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Is opiod addiction the worst addiction?

Snafu in the Void said:
24 days sober here :)

Alcohol is so bad man, so hard on the body. I used to almost beg to go back to heroin, because it doesn't destroy your body like alcohol.
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Hang in there, buddy. When I quit years ago, I had a friend who quit with me. That helps a lot, someone to call and distract you. I think AA has something like that in their stuff.
 
Kentucky hillbilly said:
I’ve been addicted to drugs, twice. Used to get 200 blue Valiums a month, and I’m still on the oxycodone, 30 mags., going on, since 2016 I think. Oh yea, back in late 90’s I used to get between 100 to 150 oxycotins, the big ones, 80 mgs a month, the absolute worst were the oxycotins, worst withdrawals ever, thought I was gonna die. Lasted 4 or 5 days of pure hell, didn’t think about consequences. One day my buddy said his doctor was just gone, left his wife, moved out of state, never heard from since
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:) My bud (who I quit with) and I used to pick up 100 blue Vals a week each. Luckily, that was for less than a year.
Already a whiskey drinker. 2-3 blackouts a week. That's when I "hit bottom" and had to quit.

@Snafu in the Void
I don't want to be cavalier about my alcoholism. It was one of the hardest things I've done to quit.

I do know about the toll it takes on your body. I was starting to have stomachaches all the time from drinking, so I just started with beer to "coat my stomach".
My best friend and partner in quitting had been a passenger in a wreck which nearly killed him. Took out part of his liver, docs made a new gall bladder. So, he concentrated on the Vals and other downers since the alcohol was even more of a poison to him. Just drank a little less.

You keep on drinking in the face of clearly seeing the physical damage.

I have been drinking occasionally now that I'm an old fuck. However, it was 40 years ago that I quit. I have a rule to not drink more than once weekly.
I could not have done it occasionally those 40 years.
I think that a big factor in where I am is that I became a pothead when I quit booze.
Pot is a hard habit to develop, but it's worth the effort. ;) Lottsa people on here had drug problems and only smoke pot now. It's still bad, but your life doesn't go down the tubes. It's sustainable.

I quit pot almost 20 years ago. I had a daughter to raise and work to do.
Been smoking some in the last year or so (retired, my work here is done).
I see that as way more of a thing which will become a habit again. Not particularly worried about that.

It took me a year or so until I could be in situations where there was drinking.
I used to love going to jazz clubs, so being able to go to a bar and listen to music and not drink was a biggy for me.

One day at a time. Don't say you won't ever drink again, that's too hard. Say, "I won't drink today."
 
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Byzek said:
Science ... just google drugs harm chart.
Heroin is on top if that.

Alkohol is nothing lol.
Like the whole world is consuming alcohol.
Interesting how it would be if everybody would smoke crack.
And then tell me whats worse drinking a beer a day or smoking a crack pipe a day.
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"alcohol is nothing" is not only an ignorant statement but a false one. No one is WDing from "drinking a beer a day". What are you on about?
 
mdaniel80 said:
Did you just make the claim that heroin is harnless?
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Not harnless because everything in excess is bad, even water. But PURE 99% diamorphine hydrochloride( the one they give u in switzerland for maintensnce therapy is innocuous.
There's reports of ppl taking morphine heroin in the years 1890/early 1900s everyday for 20-30 even up to 50 years everyday and they lived fine, with no health problems caused by junk.
As long as you have s steady and consistent supply of it, it bloody enhances your life In many ways 💯
 
OpiateKiller said:
clearly you've never withdrawald then sweets. I been through it all they were simply random metaphors of pain.

Someone wake up on the wrong side of the bed? Whats wrong baby daddy kicked you out last night
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What a gross response to a simple 9 word comment. You have completely negated any valid point you could have possibly made.
Good luck with that animosity there bud. You got some work to do
 
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nznity said:
Not harnless because everything in excess is bad, even water. But PURE 99% diamorphine hydrochloride( the one they give u in switzerland for maintensnce therapy is innocuous.
There's reports of ppl taking morphine heroin in the years 1890/early 1900s everyday for 20-30 even up to 50 years everyday and they lived fine, with no health problems caused by junk.
As long as you have s steady and consistent supply of it, it bloody enhances your life In many ways 💯
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I’ve heard this notion before. From a friend who is dead now. Heroin OD
 
I think what @nznity means is that pharma opis doesn't harm your organs like other drugs do.
Nznty knows they can kill you and also have a nasty wds, because he has been there. So has @OpiateKiller and from there come his metaphores

A good thing heroin has is that it helps people to calm down.
 
mdaniel80 said:
I’ve heard this notion before. From a friend who is dead now. Heroin OD
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@nznity
they werent injecting heroin in the early 1900s recreationaly. Look I get the point that dirty heroin is a serious issue. But the notion that heroin is healthy and harmless is justification at the least. Literally everyone I have ever heard support this insane sentiment ended up in a bad way. Some recovered, sure, but they lost pieces of their lives over it. Im not a drug demonizer. I love ketamine, opioids, LSD, and even the occasional 80mg rail of adderall. But to put the spin on heroin that it has health benefits and can be used daily with no consequences is NOT harm reduction. It is a tool that heroin addicts use to keep using.
 
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The interesting thing is that not all opioids are created equal. The TI (therapeutic index) of M is 76 - which it is why the 'gold standard' of opioids. But fentanyl has a YI of 400... so why all the fentanyl deaths? Well, because it's so potent and because you have to get to the far end of the TI to get any euphoria. But sufentanil has a TI of ~27,000 while also being some 7.5x more potent.

So why isn't sufentanil (or better, α-methyl sufentanil (some x10 fentanyl with similar TI and duration of 4 hours) THE synthetic opioid of choice? Well, it's not because the precursors are watched. You don't need a single controlled precursor to make it. What you DO need is some pretty practices synthetic technique.

And the people with THAT ability can live quite well without breaking the law.

I did calculate the cost based on a 1kg scale and it works out at about 39¢ per dose, even allowing for paying the chemist some $500 per 8 hour shift.

Sufentanil is the backbone of balanced anesthesia BUT I have seen used in cases of cancer patients whose pain-control window had almost closed.

Sufentanil is the DLR (given it's short duration) but it CAN be used without respiratory support. I've seen people for whom a 500mg dry-amp of diamorphine did not stop the 'unacceptable suffering' (as defined by the RCP. An anesthetist set up a timed-release system so every 10 minutes the patient got another dose.

The patient lived a further 6 weeks. Doesn't sound much, but it's the difference between dying alone and having time to say goodbye and to die with dignity. Opioids are a truly amazing tool and we have gone a long way to perfecting them... because in the UK at least, we rarely use them unless we do not see the patient having an indeterminate life expectancy. Even then, UK doctors are VERY keen that any unused medication is taken back.

BTW the modern hypodermic syringe was invented in 1859, morphine having been isolated in 1803. Morphine was first administered via the hypodermic syringe in 1853. Of course, diacetyl morphine (heroin) was only discovered in 1874 but it was trialled via hypodermic syringe in 1875.

So most certainly those rich and connected to the right doctors COULD IV heroin as early as 1875. I believe Queen Victoria was given IV morphine during childbirth. Even now details are scant but it's QUITE possible that she received IV heroin. It was, of course, only the rich who could. In the Victorian era, laudanum and other opium/morphine medicines were much more common - due to price. Don't forget, by then we KNEW of germ theory but had yet to master truly reliable sterile conditions so poking holes in oneself was risky.

There is a 1916 report on IV heroin abuse, but how long it took to surface, I don't know.
 
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