Alternative Beauty Care (Questions welcome)

[Ninae]

I've tried this before but it didn't really work out (mostly because I was too wasted or ruined by WDs at the time) so I'll give it another go, in a better state of mind this time, as I think it's well worth the time.

This is mostly intended as a form of community service as I'll actually might be able to be of some real assistance to some out there. I'll start out by saying I'm a partly trained alternative aesthetician/cometologist and also in the process of writing a book on natural/alternative beauty, so a thread like this might turn out to be of some help to us both.

I've also spent a great deal of time studying the great and legendary beauties of our history, along with their beauty routines, as well as age-old cosmetic practices which were in many instances far superior to what we have in our modern society today. Which is more about spewing out a bunch of toxic chemicals as cheap as possible, to be sold for as high a price as possible, with very little regard to their actual impact on our health or physical appearance.

In my experimenting on myself and others I've also seen some pretty amazing results so it might be a good thing if I ever got around to finishing the book (that would be the day) and anything that could inspire me to would be a good thing. Not that I'm pretending to be holding the keys to save humanity...LOL...but it can't be denied that both our physical health and appearance play a significant role in the quality of our day-to-day life.

I'll get around to what I have to teach in a bit, would just like to point out this might explain some of my fascination with female beauty (despite not being a Lesbian) and seeming obsession with my own appearance. i.e. that it's also for experimental purposes and not just about vanity or some bizarre fetish on my part (not that I claim to be free of vanity - what woman can?).

I guess I almost feel it as something of a small "calling" - if you can use that word for something a seemingly "insignificant". Though if you seriously consider the effects of modern cosmetics on our health and the development of seriousness illnesses like Cancer, as well as the impact of our apperance on or daily life, it's not really as insignificant as it might seem at first glance.

Anyway, I wholeheartedly welcome any questions, or sharing of ideas between those with experience in the field - bear in mind this entails the kind of beauty care where you have to think and experiment with for yourself, as opposed to just go out and buy something pre-made for you that you have been taught to buy. And if all goes according to plan I should be able to complete a rough draft in the next month or so. Not as ambitious as it might sound, as I already have most of it in my head, and I am a fast and prolific writer.

So, if there's anything you'd like to ask - let's hear it. Not that I pretend to know everything, like anyone possibly does, but I do know a fair bit more than what the money-driven, commercial cosmetic industry is showing down our throats on a daily basis. While all the while we're getting sicker, aging more rapidly, and don't have much of anything to show for it.

Alternatives to plastic surgery is one of the things closest to my heart, so if this is something you're considering, please feel free to hit me up for a second opinion before you go any further, either through the forum or in private, and I'll answear within the best of my abilities, as this is not always the appropriate solution and in many cases there are superior natural alternatives in existence. All this is quite heavily suppressed, of course, due to financial incentives - what else.

I think this will do as an opening post but will soon start getting into the details - which are many - as it's a complex subject indeed. In the meantime, please feel free to ask or share your ideas or experiences - any contribution is most welcome.

So if you can put your personal feelings towards me aside, if you have any, no matter what they might be, and trust me on this, you might come to be glad you did - we all have out strengths and something to contribute.

That is all for now - thank you for your time and may the blessings of Christ be with you - even in the smallest things in life.

A true legendary beauty - far from the Hollywood "plastic robots" (of which there are many).

 

[Mysterie]

^ her eyes are bloodshot and she seems possessed, that picture scares me

my feelings on this subject is that the entire cosmetic industry targets our own negative thoughts and fears about ourselves and exploits them for their personal gain

beauty is truly in the eye of the beholder, once we learn to love and accept ourselves that helps for us to become beautiful

for me beauty/health, hold a similar relationship to the mind/body phenomena

i dont know what natural alternatives to plastic surgery you are talking about, but its really a sad thing when someone is that distraught over a superficial issue that they feel its worth taking a knife to their face

i think it could be a positive step if there was more interest in less radical procedures for people that do feel that way about their body

 

[Ninae]

If you feel that way, more power to you, but sadly this is now a very common and serious issue with wide-reaching consequences. In certain circles, going in for a nip 'n' tuck is almost becoming synonymnous with going to the hairdresser's, when of course it's nohing LIKE going to the hairdresser's.

It's so bad, at a guess I'd say 1/3 of females, and many males, either have, are planning to, or wish they could perform some form of plastic surgery to enhance one or more of their body parts. This wouldn't be so bad if all these surgeries were legitimate and led to good results, but as we all can see many of these turn the patient into a laughing-stock and should never be performed in the first place.

The whole industry is still very much in an experimental stage with the average person (who can't afford to pay for royal treatment) as the research subject with very varying results.

Thankfully, some of the worst like face-lifts are now being moved sway from, but there are still many (like hair-transplants) with no hope of a good results that are still performed just to make money. In fact, there are so many problems with the whole plastic surgery industry, 50% of it is more of a curse than a blessing.

I'll get into this in a bit more detail later for those reading who are maybe considering something like this - so at least they'll be informed and know the difference between what can and can't be done. Which could save them from a lifetime of humiliation and disfigurement...

 

[Ninae]

And while beauty is in the eye of the beholder to some extent, there are also objective standards of beauty, like form, symmetry, colour, etc. (a crystal clear green eye colour would be seen by most as more beatiful than a muddy green one) and the "Beauty is in the eye of the beholder principle" seems to be more about what is preferred among what is considered obectively beautiful already.

Like, if a bunch of men had to rate a grop of different supermodels, they might all end up rating differently, so you could conclude it's all in the eye of the beholder. But at the same time they were all asked to pick between a group of women who were all considered very objectively beautiful - so how subjective is it really?

I would say it's sbjective to some degree, or as long as it falls within what is generally considered beautiful to the human eye. It's the same principle at work within nature, like trees, flowers, and landscapes, as well as works of art. The human being isn't really as different as all that even if we might like to think of ourselves as such, to spare our feelings and considering the inherent value of the human soul, etc.

But if you talked to an owner of a model agency I think she would have a slighty different perspective. So the subjective model I tend to see as only half-true and maybe something we like to use more to even out human differences and make ourselves feel better.

Otherwise, it's almost akin to saying "There is no such thing as beauty" or "One thing can be just as beautiful as anything else". But, sure, I do agree with the subjective interpretation to some degree - some prefer Marilyn Monroe and some prefer Brigitte Bardot - but they are also very close - is it really more subjective or objective?

Personally, I don't think Ms. Bardot could hold a candle to Ms. Monroe, though she had an unique beauty of her own, and you can't argue they're both beautiful...and most human brains would instantly recognise them as such...

On a different note...while as far as I'm aware Bardot was a natural beauty, Marilyn Monroe had at least 5 plastic surgeries performed before they made her a star....

This is interesting, especially as the quality of the work she had done surpasses anything I think I've seen in our times, and I'll get into that a bit later.

 

[Ninae]

Ok, here's my take on plastic surgery, from what I've been able to gather so far...and it differs a bit from the commercial version.

For one thing, it's been around for a long time. They first started making use of it for the ones they wanted to make into movie stars or otherwise elevate to god-like status, like pop-stars or super-models, to make money on. As 100% physical perfection is so very rare as to be almost be non-existent. Apart from that it was the privilige for the super-wealthy, like Royalty, and other Elite.

So it started with the big studios paying a fortune for the genius surgeons at the time...these were highly gifted and trained individuals who had spent a lifetime honing their craft, knew what they were doing, and could get some pretty astounding and realistic looking results.

Marilyn Monroe is a good example. As far as I know, and you can see from comparing her early pics, she had at least 5 surgeries performed to make her a star. Her nose, for one thing, which was quite large and not that well-formed to begin with (though apart from that she was a very pretty girl with great potential - most dont end up looking like that after 5 surgeries).

The other thing she did was chiselling down her chin, which was quite large and much longer, inserting cheek-implants to add balance to her face, and raising her eyebrows along with making her eyes wider (so in the early days before it had all settled down her eyes were unnaturally wide-open in a way that is usually only seen in children under 5). Same with her eyebrows, they were unrealistically high, but all this to give her a more feminine look. In the first years her nose was also quite swollen, before it settled down to the perfect, pert little thing she could later show off.

The main thing, though, is that her surgeries were wildly successful, unlike anything I've ever seen (Oh, I'm sure I've seen it on other actreses/models that there was a lot of money riding on, but not that I've been aware of). But comparing to the kind of surgery that is available to the masses now...it has very little in common with that.

So to begin with it seems plastic surgery was reserved for those to be launched into show business, as well as to the very rich, of course, like everything else. I also think to start with to be allowed to do this form of surgery someone needed to be eceptionally gifted and have undergone vigorous training, as a human face is nothing to mess around with, and it takes a lot of skill to get it right and make it look natural and undetectable.

So not like now when a cancer specialist can decide he'd rather open a plastic surgery practice as it will be more lucrative and spend a few years to "learn the artform" before he deems himself ready to start forming new human features.

Another thing that happened is, I think, if say one surgery, like performing a satisfactory nose-job took 3 hours, many doctors comcluded if they shortened the time to 1 hour they could earn 3 times as much money...and greed basically took over. Besides, what did the mindless masses know anyway? And normal people don't have the money to pay for the real deal, so let's just let them have something half-done...or the poor man's version of it. They won't know the difference...and if they're disappointed with the results they only have themselves to blame as it's a controversial practice with no guarantees, anyway. And when you look at the results and what many end up looking like you can see how this could be.

It's just about greed and good, legitimate plastic surgery is still a privilige for the elite or very wealthy, unless you just require something very simple, like lowering a nose bridge, which doesn't take much time or skill, you might still get lucky. Meaning it's not really much of an option for most of us...and the whole thing is more in the realm of fantasy than actual reality.

If you observe most who have had something done...even if the result isn't very great and they actually looked better before...they are still elated as they finally had their fantasy come true and they are living more in the world of fantasy where eveything looks great and just what they hoped for. It's something that exists very much in the realm of fantasy, definitely - I'm sure even Madonna has her moments when she believes she looks 10 years younger when she comes out of her Botox and all the stuff she does.

Or aren't there many who would agree with me on this? Even better, how many have had procedures performed which they regret? Or have seen others have and think they should never have?

Not to be a wet blanket - just a little wake-up call perhaps.

 

[Ninae]

Still a naturally beautiful girl + genius high quality work = Success
But most of us won't be that lucky.

 

[SirTophamHat]

my friend and i often discuss how wet clay would be way better at being sunscreen than sunscreen (or sunblock, whichever ya call it)

 

[Ninae]

That's a new one...I would recommend Dr. Hauschka 15-30...although it makes your face look like you indeed smeared a greasy layer of white clay all over it.

Sun Protection is one of the main and easiest forms of anti-aging measures though. Nothing ages you like the sun. For women foundation/powder is a good help too.

So many great brands around now...though there's nothing quite like putting together your own with plant oils and fats, floral waters, essential oils, herbal extracts, and moisturising agents like Hydraleuic acid...or maybe I'm just a big girl. Gotta love maing your own perfumes from floral oils, like true rose oil, though. Nothing quite as romantic and guys seem to love it too...

 

[Ninae]

Would love to swap recipes with anyone, by the way...

Rather than paying a fortune for some revolting smelling synthetic crap, where you mostly pay for all the advertising, all the while you could be luxuriating in the tender scent of fresh Carnations...mmm.

Carnations are one of my favourite smells full stop. Plus I think that's how God intended women to smell. As opposed to what we have on offer these days.

 

[Maya]

I developed an extremely sensitive skin as soon as I migrated to Canada. I firmly believe that the cold and dry weather has caused this issue. Even the simplest type of facial wash or moisturizer will cause redness, itchiness and dryness on my face. Currently I am using oatmeal soaked in warm water to wash my face. It only not made my face radiant and glowing but it also moisturized it. It is very economical I may say so I definitely recommend this to anyone who has sensitive skin.

 

[Ninae]

Great use of a natural substance for the skin - nutritious too.

Have you tried Dr. Hauschka's Cleansing Cream with Almond Meal? Definitely the best and gentlest I've come across so far. Sort of a combined cleansing cream/mild exfoliator ro be used daily and it does SO much for your skin.

Their moisturisers are wonderful as well - The Rose Creams are nice but a bit rich for me - my favourite is Melissa Lemon Balm, which is SO light, fresh, and great smelling. Not to mention their masks - a treasure everyone of them.

Not the most expensive brand in the world - but maybe the healthiest and the one with the most value for your skin. And at least it won't lead to premature aging. It can't even be described, you need to try it.

http://www.drhauschka.co.uk/home

As for a toner, I would make my own with floral water, like Rose or Lavender, with added alcohol or a moisturising agent, and maybe some herbal extract, depending on my needs.

 

[Maya]

Thank you Ninae I have browsed through the website and I am impressed with the information mainly with the ingredients on the products. I like that this is made from natural ingredients which looks very promising for someone like me with extremely sensitive skin. I have to be very cautious with choosing a skin care regimen and this would mean to avoid perfumed facial cleansers, toners and moisturizers.

 

[Ninae]

Cool, we seem to have common interests. I've always been like this, since I started experimenting with cosmetics, I just wanted the best of the best (and what you can find in the supermarket is obviously far from that).

In my system, there are 3 kind of natural skin care:

1) The type you buy in bottles already made for you - of varying quality (I have quite a bit to say about this by the way).

2). The type you make yourself out of natural ingreeints like plant oils, floral waters, herbal extracts, and chemcial ingredients like perservatives and emulsifiers. I prefer to make small batches to keep in the fridge for a week as I like mine fresh with as few worthless chemicals as possible.

3) The type you make take straight from the fridge or food cabinet, in other words, the same kind of thing you put in your mouth to nourish and sustain your body. And seeing as your hair/skin is also part of your body this also makes good sense and is maybe what is of the most value.

Some of the most precious are Honey, eggs, cream, juice and mash from fruits and vegetables, grains, nuts, and seeds, sprouts, Omega-3 oils, and just about the most nutrient-rich food you can find.

3 of my favourite things to do are:

1. Hair-mask of egg. You can use both white and yolk. The yolk is especially nutritious and the white is full of protein.

2. Honey mask. One of the most valuable things you can do for your skin. Deply moisturising, nourishing, and tightening. Great if you want to look fresh and your best for the night.

3. A rinse made of one or one half squeezed lemon and 1-2 teaspoons honey stirred into 1-3 litres of hot water to pour over your head after you wash it (standing over a bathtub or sink). Don't rinse it out of course. It gives your hair the most esquisite sweet, fresh smell, cleans out the hair and scalp, and the melted honey coats each strand and gives it a shiny, glassy appearance when it dries. Genius.

Egg white also makes a great facemask as it's pure protein and movie stars are known for saying they cover their face in egg white (egg yolk is also good) each morning and let it dry before they rinse it off to stay young looking and keep wrinkles at bay.

Sad how all this knowledge have been almost lost now and all we know to use is a collection of worthless/toxic chemicals that do little else but make money for those who sell them.

 

[Ninae]

^ her eyes are bloodshot and she seems possessed, that picture scares me

I think this is a bit irrelevant and kind of an unsuitable thing to say about one of the most beautiful women in the world, like most of us are that perfect or would have much better to show for ourselves. It was just an example of true beauty and a woman who had made the best of herself, and not about picking on or finding faults with other women, or comparing ourselves to them.

But mostly there seems to be a real misunderstanding of why I would post pictures of beautiful women in the first place, like the only reason can be that you're some kind of Freak or have an unhealthy obsession of some kind. LOL. When the fact of the matter is that I just happen to love beauty in all forms, and feel the more attention is brought to it the better. And the female form just happen to be how beauty is expressed in its most pure form, to the point it can make you truly high or feel intoxicated from it.

A man can't quite match that, although men are beautiful in their own way, their energy is a bit too rough so they can't channel beauty in quite the same way (though they have their other strengths). I could even make a list of which woman I find the most intoxicating, but have a feeling this wouldn't exactly be welcomed, and most wouldn't be able to relate to what I was on about anyway (unless they happened to be on Acid perhaps). So I Guess you're free to express admiration for all other forms of beauty, but not other women, I get it now.

Anyway, now you know my personal motivation for it, but my purpose is actually to teach women about beauty and how to make the best of themselves, as I've been involved in the beauty industry in various ways, and have learnt a thing or two along the way. So I could for instance teach a woman about symmetry, how to bring more symmetry to her face by performing facial exercises (as opposed to plastic sirgery which usually fails in this resoect). So that if he had a crooked mouth or a lopsided face she could correct it and the overall look of her face would be much improved which she would probably appreciate.

Might not seem like much to you, but the world being how it is, and how much females are judged on looks and how it affects their opportunties in life and their emotional life, it might be of considerable help to that girl.

This was only one example, but that is the kind of thing I have in mind when I say I want to help people learn more about beauty and how it works, and feel I should get going with my book which I've been putting on hold for years now.

I also wish women would be more co-operative when it comes to these things rather than being as catty and competitive as we can. Too many seem to hate the sight of a beautiful woman, even those who are good-looking enough themselves, like they can't be happy for someone else but only feel resentment. I don't know why this is. I'm sure if we could share out beauty secrets and learn to be happier for each other we could live in a world that would be a bit better.

Anyway, that's what I have to say about that.

 

[Maya]

I definitely agree with you. I go by natural skin care products these days as it is the only option that has been working for my skin. With regards to cosmetics, I use mineral make up such as Bare Escentuals and I swear by it as it is the only foundation that has not made my skin flare up. The mineral make up contains titanium dioxide, zinc oxide which are anti-inflammatory properties.

I was using Evening Prim Rose Oil years ago for it's beneficial effects on eczema and dry skin. I also consume it orally to relieve my pms. I was not aware of oatmeal before so I used it for quite some time. I have noticed the effects after a couple of days and it totally hydrated my skin. The only setback was it was too oily to use as moisturizer for applying cosmetics and such so I had to apply the oil at night.

I tried honey mask before as well but it made my skin flare up. Yogurt was a better option so every couple of weeks or so I use yogurt as a moisturizer or a substitute cleanser to remove dead skin cells. I occasionally get itchiness and inflammation on my feet so I use Aloe Vera to calm the redness and itchiness.

 

[Ninae]

I've had to study these brands quite in depth when I was involved in picking out the best ones for a natural/organic store and have experiemented with quite a few. If you give me some time I'll try to put together a list from best to worst.

Like, I said they could be classed from 1-7 (6+7 being more a joke or taking on the natural/organic label only for promotional purposes).

While the brands you can find in supermarkets don't even warrant a comment. Though I suppose there are some who are naive enough to og for those too. People are so easily tricked and have no idea of ingredients or anything. They believe the commercial, not the ingredients list (LOL). No wonder some feel the masses are stupid.

Funny world we live in.

But there ARE some killer brands out there.

 

[Maya]

With my skin condition, I did not have a choice but to read the label contents of skin care products specially if I am going to try or switch to another brand. I have used Cetaphil which is supposed to be one of the simplest type of facial wash. I have used it for about a year together with Aveeno as my moisturizer and still developed an allergic reaction. I was using Clinique (3 step formula) but after a couple of months I have also developed a bad reaction to it. I have tried almost any type of brand in the market and through my quest of trying out numerous brands I noticed that I am allergic to products with the following chemicals:

cetyl alcohol

methylparaben

propylparaben

sodium lauryl sulfate

acetyl glucosamine

After stressing out about finding the product that will be suitable to my skin, I finally gave up on looking for the perfect brand. This is the time when I started reading about natural remedies for skin inflammation, dryness and itchiness and oatmeal became my bestfriend. I am thinking of using Evening Prim Rose again as a moisturizer for night time use this together with oatmeal is the best combination my skin loves.

There are days/months when I don't use anything at all and I believe that this depends on the weather type.. I usually have very dry skin but there are months specially summertime when my skin turns into a combination type. This is the only time when I can use the mildest facial wash and moisturizer (Spectro Gel) that I have ever encountered. This facial wash does not have any of the ingredients I have mentioned above (hurray!). This brand is very light on the skin and also contains seven moisturizers to help hydrate and restore dry skin.

I don't mind spending a little bit more of money every month as I indulge myself in spa facials but as I have mentioned, my skin is very picky so the facial products should mostly be made of natural ingredients.

 

[ad lib]

I like this thread

Do you have any recommendations for rosacia/really red cheeks?

I've tried various OTC products but nothing works- it's quite embarrassing. I have combination oily/dry skin. I don't really get breakouts unless i have my period, and even then the breakouts are minimum. I don't wear any makeup like concealer or foundation because it makes my skin worse.

 

[Ninae]

This is one of the harder ones as it comes from some form of disease deeper inside the skin and is hard to influence by something applied from the outside, unlike something more superficial. I would think something taken internally to help heal the problem would be more effective for this but this is something I have no knowledge of. So all I can think of in terms of cosmetics would be something to cover it up (or organic make-up).

Isn't Rosecea basically burst blood vessels? I have a hard time seeing how anything applied to the skin could help heal this. Then again it's not something I've focused on so maybe someone else with some experience could chime in here.

 

[ad lib]

^ True. Rosacea is something internal. I was wondering if anyone had experience with maybe herbal supplements to help it?

I may start trying a natural beauty product to cover it up because I'm quite embarrassed. It's genetic in my family and usually peaks at 30 years old, so I'm about 8 years early. It's not horrible yet, but I still notice it. No matter what I eat too, my face becomes very red after eating. I hate eating in public because of it.

I need a gentle, natural concealer for redness I suppose.