Benzos Analog Act

[smokeymcpot42088]

ONCE answer with a yes or a no. "Only the benzos listed as schedule one will be considered schedule one" if this is your statement just post yes. I am not a chemist, i am sure that has became clear at this point. Talk to me like a damn kindeegardener.

 

[smokeymcpot42088]

triazo ring = sched 1 -- y or n. (ot necessarily). Thank you again. A clear interpretation of the law is something worth having.

 

[smokeymcpot42088]

Thank you for breakin it down for the slow side of the room.

 

[simstim]

I think analog act prosecutions are extremely rare unless they hit you for distribution. Does anyone know of personal use amounts ever being prosecuted under the analog act?

 

[Fertile]

Federal Register :: Request Access

OK - cracked it. 1 (simple, cheap, high-yielding) extra step will make ALL benzodiazepines into totally legal prodrugs. Production cost will not increase. OK so the compounds with be 7-11% less potent, but I sincerely doubt ANYONE is going to notice a difference. In fact many will be FASTER acting but duration will not be altered.

Well done DEA - now we can start all over again. I spend 30 minutes finding the papers... how much did YOU just waste?

I'm kind of presuming all of the medicinal chemists lurking here will know exactly what I refer to. Many are far, far more able than I. I'm just not allowed to go pointing to the papers as that would be classed as 'synthesis'. Now you know it can be done, I expect people will work it out in a few hours.

 

[xtcgrrrl]

Saying all that i think we all agree the drugs laws are dumb. Kief Richards is correct too. We already have a DE A that deals with legalized cannabis, psychedelics (enough to even back off making more illegal) and even backed off of kratom. (an opioid). Stuff like this would be a headache too. No bad drugs anymore. I think the whole drug war is winding down

Access is and has always been the problem here. Drug users need controlled access to drugs that are tested and measured, then there are fewer problems and use actually DECREASES. Switzerland is a fantastic example…

 

[Fertile]

Access is and has always been the problem here. Drug users need controlled access to drugs that are tested and measured, then there are fewer problems and use actually DECREASES. Switzerland is a fantastic example…

Switzerland couldn’t stop drug users. So it started supporting them.

The Swiss people took drastic measures to reduce the number of people dying from opioid overdose. Their approach is effective - and unorthodox.

www.northcarolinahealthnews.org

I don't think many nations would manage to get a consensus that addiction is a disease. Generations of Swiss have grown up with the 'four pillar' model and being cynical - the relative costs is what has kept it going. If burglaries go down 98% then home insurance goes down (for example) so the people can really see it SAVING them money. The cost of treatment for HIV and hep are also very high so again, it's possible to show savings.

But in nations who see opioid dependence as a choice (in spite of so many users having been prescribed the medicines initially) and detention is an industry, not such a clear economic choice. When medical cover isn't free, it's not costing the people to treat the HIV and hep.

 

[xtcgrrrl]

Switzerland couldn’t stop drug users. So it started supporting them.

The Swiss people took drastic measures to reduce the number of people dying from opioid overdose. Their approach is effective - and unorthodox.

www.northcarolinahealthnews.org

I don't think many nations would manage to get a consensus that addiction is a disease. Generations of Swiss have grown up with the 'four pillar' model and being cynical - the relative costs is what has kept it going. If burglaries go down 98% then home insurance goes down (for example) so the people can really see it SAVING them money. The cost of treatment for HIV and hep are also very high so again, it's possible to show savings.

But in nations who see opioid dependence as a choice (in spite of so many users having been prescribed the medicines initially) and detention is an industry, not such a clear economic choice. When medical cover isn't free, it's not costing the people to treat the HIV and hep.

I saw this as being a very pragmatic approach imo

 

[Fertile]

I saw this as being a very pragmatic approach imo

I think it's by far the best approach for everyone.

But when law enforcement institutions hold so much power - they will WANT the budget to 'deal' with the problem. They don't have the skillset nor the experience but it's easy to get publicity if you announce 'a crackdown on drug users'. A simple soundbite/headline/mission.

The US fentanyl epidemic is horrific - I've lost 2 friends in 3 days. And yet the US still charges people for access to methadone and buprenorphine! So it seems to me that it's in the interests of these clinics for their to be a HUGE addiction problem.

FYI bulk methadone costs just $526/Kg - so a 90mg/day dose should cost 10¢ or less. I believe they charge $126/week (Medicaid figures so most people will pay much more).

US business is making a FORTUNE out of addiction.

Here in the UK it's free because if an addict commits just 1 crime - it's going to cost much more than the methadone... and I think it's fair to say that if crime levels drop, it saves everyone money one way or another.

 

[Garri]

Well.... this used to not be an issue at all because none of the benzos were considered schedule 1. All benzos were schedule 4 (well all prescription ones still are schedule 4).... and the analog act only applies to schedule 1 and 2 substances wherein the analog's chemical structure of said schedule 1 or 2 substance is "substantially similar" it would be regarded as, itself, a schedule 1 (or possibly 2) substance. From what I've gathered when I first started looking unto this, it can be a REALLY small detail that can determine a judges ruling as to whether the chemical in question's structure is "substantially similar".

In US vs Forbes

AET was thrown into question about whether it was to be considered "substantially similar" to DMT and DET (currently scheduled chemicals).
In this case, the court decided that NO... AET was not similar. It is apparently a primary amine while DMT and DET are tertiary amines. That AET cannot be synthesized from either DMT or DET. Also, that the hallucinogenic or stimulant effects of AET are not substantially similar to the effects of DMT or DET.

Even more interesting is that the court in this case stated that the "Federal Analogue Act" was unconstitutionally vague, in that

"Because the definition of 'analogue' as applied here provides neither fair warning nor effective safeguards against arbitrary enforcement, it is  void for vagueness"

-I like the way this court thinks

Apparently, not everyone agreed with me, because the federal analog act was not changed and is still vague to this day... AET ended up specifically being scheduled (1 of all things) so that any who synth, possess, or distribute are instantly criminals. What a sad state of affairs.

US vs Washam ruled that an analog of the drug GHB was substantially similar, however... so there really is no telling whether the law will be on your side or not... making this whole thing rather worrisome.

I suppose, my search for designer benzos are over now that many of them are schedule 1 and therefore their analogs can now be covered under the analog act... however.... I believe and am hoping that I can obtain 2f-dck.... it is my next quest.... onward towards this lofty goal. Wish me luck.

I'm looking for an legal or fairly more legal opioid antagonist and I've been running into the same problems all the designers are scheduled and the rc's are hard to find

 

[LucidSDreamr]

If "Blam" is bromazolam then yes it is covered by this act now.
Best of luck and be safe.
Welcome to BL.

What about etizolam?

 

[Fertile]

What about etizolam?

Dependence liability - OK safer than most, but all the same, a risk.

I've lost the port. In the 90s their were only 3 kind of people 'Drugs are fun', 'drugs are not fun (but I take them' & 'drugs are hell'.

 

[packjamNL]

The law is clear. Substantially similar structure and action.

Bromazolam is a textbook example of an analog with respect to flubromazolam. It is not currently scheduled, therefore it's an analog.

Bromazolam is only a fluorine atom different than flubromazolam.

However, if they made flubromazepam a schedule I drug, bromazepam would still be schedule IV.

I get agressive from Flubromazolam even looking for a beef with friends, maybe this is because I like to drink with it, but look out, you may look for a fight with Flubromazolam, I am not the only one, I was looking for a beef with an old friend, when I got it, I told him a week later what I took for benzo's and luckily he understood, he told me I got 7 friends after Flubromazolam and he told me: I got a beef with all of them, I had to apologize to 7 people

 

[LucidSDreamr]

DEA filed an intent to schedule in December of 2022 I believe. I don't know that it's been scheduled yet, but it should be pretty soon.

Fucking pieces of shit. They are the most vile evil pieces of filth on earth. And I’m on a really happy positive high right now so that’s me being nice

 

[Fertile]

I get agressive from Flubromazolam even looking for a beef with friends, maybe this is because I like to drink with it, but look out, you may look for a fight with Flubromazolam, I am not the only one, I was looking for a beef with an old friend, when I got it, I told him a week later what I took for benzo's and luckily he understood, he told me I got 7 friends after Flubromazolam I got a beef with all of them

Yes - alcohol and benzodiazepines makes a terrible mixture. What really ticks me off is that we even designed an alcohol mimic. We were able to separate the 'happy' effects of alcohol and the 'angry' effects of alcohol. We sold the design to Alcarette and they did NOTHING with it.

Since then we have improved upon the alcohol mimic to make it more accurate. Right now we are working on an alcohol-mimic that isn't based on the benzodiazepine scaffold. I SUSPECT that was the issue - benzos are known to cause dependence and so it was refused a licence. So choosing a novel scaffold would solve THAT issue.

 

[packjamNL]

True Fertile, but with this Flubromazolam it's realy going nasty, like I said a friend of mine experienced the same, he had a beef with 7 of his (all of them) friends, by mixing the powder form with PG. I will never ever use Flubromazolam again, because you go nutts, I took it at 5pm and took it with 10% beer, and man I called people, friends and told them all their fkn weaknesses and to go f themselves, I believe it is invented in Russia, it was used as a medicine, not as a sleeping aid, and thought that had something to do with it, I doubt it, it's worse than taking steroids, but I learned my lesson, there must be more psychonauts who have the same experience with this crazy stuff. If you take it at 11 or 12 pm and go to bed it should be ok but never take it or a lot with alcahol, I wish I never did. Cheers

 

[Bezoluv&respect]

Strictly speaking in response to fluidity of Supply Demand:

A decade ago (Shy) ; the potency was 75% more potent.

And all I know as a chemist ; clonezolam; Flubro; Flualpo have recently completely stopped for accessibility.