Benzos benzo trouble

['medicine cabinet']

So basically have been rxd xaanax for 2 years. Doc gave me 4 and after a few months i asked for a few extra pills a month just so i could take an extra .5 if i had to. He instead put me on 6mg. Well about a year later he leaves the practice...maybe got fired idk...it was sudden. So i started seeing this pa there, she changed it back to 4mg but lately ive been running out early, and this time it got bad. I ran out waaaay too early, had no money and no way of getting xans off the street. Went 3 days without and the wd got so bad and scared me so bad i went to the er. They treated me very well and with serious care and concern. Nice doc and nurse. Hr and bp were sky high, hooked me up to all the usual stuff and ran a line and gave me iv ativan. I have a dr apt friday where i plan on asking for a switch to a longer lasting benzo, the er dr sent me home with some serax and its holding me ok, and this makes me think switching to kpins will be pretty painless. I dont want to tell her about the er visit....im just worried shes going to say stay on the xanax and ill have to say i dont have any (ill prob say i only have a few left as to make it seem like i totally havnt crushed the rx)

I actually want off the xanax, idk how much worse the wd could be but lets just say im glad my 45 is locked in my new safe and not by my bed anymore...id eat a gold dot had it gotten anyworse, blowing my head apart like a melon lol.
I know its typical to go from xanax to kpin but since i have this serax step inbetween is that going to change much?? Ugh i really need some benzo pros on this one...if it were opis then no prob as ive been around that block more times than i care to admit.

One other thing, if she does give me a kpin rx will that void my leftover 2 xan refills? I know there is rx monitoring here so id maybe not use my rx to get the kpins that way i could still get the xans just to have...if she says no kpins stay on the xan im fucked bc i cant get it filled, i mean maybe i could try and pay out of pocket but would i be able to do that?

Are there any other benzos that would be suitable besides the usual kpin ativan valium? I heard bromaz is like long acting xanax. I want off this ride, but it has to be after the holidays. Factor in im at about half my mmt detox (110 now at like 60) i dont want to get reliant on benzos during the final jump off. Also she doesnt know about my mmt.

Ty in advance for any advice or help. Ive read a bunch of posts, but i felt i had to make this. Im actually fearful for the first time im a long time.

 

[the red shark]

At one stage was prescribed 6x2mg xanax a day used to get 50 a week with 2 repeats. How time have changed, I cut myself down to 3 a day, cpl years pass and they switch me to Valium. Doesn't do much for alleviating anxiety by takes the edge of the day a bit I guess. I have found Clonazepam to be very on par mg for mg with Xanax. It has the advantage of. 25 hr half life as oppose to xanax's 8 so you are fine to just take one a day, it doesn't have the euphoria but tha stopped for me within a year of taking them, but it is definitely more subtle also. Serapax is good, I actually take 1 around bed time and it gives me a so,I'd sleep. If you could get a script for clonazepam to take n the morning, milk it a bit like if you we on4 xannies, could suggest 2-3clonazepam if you get them, you should find you won't actually need all 3 but they are handy to have spare. Knowing I have a few of my benzos stashed is calming in itself. The last thing I want to do is rn out and have nothing and they don't hand out scripts so would be reluctant to ask if I did fall short, rather my own back up sorta thing, just IMO. Keep the Serapax on board for night. You can't get in trouble for trying to fill the scripts you didn't know if you are asked, but IME very doubtful you will have any difficulty. Just tone safe go to a different chain pharmacy to usual, small independent ones are best. As far as records of your scripts go a small pharmacy isn't likely t have your data if you haven't been there before.

Don't know about bromaz, but I am fine with clonazepam. Arivan(lorazepam) isn't bad. Clonazepam, Valium and Xanax are all specific anxiety benzos, Serapax (oxazepam) is actually a muscle relaxant but has the same metabolises as Valium and does help with sleep. Temazepam and the stronger Nitrazepam (Mogadon) are hypnotic benzos, made to help sleep. Lorazepam is a gem, has both the hypnotic qualities and alleviates anxiety. Unfortunately where I live, it isnt subsidised like the other benzos, neither is stillnox. cant quote pricing her but over triple what a jar of vals cost. But 2 Ativan a day, one morning and night might help. It has a 12 hour half life so I personally prefer clonazepam, IMO it is stronger also. If you do go for the lorazepam option you want the yellow 2,5mg the white 1mg do fuck all.

 

[Felonious Monk]

I used to live in Maryland, it's crazy how doctors will give out benzos like nobody's business but opiates are so taboo... And now you know they're even worse.

Anyway, I used to be scripted a lot of benzos (in my mind, not compared to some on here), at the end I was getting 2x2mg Niravam (ODT Xanax), 2x10mg Valium, and a 30mg Temazepam.
It was too much and I didn't take it all. But like red said, having a couple hundred pills in my safe, just in case, was pretty calming on its own.

You should be fine switching straight off to Klonopin. Think of it like switching from Dilaudid to OxyContin. As long as you keep your receptors happy they don't care what they're eating. And you'll still be able to get your Xanax refills anyway, plenty of people get 2 benzos, that's not a red flag at all. Plus I'm sure that'll help keep your anxiety down over the whole thing. Then once you've safely switched you can flush the Xanax down the toilet, or whatever you want...

 

[gingerbaker]

Clonazepam isn't nearly as good a choice as a ton of doctor's and various people seem to think for tapering people off benzos.

Diazepam and Nordiazepam (or Clorazepate) all have extremely long half lives with clorazepate having a half-life of up to 8 days. This means that each "step" down actually self-tapers and is a much easier transition on the body. Diazepam is probably the best though because it comes in 1mg preparations and can easily be compounded or used in suspension to give greater control over the taper. They will "cross-taper" you to an equivalent dose of diazepam (if that's the route they go) and so you won't feel any significant withdrawal but you will feel a change as diazepam is quite different from a pharmacokinetic point than alprazolam (alp has a very "spikey" effect and diazepam is a much more level feeling). Good luck!

 

['medicine cabinet']

Thanks you for the responses you guys. Monk, so true about that. Its so easy to get benzos but anything stronger than codeine is almost impossible to get. My sister gets xans and her dr KNOWS shes on mmt. When i went to the er i had to play dumb. Half life??? Derr what dat? Bc i know if i flexed my drugery on them they would have treated me worse. But the dr told me the usual benzos are only short term you should be on an ssri, to which i said, and this is the truth, i take triptans for migraines which are 5ht agonists and can cause serotonin syndrome when taken with ss(n)ri's i have never taken an ssri in my entire life bc i was getting migraines waaaay before i was having panic and anxiety so in my mind migraines come first and im not risking serotonin syn. Id rather have a panic attack than a 2 day migraine fest filled with puking dryheaving incredible pain, and all the fun that goes with that... If i could hit a reset button and be off mmt and benzos i would hit it and not think twice. But doesnt everyone in this shitty position feel that way.

 

[gingerbaker]

Half life??? Derr what dat?

The time it takes for the plasma concentration to halve.

 

[Felonious Monk]

The time it takes for the plasma concentration to halve.

He was mimicking playing dumb at the hospital.

And I actually agree with ginger, I think Valium/Diazepam is a better choice to move to than Clonazepam. It was more effective for me, I was scripted Klonopin earlier on and never really took to them, I got my script changed to Ativan before Valium (3x1mg Ativan/Lorazepam then 2x5mg Valium briefly before stepping up to 2x10mg, which is what I quit from).

 

['medicine cabinet']

Well i thought id update. My pa is a total bitch...a few months ago my dads biz partners son went thru my car stole a bunch of stuff a messenger bag with some clothes, my xanax and mp3 player. I called the dr and they were all like no prob well call it in so you can get it refilled. No prob. When i went in there today and stated my case she said she didnt believe me that they were stolen!!! She treated me like a total drug seeker and arbitrarily disagreed with everything i said and was a condecending BITCH!!! I really try not to use that word but she knew she and her collegue fucked up and blamed it on me!!! She was like were not to blame, we trust the patients to take the re amount to which i said he was giving me 6mg, thats higher than it should have been. Sooo, instead of giving me kpins or ativan she gave me more xanax! The same fucking amount but w no refill!!! My pharmacist was nice enough to hold on to the rx so id still have refills available, but her plan is to taper me on the xanax! Im furious! She basically said i was lying about everything and distanced herself as much as possible. And when she said she gets calls all the time about ppl stealing meds she doesnt believe them even when there is a police report. And i said well its not like they were after my rx they wanted my laptop bag. And she said thats what the last person said. I could have prob said i had it hidden in my anus and thats where they stole it from and she would have said yep thats what the last guy said. She called klonopin lorazepam, lol wtf!!!! How retarded is this old bitch! Thankfully i can get 400 .5mg from peru for 80$ from a guy ive been in biz with for a while so since she is being a cunt ill just buy from him. I tell her the xanax is making me go up and down, so what does she do?? Write me the exact same rx but with no refills...so ill just have to go back next month. Im pissed...and she used the word facetious a few times almost to the point that she didnt think i know what it means. I want to write to the office of medical conduct and ream her out for saying i should have known better when i was rxd 90mg a month and should have only taken the bareminimum. So shes basically washed her hands. Im going down a dose each month....no refills on this recent rx since she wrote "weaning off the drug" my pharmacist was like wtf?? You want off and they give you more? Wanting to get off yourself is a huge step right there. Arrrrrgghhhh!!!!!!! Incensed doesnt even sum up my feelings on this. So fuck it, if shes going to just keep me on the same prob drug and rush me off, then you better believe im buying a stockpile. FUCKERS! I told her i go thru them too quick and shes just setting me up for failure so she can absolve herself and stick me in a detox....thanks for the input guys, but i guess some stupid ass bitch (oh btw, shes not a pa i learned but a crnp whatever that means!!!!!aaaarrrg! She treated me like i was asking for 120 40mg opana or something.....unfucking believabable. Who think i should write her boss for treating me like a junkie drug seeker scumbag?

 

[MagickalKat777]

Nurse practitioners are the worst dude.

Find a new doctor before you stir the pot. The last time I made a complaint, they just fucking dropped me and they called the pharmacy and revoked my prescription refills too and it was scramble time to find a new doctor.

 

[Lopez]

why isn't valium used for tapering over clonazepam instead of vice versa? after all it has a longer half-life and more active metabolites?

not to mention it's significantly less sedating..

 

[gingerbaker]

And not nearly as potent. Also, the preparations are much better suited to tapering because diazepam comes in tablets as small as 1mg (split into .5mg) whereas clonazepam only comes as small as .25mg which is equivalent to 5mg of diazepam (I think that conversion is right).

I think that is the most important factor when tapering off benzos because the hardest part is when you get down to the lower doses.

 

[Tommyboy]

I would go with diazepam. I found that clonazepam gave me bad rebound anxiety, and since it 'fucked me up' more than Valium I found that it had a higher potential for abuse with me so I never got a script for it and instead went with Valium to taper off of Xanax. The doctor suggested clonazepam but I said I preferred to use diazepam and he was fine with that too. The Valium worked well for my general anxiety, and it was very easy to get by with one dose per day, and since it was more subtle that clonazepam in terms of messing me up I didn't really abuse it.

Clonazepam isn't nearly as good a choice as a ton of doctor's and various people seem to think for tapering people off benzos.

Diazepam and Nordiazepam (or Clorazepate) all have extremely long half lives with clorazepate having a half-life of up to 8 days. This means that each "step" down actually self-tapers and is a much easier transition on the body. Diazepam is probably the best though because it comes in 1mg preparations and can easily be compounded or used in suspension to give greater control over the taper. They will "cross-taper" you to an equivalent dose of diazepam (if that's the route they go) and so you won't feel any significant withdrawal but you will feel a change as diazepam is quite different from a pharmacokinetic point than alprazolam (alp has a very "spikey" effect and diazepam is a much more level feeling). Good luck!

I read that clorazepate has a half-life of 48 hours, not 8 days. I'm not sure where you are from, but in the US diazepam comes in 10, 5, and 2mg. There isn't a 1mg diazepam pill here.

Nurse practitioners are the worst dude.

Find a new doctor before you stir the pot. The last time I made a complaint, they just fucking dropped me and they called the pharmacy and revoked my prescription refills too and it was scramble time to find a new doctor.

Agreed. The prescription monitoring programs can actually work in your favor when finding a new doctor since it proves that you were prescribed that dose of Xanax. Just tell the new doctor that you did not agree with your previous doctors (or PAs) plan for you with your future benzo therapy. If you tell them that you are actually looking to switch to a longer acting benzo and then lower the dose they should have no problem treating you since a drug seeker is not going to ask for their script to be lowered, so they should trust you.

why isn't valium used for tapering over clonazepam instead of vice versa? after all it has a longer half-life and more active metabolites?

not to mention it's significantly less sedating..

Valium is used for tapering a lot, so not sure why you think it's not. Every doctor has their own prescribing practices that they stick to, with certain drugs that they use as their first line of treatment for certain conditions. So some doctors primarily use Valium to taper someone off of benzos, and use clonazepam as their back-up if the patient doesn't react we'll to the Valium. Other doctors do the same thing but with those two meds reversed.

 

[gingerbaker]

I read that clorazepate has a half-life of 48 hours, not 8 days. I'm not sure where you are from, but in the US diazepam comes in 10, 5, and 2mg. There isn't a 1mg diazepam pill here.

You're right about the diazepam preparation (I had been thinking that 1mg would be the lowest possible dose since it's half of a 2mg pill) thanks for clarifying that. As for clorazepate's half-life, you're also right about that but clorazepate is essentially nordiazepam which does have a half-life of between 36 and 200hrs (I'm guessing it's probably higher the more frequently and higher doses one uses because I can't figure out what else would cause the wide range other accumulation).