alot of coffee with my benzos, but when i stopped the benzos and just had the coffee i would shake, get extremely anxious, and feel jittery...i would recommend stopping the caffeine intake all together...most of all the symptoms you describe sound like side effects of coffee; caffeine will relax your stomach muscles making it easier for you to digest what is in your stomach and intestines thus making you shit easier and sometimes gives me stomach cramps...caffeine and cigs together is a major cause for insomnia ... i would suggest looking up how caffeine interacts with your tobacco, and i advise you stop both and then see how much better you feel....

 

[HdoubleODeezy]

if he stops cigs and caffeine intake that is 2 more w/d's to go through..

 

[monstanoodle]

Replace Coffee with Tea - The Theanine in Tea seems to counteract the jitteriness that I personally experience from Coffee which is nice

Basically what's happened is your GABAa receptors have experienced Downregulation and you have a tolerance to Benzos that will last for a long, long, long time.

Benzo tolerance seems to last a great deal longer than with other addictive substances (I'm not sure on the reason for this) so it's going to take a while before you get used to the dose of Clonazepam that yer on, but you will do eventually.

Maybe it'd be worth getting some Valerian to combine with yer Clonazepam as it will slightly potentiate it by actually containing:
GABA aka. gamma-Aminobutyric acid.
Valeric Acid (which may act on GABAa receptors).
Isovaleramide (which posesses slight Anxiolytic and Sedatory effects).
Isovaleric Acid (which could have Anticonvulsive properties).
and
Valerenic Acid (which "has been demonstrated to be both a subtype-selective GABAa agonist acting mainly at α1β2 and α1β3 subtypes, and also a 5HT5A partial agonist").

It could also be worth just trying to cut down on the amount of ciggies you smoke too. Obviously, like HdoubleODeezy said, trying to stop and going through withdrawals from Nicotine too isn't going to help at all, but try and wait for as long as you can after taking yer Clonazepam before you have a cig.

Hope this helps and hope things settle soon so you can start feelin more normal

 

[laCster]

Replace Coffee with Tea - The Theanine in Tea seems to counteract the jitteriness that I personally experience from Coffee which is nice

this^^ i replaced my coffee with a cup of green tea which has some honey in it
i love smoking weed while sipping on tea :D


i recommend looking into Tagamet or Cimtidine which inhibits your CYP3 enzymes, the main enzyme that klonopin is metabolised through...
...this really helps me whenever i take my favorite benzo, klonopin, by extending the high and making it more potent....it seems to be that 1mg of klonopin +200-400mg Tagamet = 1.5-2mgs of klonopin...it's really worth it imo

 

[monstanoodle]

^ Good plan Batman I think it's CYP3A4 that when inhibited will potentiate (or atleast lengthen the experience and raising levels of it in your blood) it.
Just make sure that you're not taking any other meds that, by inhibiting the fuck load of enzymes that Cimetidine does ( CYP1A2, CYP2C9, CYP2C19, CYP2D6, CYP2E1, and CYP3A4), could end up being dangerous.

 

[rob_benson1]

around 3 weeks ago when my benzo WDs were at their peak I had a few nights where I was thinking there'd be no way I would get through life much longer without killing myself as I felt the pain was way too much to bare.

well 3 weeks later and even though I feel like a house blown apart by a tornado still I can tell you that there will be a slow improvement.

and what's weird is that somedays you might think you're feeling alot better + relief from the WDs, and then randomly the next day you'll be asking yourself why your still alive; this goes with saying that these peaks and lows are gradually going up though.

 

[monstanoodle]

I think the fluctuation will be to do with things like dietary intake / exercise etc.
It'd be worth looking up foods that will help with GABA production, take suppliments like Magnesium for RLS type symptoms and cramps.
Find sources of food with Glutamate in them, also possibly L-Glutamine:

Dietary sources of L-glutamine include beef, chicken, fish, eggs, milk, dairy products, wheat, cabbage, beets, beans, spinach, and parsley. Small amounts of free L-glutamine are also found in vegetable juices and fermented foods, such as miso.

Pregabalin (Lyrica) might be something to look into also, it's likely to help a great deal.
Oooh! Also, just thought that St. John's Wort might be rather useful (as long as you're not taking anything that interacts with it) because it's main chemical compound, Hyperforin, is a Reuptake Inhibitor of a fuck load of Monoamines (Serotonin, Norepinephrine, Dopamine, and of GABA and Glutamate).

And there's also something that I've tried with some success:
Magnolia Bark Extract which contains Magnolol (which acts on GABAa) and Honokiol.
You can buy it quite cheaply from the net and, if you do, I'd suggest taking around 3x the dose that's listed to get some form of psychoactive, calming effect from it

 

[DexterMeth]

Yo Negative: I was on 16mg of kpins a day for over 4 years. I finally quit last febuary. Everything you mentioned strikes home with me. Honestly, I don't think I could have done it without drinking myself into the ground and capping up on GHB/GBL/1,4-bdo. Don't do this though. It is EXTREMELY retarded.

Anything that hits your GABAs is just going to prolong the inevitable. Face it. You're detoxing and you have to go through hell. No pain no gain man.

You will experience PAWS for up to 2 years or so (at worst). Physical exercise, including sex, helps a lot. I guess you could look into natural over the counter remedies. Oh ya, but also I did NOT decide to quit opiates at the same time. Fuck that.

Good luck man. It's literally the hardest thing you'll ever do

 

[Captain.Heroin]

if he stops cigs and caffeine intake that is 2 more w/d's to go through..

Maybe he should quit those first, using benzos to assist (tobacco is unquestionably worse for you) before tapering off of benzos.

Anything that hits your GABAs is just going to prolong the inevitable. Face it. You're detoxing and you have to go through hell. No pain no gain man.

I don't believe this is true, but as far as benzos, barbs, ethanol, and GHB/GBL/1,4-BDO, you are correct; those are prelomgimg the inevitable.

 

[DexterMeth]

That makes sense from a healthy living stand point, but it's just not practical. I mean, shit, they even pass out cigs in rehab

 

[hydrochron]

Klonopin messed up my stools, that's actually a effect from nitro benzo's. After a few months they should go back to normal. I dont know if you noticed, but even when your taking klonopin and not withdrawaling your stools are probably mesed up.

I used valium to taper down and it works really well. You should give it a try.

 

[DexterMeth]

It's MUCH more pronounced comming off obviously. I was on methadone and then bupe the whole time so I was fine.

A diazepam taper isn't a bad idea at all. I would have done that if I thought of it at the time, instead of going into GHB comas and shit

 

[funkee]

Get your doc to do a taper using a long acting barbiturate like phenobarbital. It has helped so many. It makes getting off benzos absolutely painless if the taper is done correctly.

Did a double detox from 1G/oxy iv and 6mg xanax a day to bupe and pheno. Got off the pheno after a few months, no problem. Still doing BMT for a few more.

 

[burn out]

do you guys know if taking kava will prevent or slow down benzo withdrawal recovery? i have been using kratom and it helps me to cope with the symptoms that i still have after being off benzos 17 months. but i know kava is said to have some activity at the GABAa receptor. so is it alright to take?

 

[k.bear]

I (rather foolishly) quit benzos cold turkey after a three-week binge where I took over 130 assorted benzos (Xanax, Klonopin and Valium) in high doses. It was definitely a retarded thing to do, but once I started and my decision-making abilities were impaired, I didn't stop until the benzos literally did nothing to me any more.

I suffered through two months of intense nightmares, stomach cramps, nausea and lethargy. I went to A&E four times. I lost 10kg. I felt like I was dying. My GP prescribed me a shitload of codeine somehow?!

It was the most intensely painful and depressing time of my life. However, two months after going cold turkey, I started to feel a bit better. I seized the opportunity and started eating healthy, exercising, and trying to maintain a positive attitude about things. Things rapidly improved, and whilst I still have occasional stomach issues, I managed to pull through.

It seems that you've been taking high doses for a lot longer than I did so your experience may be different (worse?) - but hang in there, things will improve. I definitely wouldn't recommend going cold turkey; tapering would be the way forward. Whatever you do, do something to get off the benzos because you'll feel a lot better for it.

Some things that I noticed:

* I was living on paracetamol the entire time - it gave me a small amount of temporary relief, and I'm not sure that I could have managed without it

* a hot bath provided temporary relief from the stomach pain and was surprisingly effective; I found myself running a bath at 2am on a work night when I couldn't sleep

* if you're feeling well enough to eat, or even if you're not, easily-digestible healthy foods (such as salads and soups) helped my stomach the most

 

[adder]

My symptoms are the following:
very watery stools
stomach cramps
really bad headaches that make me want to puke (though I havn't thus far)
I still shake after drinking coffee or smoking a ciggarette
depression
restlessness/trouble to sleep

I'm also having some problems with my memory.
Will these symptoms go away soon and just become accustom to this 1 mg dosage of clonazepam? or is there a major deficiency that one mg of klonopin will only relieve for part of the day but I will continue to suffer these symptoms for a while.

Watery stools, stomach cramps, headaches and nausea, depression, restlessness, insomnia - well, everything you listed you may get from benzodiazepine withdrawal, this is all probably caused by anxiety you get from little clonazepam. Also, it may sound strange but I found out that when I'm on my regular dose of clonazepam, my memory works better than it does when my dose is lowered. It's like everything goes wrong when my dose is lowered. And that's for real, I figured it out taking tests at university. But it's not like clonazepam does something good to my memory, it just works that way - more clonazepam - less anxiety, less clonazepam - more anxiety so I can't focus.

Now coffee and cigarettes. Caffeine and nicotine can easily make you anxious when you're prone to it. So it's pretty normal you start shaking after drinking coffee or smoking cigarettes. I myself don't drink coffee though I'm on 6mg clonazepam a day + methadone (coffee itself caused diarrhea for me, especially with milk; if I have to, I stick to some latte from a vending machine). And cigarettes - well, I do smoke a lot + I use snuff a lot. When methadone and clonazepam hit in the morning I can smoke cigs and I love it. Later, it often makes me sweaty. But I can't stop, I'm addicted to it too.

Recovery from benzodiazepine addiction is one big hell, it may take months before you feel normal and that means it won't be the same just like you never took benzodiazepines. I can see myself getting off methadone more than getting off clonazepam.

 

[DexterMeth]

I could more easily never do an opiate again than a benzo

To OP: Also, if you feel like you're going insane, that's perfectly normal.
lul.

Keep us updated man

 

[deaf eye]

some mod should make lika big dandy benzo thread/ benzo withdrawl thread ,
i dont know if it would work, but theres like a cajillion benzo threads out here

 

[hydrochron]

do you guys know if taking kava will prevent or slow down benzo withdrawal recovery? i have been using kratom and it helps me to cope with the symptoms that i still have after being off benzos 17 months. but i know kava is said to have some activity at the GABAa receptor. so is it alright to take?

Man burnout, i'm starting to feel a little bad for you. I was on benzo's for about 3 years straight xanax and klonopin at pretty hefty amounts. And with the exception of terrible withdrawal during the transition to valium.

I pretty much eliminated most of the post accute withdrawal syndrom.

What you need to start taking is valerien, go buy the extract at your local health food store. Buy sleepy time tea, and drink that stuff!

Work out, and stay busy... I dont know if you work full time or what. But that helps alot.

Also as bad as this may sound taking opiates for awhile might even you out. I know it did for me. If I remember right I think you cold turkied xanax? Or quit really fast. That makes the post acute withdrawal so terrible. But either way your eventually going to get better in the new few months.

Take opiates for awhile, maybe try tramadol. You definently need to take somthing, or do somthing about your problem your having. Message me if you need more help.