Health HPPD experiences you could share?

[CuriousStudent__]

Hello!!
I'm so sorry I have no idea where to post this so I tried here, I apologize if I didn't get it right.

Basically, I'm a high school student and we have this huge assignment about drugs. A part of it is a scientific presentation about something our chosen drug causes. I chose LSD which causes HPPD.

Although I am a bit confused on how it works, I know LSD attaches to your 5ht receptors but is HPPD the result of it being stuck there???
Also, I was hoping anyone with HPPD could share their experiences so I have an insight into what it actually is like.

Thank you so much! Anything would help so please throw alll your knowledge at me

Again i apologize if I'm in the wrong place, just a very curious student wanting to go above and beyond

 

[HOOH]

LSD does not "cause" HPPD, and I hope you won't spread misinformation/DARE propaganda to your fellow students.
LSD also doesn't "stick" to your receptors (or spinal fluid or anything else, it is pretty much completely gone from your body within the 12 hours that the trip lasts)
HPPD is a very rare and little-known disorder, and most HPPD visuals do not even resemble psychedelic visions (HPPD often involves visual snow, which is not typically encountered on psychedelics), from what I know, HPPD is caused by some kind of neural network changes, where your hypothalamus does not re-engage in properly controlling the visual cortex after the trip is over. Paradoxically, there have been reports of psychedelics curing HPPD.
That's about all that's known on the topic of HPPD, if you have a "huge assignment", I suggest you change your topic to something that's more understood/documented (and a little-less scare-storyish).

 

[Jabberwocky]

Welcome! Awesome question.

I've had both hppd and a complete schizophrenic break from psychedelics.

Yes in some way HPPD is like your brain getting stuck that way, but not really. LSD causes perceptual hallucinations among others, and in rare cases or cases of LSD abuse it can cause semipermanent changes to your brain in the way you perceive your senses. It's generally very mild and can last from weeks to many years. Persistent perceptual distortion. It's NOT like getting stuck in a trip permanently.

Some psychonauts even enjoy HPPD. I found it to not bother me at all and was kinda interesting.

HPPD is defined in the DSM-5 and a true HPPD diagnosis is actually quite rare because the definition requires the symptoms to be "distressing or majorly impactful"* and in the vast majority of people HPPD is not severe or impactful on their life. I would guess 95% of people who have it don't even qualify for a true diagnosis. Again most people who have it experience it mildly and it goes away in a few weeks or months. It's the people who heavily abuse psychedelics who have the worst longest lasting cases.

HPPD should never be confused with psychosis or schizophrenia, they are two very different things. HPPD is rather harmless, but it is usually a sign you should cease psychedelic use.

Hope I helped with your project let me know if you have more questions I'd love to help.

*Don't quote me on that, google it

 

[Ds]

TDS -> PD
Mods feel free to move it where you seem fit, think it might be best suited here, but if wrong no worries.

 

[Cream Gravy?]

I chose LSD which causes HPPD.

I don't buy that. HPPD is a perception imo. LSD doesn't "cause" HPPD as the first poster so kindly pointed out.

I've tripped LSD (and many other psychs) hundreds of times for over ten years now. I see visuals in the dark or if I stare at the ceiling and sometimes I have sudden recall of trip experiences, usually when I smoke some weed but also when sober sometimes. None of these are bad things imo.

 

[Jabberwocky]

Yes HPPD can be caused by a number of drugs not just LSD. I got it from mushrooms originally, then continue LSD use over the years exacerbated it.

 

[CuriousStudent__]

LSD does not "cause" HPPD, and I hope you won't spread misinformation/DARE propaganda to your fellow students.
LSD also doesn't "stick" to your receptors (or spinal fluid or anything else, it is pretty much completely gone from your body within the 12 hours that the trip lasts)
HPPD is a very rare and little-known disorder, and most HPPD visuals do not even resemble psychedelic visions (HPPD often involves visual snow, which is not typically encountered on psychedelics), from what I know, HPPD is caused by some kind of neural network changes, where your hypothalamus does not re-engage in properly controlling the visual cortex after the trip is over. Paradoxically, there have been reports of psychedelics curing HPPD.
That's about all that's known on the topic of HPPD, if you have a "huge assignment", I suggest you change your topic to something that's more understood/documented (and a little-less scare-storyish).

Yeah, my intention isn't spreading misinformation, trust me. I've made it clear that LSD doesn't so much cause HPPD, but there is a connection between LSD consumption and HPPD- So sorry about my typo I've gone and fixed it in my presentation thanks so much for pointing that out
So it doesn't so much stick to receptors got that. I couldn't wrap my brain about it
Yeah, I have noticed there isn't much information on it or studies- I've only found 2 case studies so far, but that's interesting about it not resembling psychedelic visions- I read that it was like a flashback to when you were on the drug or distortion of your everyday perception.
So would you say psychedelics (e.g. LSD) damages your hypothalamus's ability to control the visual cortex?

It's not so much huge, but if you think that's best then I probably should- maybe you have a suggestion?? Does LSD cause any diseases?

Thank you so much honestly! I can't thank you enough

 

[CuriousStudent__]

Welcome! Awesome question.

I've had both hppd and a complete schizophrenic break from psychedelics.

Yes in some way HPPD is like your brain getting stuck that way, but not really. LSD causes perceptual hallucinations among others, and in rare cases or cases of LSD abuse it can cause semipermanent changes to your brain in the way you perceive your senses. It's generally very mild and can last from weeks to many years. Persistent perceptual distortion. It's NOT like getting stuck in a trip permanently.

Some psychonauts even enjoy HPPD. I found it to not bother me at all and was kinda interesting.

HPPD is defined in the DSM-5 and a true HPPD diagnosis is actually quite rare because the definition requires the symptoms to be "distressing or majorly impactful"* and in the vast majority of people HPPD is not severe or impactful on their life. I would guess 95% of people who have it don't even qualify for a true diagnosis. Again most people who have it experience it mildly and it goes away in a few weeks or months. It's the people who heavily abuse psychedelics who have the worst longest lasting cases.

HPPD should never be confused with psychosis or schizophrenia, they are two very different things. HPPD is rather harmless, but it is usually a sign you should cease psychedelic use.

Hope I helped with your project let me know if you have more questions I'd love to help.

*Don't quote me on that, google it

Thank you so much!

In a way sure, but I've learnt from the kind posters that it's essentially not that. In a sense, it's almost like LSD abuse damaging a certain part of your brain which in result causes HPPD right? Is it more like a flashback of your trip?

No way! I was really surprised reading that, some people don't even qualify for an actual diagnosis?
It eventually goes away, but there's no real cure?

Thank you so much! You really did help a lot

 

[CuriousStudent__]

I don't buy that. HPPD is a perception imo. LSD doesn't "cause" HPPD as the first poster so kindly pointed out.

I've tripped LSD (and many other psychs) hundreds of times for over ten years now. I see visuals in the dark or if I stare at the ceiling and sometimes I have sudden recall of trip experiences, usually when I smoke some weed but also when sober sometimes. None of these are bad things imo.

What do you mean by you don't buy that? Yes I quickly changed it as LSD doesn't necessarily cause HPPD but a study has shown there is a connection between LSD consumption and HPPD, would you say that's right?

So it really doesn't affect you in your everyday life, have you ever recalled your trip experiences in dangerous situations??
Yeah I realised as I'm replying and reading and researching that it's rather harmless and only hard abuse causes true HPPD (according to its criteria)

Thank you so much for replying!! You have helped me so much

 

[CuriousStudent__]

Yes HPPD can be caused by a number of drugs not just LSD. I got it from mushrooms originally, then continue LSD use over the years exacerbated it.

So not caused just by LSD, but it is the main factor/contributor in HPPD you would say?

 

[HOOH]

So would you say psychedelics (e.g. LSD) damages your hypothalamus's ability to control the visual cortex?

No, but in certain individuals with rare genetic dispositions, regular deactivation of the hypothalamus (as done by psychedelics) can restructure the brain in a way where the hypothalamus has less control over the v. cortex.

but there is a connection between LSD consumption and HPPD

Well, you can't really have HPPD without the use of hallucinogens (hence the name HPPD), but again, I'd say that is pretty scare-storyish, HPPD is extremely rare, LSD consumption fairly common

I probably should- maybe you have a suggestion?? Does LSD cause any diseases?

Maybe some topic that doesn't paint these helpful tools as dangerous drugs to unknowing teenagers? There are many health benefits of psychedelics, I recommend those (and no LSD does not cause any disease)

 

[CuriousStudent__]

No, but in certain individuals with rare genetic dispositions, regular deactivation of the hypothalamus (as done by psychedelics) can restructure the brain in a way where the hypothalamus has less control over the v. cortex.

Ahhhh i get it now! You explain really well thank you for that

Maybe some topic that doesn't paint these helpful tools as dangerous drugs to unknowing teenagers? There are many health benefits of psychedelics, I recommend those (and no LSD does not cause any disease)

Sadly its a topic to turn us away from drugs, although there's sooo much health benefits we are only to see the dark side ;( I was thinking still doing hppd, but seriously highlight the fact that it is so rare and LSD is basically harmless- to the point where it's even helpful * Thats if my teachers deny my request to switch the theme of the presentation I'm waiting to hear

HPPD is extremely rare, LSD consumption fairly common

Yes! It's a very very long and distant connection i see now

But i cant thank you enough seriously! You seem like a really nice person and i appreciate you taking time out of your day to reply!!!
Maybe if i remember, and when i finish, i'll send you the powerpoint :D

 

[MsDiz]

What defensive answers.

Fact is, HPPD is a diagnosable condition and it does arise from using hallucinogenics. It’s not that rare either and I would hypothesis that it’s under reported as many find the continuation of visuals etc enjoyable.

@CuriousStudent__ you picked an interesting condition. It’s definitely sensible to make your fellow students aware that it’s a possibility.

We preach harm reduction here. It’s always good to use drugs knowing what the effects are and what could go wrong. Having the whole picture is wise.

If I were you I’d have a look at Drug studies and check out the LSD studies. If you’re really driven you could PM a researcher and ask them if it’s something they’ve came across. Of course you’ll need to have a look if they are studying something in those realms for them to make that discovery. LSD experiences etc.

I wish you all the best. Don’t be too put off by previous answers. People who use psychedelics are definitely more defensive of their drug of choice.

Oh and here’s this for you :

Hallucinogen-persisting perception disorder - PMC

A 33-year-old female patient developed a hallucinogen-persisting perception disorder (HPPD) after lysergic acid diethylamide (LSD) abuse for a year at the age of 18. Specifically, she reported after images, perception of movement in her peripheral ...

www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

 

[CuriousStudent__]

What defensive answers.

Fact is, HPPD is a diagnosable condition and it does arise from using hallucinogenics. It’s not that rare either and I would hypothesis that it’s under reported as many find the continuation of visuals etc enjoyable.

@CuriousStudent__ you picked an interesting condition. It’s definitely sensible to make your fellow students aware that it’s a possibility.

We preach harm reduction here. It’s always good to use drugs knowing what the effects are and what could go wrong. Having the whole picture is wise.

If I were you I’d have a look at Drug studies and check out the LSD studies. If you’re really driven you could PM a researcher and ask them if it’s something they’ve came across. Of course you’ll need to have a look if they are studying something in those realms for them to make that discovery. LSD experiences etc.

I wish you all the best. Don’t be too put off by previous answers. People who use psychedelics are definitely more defensive of their drug of choice.

Oh and here’s this for you :

Hallucinogen-persisting perception disorder - PMC

A 33-year-old female patient developed a hallucinogen-persisting perception disorder (HPPD) after lysergic acid diethylamide (LSD) abuse for a year at the age of 18. Specifically, she reported after images, perception of movement in her peripheral ...

www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

Ig there is always different sides, that's why I came here! I was a little swayed by answers but really did open my mind sort of

What I don't understand is why its enjoyable? Is it fun or maybe something cool?? would love to know the reasoning

Of course! that's actually a really good idea, I'm on it right now

Thank you so much that link was really helpful! and so was your response

 

[HOOH]

Ahhhh i get it now! You explain really well thank you for that


Sadly its a topic to turn us away from drugs, although there's sooo much health benefits we are only to see the dark side ;( I was thinking still doing hppd, but seriously highlight the fact that it is so rare and LSD is basically harmless- to the point where it's even helpful * Thats if my teachers deny my request to switch the theme of the presentation I'm waiting to hear

Yes! It's a very very long and distant connection i see now

But i cant thank you enough seriously! You seem like a really nice person and i appreciate you taking time out of your day to reply!!!
Maybe if i remember, and when i finish, i'll send you the powerpoint :D

No problem(y)

Btw even on the topic of HPPD, you could point out that risk of HPPD is much greater with these new synthetic psychedelics (see 25-I-NBOMe), which arised out of prohibition, as opposed to traditional, "natural" psychedelics such as psilocybin

 

[Cream Gravy?]

a study has shown there is a connection between LSD consumption and HPPD, would you say that's right?

I suppose there must be a connection; like others said, it only arises from psychedelic use. I just wanted you to realize the whole "perma-fried" urban legend is just that, an urban legend.

HPPD is hard to classify and also as others have said, is really only pinned down as a disorder when the affected user suddenly feels their sober, day-to-day life has been disrupted by lingering effects. The majority of people either take lingering effects in stride and never mention anything to a psychiatrist or don't get them at all.

So it really doesn't affect you in your everyday life, have you ever recalled your trip experiences in dangerous situations??

I just wanted to point out this is another misconception. For me, pretty immediately after my first acid trips (and less so as I age despite more tripping) I began to see simple visual distortions in patterned objects if I stared at them too long. By recall of trips, I mean to say the way that perhaps smelling an old perfume might send memories of an old girlfriend rushing back to your head. It's simply sudden recall, you see what I mean? Memories, not an onset of psychedelia so to speak. The sober visuals and the recall of memories don't tend to go hand in hand.

I also don't believe in the concept of 'bad trips'. I've never had one, whatever they are; I mostly see people who talk about 'bad trips' on here being under the age of 22 or so, or in a bad place in life (living w/parents, recently divorced, what have you). The age old adage of 'set and setting' has the most profound effects upon a person's both short and long term experience with psychedelics. The 'bad trips' I've seen in people have been due to people forcing themselves to trip in situations I personally wouldn't trip in.

 

[Cream Gravy?]

@MsDiz is right though, most of us (me included) are biased.

A good source for unbiased drug information would be Erowid.

 

[Asante]

I had NINE YEARS of HPPD. 24/7/365/9 - That was anything but funny. I thought it would never end, but in the end it did.

 

[CuriousStudent__]

No problem(y)

Btw even on the topic of HPPD, you could point out that risk of HPPD is much greater with these new synthetic psychedelics (see 25-I-NBOMe), which arised out of prohibition, as opposed to traditional, "natural" psychedelics such as psilocybin

That's a great idea! tysm

 

[CuriousStudent__]

I suppose there must be a connection; like others said, it only arises from psychedelic use. I just wanted you to realize the whole "perma-fried" urban legend is just that, an urban legend.

HPPD is hard to classify and also as others have said, is really only pinned down as a disorder when the affected user suddenly feels their sober, day-to-day life has been disrupted by lingering effects. The majority of people either take lingering effects in stride and never mention anything to a psychiatrist or don't get them at all.


I just wanted to point out this is another misconception. For me, pretty immediately after my first acid trips (and less so as I age despite more tripping) I began to see simple visual distortions in patterned objects if I stared at them too long. By recall of trips, I mean to say the way that perhaps smelling an old perfume might send memories of an old girlfriend rushing back to your head. It's simply sudden recall, you see what I mean? Memories, not an onset of psychedelia so to speak. The sober visuals and the recall of memories don't tend to go hand in hand.

I also don't believe in the concept of 'bad trips'. I've never had one, whatever they are; I mostly see people who talk about 'bad trips' on here being under the age of 22 or so, or in a bad place in life (living w/parents, recently divorced, what have you). The age old adage of 'set and setting' has the most profound effects upon a person's both short and long term experience with psychedelics. The 'bad trips' I've seen in people have been due to people forcing themselves to trip in situations I personally wouldn't trip in.

Right, it's becoming more clear now- there are so many myths and urban legends, I never realized

I see! basically memories not an actual trip, tysm for that explanation

so it really depends on certain factors to even get a "bad trip"

Thank you so much! This explanation really helped as well