Anyone know...

[blase deviant]

...the exact figures by which cimetidine affects alprazolam/etc...

I can find that grapefruit generally increases benzos CMax by 50%, but the only stat I found for alprazolam was that cimetidine increased AUC to 1.77-1.79x.

It provided a figure saying how much it affected clearance (ng/ml sec or something like that, I didn't pay attention because it had no relevance to me), I don't think it'd be possible to calculate the increase of CMax based on the decrease in clearance from the blood without a shitload of annoying and complicated equations, so meh...

Just wondering if any of you had access to journals/info I didn't.

And no, this doesn't really matter one bit, I'm just curious, trying to decide whether cimetidine or gfj is better, especially since all they sell around here is ruby red dole, which says it's 100% juice, but that doesn't tell me how much of the essential flavinoids (WTF kind of word is that, anyway?) are in there.

 

[BilZ0r]

Well with both cimetidine and GFJ, it depends on the dose... anyway, I've got this saying an plasma increase of 57%, and this one says "40-50%".

 

[blase deviant]

I hate journals. One tells me sublingual midazolam has a bioavailability of 80% as compared to 33% or so normally. Another tells me it has no difference.

And then we have all these damn cimetidine reports, some saying that it affects it, some saying it doesn't.

Fuck it and fuck journals, I'll just take them, and if it hits harder, so be it.

But if the sublingual bonus bioavailability is a crock of shit, I'm gonna be pissed since I drooled up a bit of the last one, and it oral is just as potent, I drooled it up and wasted it for no good reason.

Oh well, this topic has served its purpose, if it had one to begin with.

 

[BilZ0r]

Midazolam shouldn't be potentiated via sublingual as much as say alprazolam, or pretty much all the other benzos...

 

[blase deviant]

That's odd, I thought xanax/everything else just hit quicker, whereas midazolam was better sublingual because it has a nasty first-pass like morphine and shti.

because I know snorted/IV is like 2-4x as strong as oral I forget which, but whenever I snort it, I have to do it in about a million skinny-ass short lines because I cough after taking up so much, and if I had any more laying out it'd just get blown all over the floor.

I don't even think midazolam works, because it's a bigass pill, and even when I let it sit under my tongue crushed for 5 min, I think most of it is still in my saliva because of all the damn fillers and shit, not absorbed in my mouth, so I'm basically just holding it in my saliva and then taking it orally anyway.

 

[BilZ0r]

Taking the sublingually that aren't close to pure it pretty fucking hard, I often try sorta, sticking it to the inside of my mouth, because under the tounge, you know, that's where the saliva comes from...

 

[blase deviant]

Hmm... you mean like stuck between the bottom of your gum and cheek?

I try to keep a little space between my tongue and the bottom of my mouth, and sorta breathe lightly over it, to try to keep the saliva evaporating. I dunno if it works, I don't think it does much, but it can't hurt, and I have 5 min. to spare, so I do it.

Unfortunately these pills are hard as hell, and rifling through my wallet yesterday, like all my bills have midazolam pill stains/powder on them, not all of which wipes off (pretty much anything other than a dollar bill and these things will rip right through the paper, no matter how careful you are, and even then, a dollar bill only lasts a few times or so before it rips through - depending on how new the bill is).

 

[BilZ0r]

Speaking of benzo potentiation: I ate a 7.5mg zopiclone pill cause I had nothing better to do; that whole day I'd been drinking grapefruit juice. I ate the pill between the entrée and the main course... I can't remember a thing from the whole of last night. And I'd never had a complete blackout from such a shitty pill before.

 

[blase deviant]

I'm curious... I had triazolam before and loved the effects, but haven't been able to find it since...

How do zopiclone/lunesta/ambien/all that crap compare in effects to triazolam?

 

[BilZ0r]

I've never had triazolam, but not really as fun as other -real- benzos I've had.

 

[Limpet_Chicken]

Personally, I don't use benzos to get off on alone, ever, I do occasionally take 20mg or so of nitrazepam when i'm toking up with a few friends,or with opiates, but when I used to get zopiclone, I loved the stuff, I can't remember the exact dose, I think they were either 5 or 7.5mg tabs (shame on me for not looking it up) but 2x of those on top of my dose of morphine or dihydrocodeine had the wierdest effects, granted I usually combined the two with promethazine, but even without it, it caused fully developed audio hallucinations of a very predictable kind, tone appeared to shift down a pitch, and every couple of minutes, there would be wierd sounds, like guitar chords being played, or strange high-pitched whines, like a huge zipper being unzipped.

 

[blase deviant]

I seem to be the only person who enjoys triazolam over any other benzo, and doesn't fall asleep on it (I fall asleep easier on xanax than triazolam).

I was only scripted it once though, and only 3 pills.

 

[blase deviant]

Taking the sublingually that aren't close to pure it pretty fucking hard, I often try sorta, sticking it to the inside of my mouth, because under the tounge, you know, that's where the saliva comes from...

I've been thinking about that, but how do you keep the stuff from getting stuck in your teeth and crap or funnel it into the side of your cheek.

 

[BilZ0r]

A little gets stuck in your teeth no matter where you put it. I just put it in a spoon and drop down into the space between the gums and the cheeck.

 

[blase deviant]

A little gets stuck in your teeth no matter where you put it. I just put it in a spoon and drop down into the space between the gums and the cheeck.

Sounds like I good idea next time I get midazolam, which will probably be never since I've come to the conclusion that they suck, unless you mix em with xanax or klonopin, in which case you'd be better off adding more xanax/kpin anyway, so probably never. Unless you IV them, but I'm saving needles (barring IM) for awhile later in my life.

Thanks though.

 

[Jamshyd]

I usually chew on my benzos and try hard not to swallow for a while untill they completely dissolve in my mouth. I almost never take clonazepam other than that way due to both its pleasant taste and its lengthy comeup. I find that that works effectively (think diazepam in 15-20 mins).

GFJ, cemitidine, and ranitidine never did anything for me with benzos/opioids (especially the latter) other than a radical increase in negative side-effects.

 

[blase deviant]

I'm curious, why do people chew on them instead of crushing and then funneling into their mouth?

is there a difference in effects, or just a preference?

And yeah, this should prolly be moved to OD now.

 

[Jamshyd]

I'm curious, why do people chew on them instead of crushing and then funneling into their mouth?

is there a difference in effects, or just a preference?

And yeah, this should prolly be moved to OD now.

The few times I tried that convoluted method it triggered a gag reflex. Not pleasant. Very unpractical.

 

[blase deviant]

I don't get a gag reflex, I like the taste.

tastes like candy compared to sublingual ketamine (I wanted it to last all day so I didn't have to keep snorting since I was smoking weed and didn't want to spill lines and stuff and keep going back for bowls AND lines... spend more time re-dosing than being buzzed, so I decided on oral, but did sublingual just for the hell of it to see if i could get any extra potency out of it, also tried crushed up adderall xr, worst taste EVER, next to 2c-e or 2c-t2 or something, but I've never seen any reason to do that sublingual)

I was just wondering if it was more effective to move it around towards the cheeks and stuff, like if the vessels on the bottom under the tongue and on the tongue got 'saturated' at a certain point and stopped absorbing...

 

[Jamshyd]

I don't get a gag reflex, I like the taste.

tastes like candy compared to sublingual ketamine (I wanted it to last all day so I didn't have to keep snorting since I was smoking weed and didn't want to spill lines and stuff and keep going back for bowls AND lines... spend more time re-dosing than being buzzed, so I decided on oral, but did sublingual just for the hell of it to see if i could get any extra potency out of it, also tried crushed up adderall xr, worst taste EVER, next to 2c-e or 2c-t2 or something, but I've never seen any reason to do that sublingual)

I was just wondering if it was more effective to move it around towards the cheeks and stuff, like if the vessels on the bottom under the tongue and on the tongue got 'saturated' at a certain point and stopped absorbing...

As I mentioned above, I do not mind the taste of clonazepam at all. The gag reflux is due to the texture of the powder and that powder randomly landing in your mouth.

Anyways, I do not think the vessels can ever get "saturated." It would be the space down there that gets filled up with powder from fillers.

EDIT: One second later, bilz0r .