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How should a person define themselves?

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thesoundofmotion

Bluelighter
Joined
May 1, 2007
Messages
104
Or perhaps should they even bother to define themselves?

I've been having personal struggles throughout the years and it seems everytime I try to define myself whether it be my gender, sexuality, or anything for that matter it just confuses me more.

It almost seems that anytime you try to define yourself it almost makes things more confusing.

It's amazing what we humans do and how since birth we are given roles to play out but these roles really might not be who we are.

But then again, who are we?

I guess these are some questions that hit home for me especially at the age of 24 as I'm going through some late developmental issues it seems.

Does the self need to be defined at all? I think once we start to define it or label it we just mess it up even more to be honest.

After all it appears that the view of the self is all a social construct anyways.

I often wonder about transgendered people this specific question because it sort of bothers me. How would they know what it feels like to be the opposite sex? After all the opposite sex or gender should I say is only really defined through whatever society deemed it to be throughout history.

Thoughts?
 
Don't bother, I say... what would be the point? Everyone sees a person differently, depending on their own memories. The mailman sees me differently than a biker riding down the street, and differently than the little old lady living next door, and differently than my sister does.

How to have a self-definition, then? Pointless. Live for the moment and enjoy. I don't think the self needs to be defined at all, because what we really are is consciousness, or awareness.
 
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I'm not much farther along my path than it sounds like you are on yours, but I'll pass on what appears to me.

It would seem that any attempt to define the self through words ultimately fails. Whether this is because we lack the cognitive skills to map the entirety of ourselves or because of some fundamental incompatibility is unclear, but the point remains the same: no amount of words written or spoken by a human can define a person. The most we can hope to accomplish with language is an approximation or a model. A model might be a good thing to live by - for example, a moral code - but like all models its usefulness will be limited to the scope in which it is defined.

So, if words will not suffice, then what?

Actions. What we do defines who we are so much more precisely than anything we could ever say. There is a big difference between what we can reason about ourselves when we have time to sit alone and ponder such things, and what we actually accomplish in this life. These actions are taken in accordance with the choices we make, which in turn come about by who we are.

Of course, this leads us to an emergent definition of the self (as opposed to an established definition), which cannot be directly changed. One could easily end up in a situation where the self-definition is far from what one imagines of oneself - hardly an appealing proposition. So, then, if we find ourselves not liking the picture painted by our actions, what are we to do? Well, it's simple.

Change the actions. The only path to being who you want to be is to doing what you want to do. If you have a flight of fancy to go sailing across the Pacific, or convert your car to be all-electric, or become a rock singer, then start living in a way that will help you accomplish this goal. Learn how to sail. Start saving money for parts. Get singing lessons. Aim your life at your goal.

...

Anyway, that's the state of my brain after reading your post. I hope some of it helped.
 
thesoundofmotion said:
Or perhaps should they even bother to define themselves?

I've been having personal struggles throughout the years and it seems everytime I try to define myself whether it be my gender, sexuality, or anything for that matter it just confuses me more.

It almost seems that anytime you try to define yourself it almost makes things more confusing.

It's amazing what we humans do and how since birth we are given roles to play out but these roles really might not be who we are.

But then again, who are we?

I guess these are some questions that hit home for me especially at the age of 24 as I'm going through some late developmental issues it seems.

Does the self need to be defined at all? I think once we start to define it or label it we just mess it up even more to be honest.

After all it appears that the view of the self is all a social construct anyways.

I often wonder about transgendered people this specific question because it sort of bothers me. How would they know what it feels like to be the opposite sex? After all the opposite sex or gender should I say is only really defined through whatever society deemed it to be throughout history.

Thoughts?
Click to expand...



Are you trying to define yourself on how others perceive you or are you trying to figure out what role yourself you want to show society?

Defining yourself usually starts young & develops into who we are as adults. Sometimes things dont turn out they way we hoped but then again, no one should put pressure on themselves to be something they are not comfortable being.

Its easy being "yourself" as long as you dont follow a particular "in crowd" because thats where the pressure sets in to perform up to the standards of the group, hence defining who you are at those moments.

Imo, one thing doesnt define who that person is or will be in the future.
 
Roots n' wings, baby.

A person should define their identity in such away that allows them connectivity with others, but at the same time always leaves them room to grow.
 
I've found that in the past couple years, I've let go of many of the things that define me. I sold most of my stuff, wear clothes that are plain and fitted (no visible branding), have the same types of relationships with males and females (non-sexual in nature, with both), allow my opinions and biases slip away, stopped reading the news, and have in general allowed myself to be totally open to anything the world has to give me. In most ways, this has been an amazingly refreshing experience that allows me to smile everyday of my life.

On the other hand, when you live the way I do, it seems other people attempt to place labels on you, or tell you what or who you are-- it's like they get uncomfortable when they can't label you this or that.
 
As soon as you say "i am this, or i am that' your creating a false sense of self, you just are. I went through, and i suppose it's still on-going.. a period of detachment from everything that i defined as my self, i would look at my clothes and just see clothes, my car was just a car.. even my family were just people i lived with, i never owned anything to begin with.. nothing was ever mine.

Realizing that i had nothing, that i was nothing and completely alone, created a sense of infinite liberation.. i was the moment, and what i chose to do with that moment was entirely up-to me.

How i've come to integrate this is by 'just doing', the moment you over-think you allow your self time to convince your self that you are 'this' and therefor shouldn't be doing 'that', thus limiting how much of life you can truly experience.
 
by how many pokemon theyve caught














or by all the biased decisions youve stored based on your environment. the grass is green... or is it? lol ur so sure.
 
A lot of stuff that many of us would not use to define ourselves would still be part of our introductory prattle when we are meeting new people.

I don't know how many NCIS fans there are in P&S, possibly not many. Last weeks episode had Ziva's love interest who works for the CIA saying about his working for the agency "It is what I do but it is not who I am."

Some of our identity is the narrative we relate about ourselves, even to folks that are "ships in the night"

We are the story we have made up about ourselves, and likely a lot more. The story is important though. I don't know how many times I've heard someone say they don't care about status and then go on to establish their credentials.

Our identity is relational and narrative for the most part which equals ever changing.
 
Changed said:
I've found that in the past couple years, I've let go of many of the things that define me. I sold most of my stuff, wear clothes that are plain and fitted (no visible branding), have the same types of relationships with males and females (non-sexual in nature, with both), allow my opinions and biases slip away, stopped reading the news, and have in general allowed myself to be totally open to anything the world has to give me. In most ways, this has been an amazingly refreshing experience that allows me to smile everyday of my life.

On the other hand, when you live the way I do, it seems other people attempt to place labels on you, or tell you what or who you are-- it's like they get uncomfortable when they can't label you this or that.
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I quite qgree with the sentiments issued in your post, as I have undergone s similar process of not "acting out the person I am not"....a very tiring procedure that leads to unnatural relationships to others, and one's own ideas. I agree many people wish to be able to label people for their own comfort ;

Being oneself is a very liberating experience, shedding the passively disfunctional set of labels that one strives to attain to reflect.

PAX
 
I have another question... Why should a person define themselves?
I don't believe in it's usefulness. Anything we use to define ourselves with in the end is just thoughts - a story we create (often with the "help" of others), not the reality. In reality no-one is inherently anything. Everything just appears out of different conditions and is ever-changing.

If we do decide to define ourselves, we put ourselves in a box, we limit ourselves to something certain. Yes, I imagine at times it could give some temporary feeling of security, but it needs constant fueling, which takes a lot of energy. Much easier and more liberating to not define yourself. ^^
 
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But isn't trying to not define yourself, in a way, defining yourself as un-definable? :D
 
^^ Yup. And the answer is to quit trying to define yourself, because self-definitions are something actively maintained, IMO/IME. It's more similar to dropping a habit or addiction than anything else. It's amazing how much we do in life that goes into "ego maintenance", and generally dropping it is easy... or would be, if there wasn't a fear of losing one's identity and sense of "place in the world".
 
By defining yourself you consciously restrict your thought process to a larger, more like-minded set of ideals and individuals. To define oneself is to be mainstream, and if you're that, can you really be "different"?
 
Dedbeet said:
^^ Yup. And the answer is to quit trying to define yourself, because self-definitions are something actively maintained, IMO/IME. It's more similar to dropping a habit or addiction than anything else. It's amazing how much we do in life that goes into "ego maintenance", and generally dropping it is easy... or would be, if there wasn't a fear of losing one's identity and sense of "place in the world".
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I agree. Ceasing to maintain your ego isn't about actively doing something, but rather just Being. :)

There is no effort required; 'one' just realizing that they Are, and that is It.
 
I think the word "define" is screwing with people's heads. What about how you describe yourself?
MyDoorsAreOpen said:
Roots n' wings, baby.

A person should define their identity in such away that allows them connectivity with others, but at the same time always leaves them room to grow.
Click to expand...

Don't you mean roots and wigs?
By where we came from, and who we pretend to be
 
I try to get a better understanding of my nature over time. In most ways, I am like most people. In some ways, I am not. I try not to divide the more important concern of understanding myself into this duality, however, since it seems to me like a very ego involved distinction. Defining yourself seems like focusing only on the latter category to create a neatly edited package you can present to others.
 
Changed said:
I agree. Ceasing to maintain your ego isn't about actively doing something, but rather just Being. :)

There is no effort required; 'one' just realizing that they Are, and that is It.
Click to expand...
There's typically a period of self-inquiry involved, as well, although it's certainly not a rule. The mind can be very deceptive, and one can easily get pulled back into old habits without a full understanding of oneself, one's mind, what the mind wants, how it gets it, etc. It helps to really get interested. F*ck the outside world, what about this mind I carry around everywhere, inside, outside, upside down? Isn't that the most important thing to have an understanding of?

"Mindfulness", i.e. watching one's mind instead of living in the mind that runs after its own objectified contents projected to be 'out there'. And the funny thing is, watching the mind *IS* "being here now". It's just a very dispassionate attitude toward one's own thoughts, an observational attitude rather than involvement. One simply wants to understand. And one who's really interested, *will* get that understanding -- beginning immediately.

P.S. the 'catch'? Quite honestly, I think people fear their own mind and don't want to understand it. That may be the sticking point. And yet 'understanding' is the only possible end to the fear.
 
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