Charlottesville, Virginia

[LiquidMethod]

Liquid: P;ease stop making sense. That is simply not tolerated any more.

Sense is not tolerated here, along with Nazis. If you disagree with me you must be a Nazi,

liquidmethod i'm not interested in engaging with time-wasting liars, so i'm going to let your pseudo-outraged posts speak for themselves.

fuck trump, and fuck nazis.

Thank you for so succinctly proving my point.

"You have differing political beliefs to me - therefore you are a liar.
Because you are a liar, I refuse to listen to anything you have to say.
If I don't listen to your words, then I can assume that you are a Nazi.
Nazis are evil which means you and all associates are evil.
I also believe that only racist people voted for Trump (even though he performed better with minorities than any other Republican) therefore this attack is Trump's fault".

If anyone would like to function in the real world - you have some contrasting opinions here (from the "other side") and you'd do well to ask questions and refute arguments instead of closing yourself off to rational debate.

 

[Scrofula]

Liquid, you're a child marching in a parade you don't understand.

 

[spacejunk]

no, i'm calling you a liar because you claimed to be a "political science graduate". i called you out on it, and surprise surprise - no response.

i'm tolerant of people's beliefs, until they have to twist reality and the truth to debate it.
you've shown that its a waste of time, so good luck trying to support trump through this nazi terrorist shit storm.

it's mildly comforting to know your hero doesn't value his political career, because his trajectory keeps going from bad to worse.
supporting terrorism is another black eye for the old creep.
good.

 

[LiquidMethod]

no, i'm calling you a liar because you claimed to be a "political science graduate". i called you out on it, and surprise surprise - no response.

First of all being a polisci graduate means fuck-all with these debates. Anyone can get the same (or better) education and information from the internet these days.
I only brought that up (and the fact that I am Jewish) because people here began attacking me personally - attempting to align me with Neo-Nazis and saying things that made me appear to have no credibility - simply because they disagreed with what I was saying.

So I'm not a liar, or a racist, or a Nazi - but you have already placed me in those boxes in order for you to easily demonize me and dismiss what I am saying. I see that that is the modus operandi for the Left.

i'm tolerant of people's beliefs, until they have to twist reality and the truth to debate it.

Make sure you find out the truth before you come to your own conclusions.

supporting terrorism is another black eye for the old creep.

The Libtards have been supporting political terrorism from their side ever since Trump won. So more hypocrisy and reason not to take them seriously.

When "racists" are making more sense than you are - then you maybe should start re-evaluating what you stand for.

 

[spacejunk]

i've never met a polsci graduate that claimed "liberals" (libtards as you so maturely call them) are pro-communist.
it's a laughable suggestion.

i never called you a nazi, you've put yourself in that box.
you've engaged in lots of ad-homs - that's why lots of people here say your are disingenuous. a harsher way of phrasing that is to suggest you're a liar.

i'm sorry if you don't like my bluntness. you're going to have to live with it.

have a nice day

 

[LucidSDreamr]

I am actually shocked trump didn't condemn this attack like so many R-congressmen. I knew trump was a hateful lying piece of shit, but I really though he would at least give in on this one and try to feign being a decent person. Guess not.

We know trump is a white supremacist but when pushed enough he will condemn KKK members supporting him as we saw during the campaign, as there are a good chunk of republicans that are that due to religious or financial reasons and not racist ones. The fact that he is refusing to do so now was actually a surprise to me, anyone else surprised?

 

[spacejunk]

sadly i'm not really surprised at all.

they're his supporters and he knows it.
i'm not surprised, because trump is continually proving himself to actually be a wannabe fascist.

fortunately he is opposed by millions of people who see through his bullshit.
trump is a soulless creep with no integrity and no political nous whatsoever. he's just further outing himself as a fucking scumbag to people who hadn't realised the extent of it yet.

 

[aihfl]

I wonder what these Neonazi POS would think if they actually knew history and knew that two of the US Senators at the time of secession were actually Jewish (David Levy Yulee-FL and Judah Benjamin-LA; Benjamin would go on to serve in Jefferson Davis's cabinet) and that at one point Charleston SC due to it's position as a commercial seaport had the per capita highest percentage of Jews among American cities.

I laugh when I think about DJT saying he's the least racist person. He's so shallow I'm sure he subscribes to all the racial stereotypes out there: all black men are crackheads, all black women are welfare queens and drive BMWs while using public assistance, all Asians are geniuses, all Jews are good with money and all Hispanics can't learn English and are drug traffickers and human smugglers etc.

 

[Fresco]

As much as I DESPISE neo-nazi's, these are the facts:

• The Neo-nazi rally which was planned ahead of time had received a permit from the city to hold their event
• The anti-fascists left-wingers who showed up did NOT have a permit to hold their rally.
• Its pretty clear the Lefties (who had no right to hold their own rally there) came to cause trouble, and there's good indications they started the violence.
• As much as you can hate Nazi's, they have every right to have their own opinion and hold their rallies in a democratic country. As uncomfortable as that is for most people, thats a cold hard fact!!

So really, who's at fault here??

 

[spacejunk]

nazis.

you don't start a mob with flaming torches, descend upon a town (with heavily armed militias in tow) and expect to meet no resistance.
these people knew what they were doing - up to and including the extremely cowardly act of driving a car into peaceful demonstrators.

not all anti-fascists are violent. that's a myth created by the right wing press.
we aim to disrupt violent mobs of white supremacists and make it difficult for them to intimidate people on-masse.
it's a perfectly legitimate tactic, and does not excuse vehicular homicide.

if nazis can't handle people telling them to fuck off, they should stay home.

 

[Fresco]

nazis.

you don't start a mob with flaming torches, descend upon a town (with heavily armed militias in tow) and expect to meet no resistance.
these people knew what they were doing - up to and including the extremely cowardly act of driving a car into peaceful demonstrators.

not all anti-fascists are violent. that's a myth created by the right wing press.
we aim to disrupt violent mobs of white supremacists and make it difficult for them to intimidate people on-masse.
it's a perfectly legitimate tactic, and does not excuse vehicular homicide.

if nazis can't handle people telling them to fuck off, they should stay home

Do you not read very well?? What part of my post did you not understand??

I'll repeat it for you, the nazi's had a legal right to hold a rally, the Lefties did NOT!

 

[spacejunk]

did they have a legal right to murder that young girl with a car?

legal permission does not give anyone the "right" to intimidate communities in this manner.
communities have the right to self defence from these cowards, and that is what the counter-protest was.
it cost a woman her life.

 

[Fresco]

did they have a legal right to murder that young girl with a car?

No, of course not!!

legal permission does not give anyone the "right" to intimidate communities in this manner

Their rally didnt start with intimidation, that only started when the anti-fascists showed up.

Again, the anti-fascists had no legal right to hold their rally at the same time when the nazi's did.
Therefore, in the grand scheme of things, they started this bullshit.

Of course that DOES NOT give anyone the right to mow people over in their car, and I hope he spends the rest of his life in jail

 

[spacejunk]

Their rally didnt start with intimidation, that only started when the anti-fascists showed up.

you're suggesting that a bunch of neo-nazis turning up and marching around as a mob with burning torches is not an act of intimidation?

i totally disagree.

are you familiar with the history of nazi/kkk/white supremacist violence and murder?
intimidation is their sole tactic. they're not known for engaging in civil political discussion or demonstration. they are very well known for killing people (especially non-white people and those that oppose them), acts of violence and terrorism.
that's intimidation. it's what they do.
especially when they show up kitted up with guns, knives and other weapons.

would you feel intimidated by a mob of armed nazis turning up in your neighbourhood? does that sound like a nice way to spend a Saturday?

 

[aihfl]

you're suggesting that a bunch of neo-nazis turning up and marching around as a mob with burning torches is not an act of intimidation?

I would be inclined to cut Fresco some slack since Fresco's profile says they're from Toronto and Amsterdam, therefore not American, and by extension not from the American south and not understand the symbolism behind flaming torches. On the other hand (I'm assuming you're from the Melbourne down under), you get it. And even if the symbolism of the torches went over one's head, the symbolism of openly carrying around automatic assault rifles shouldn't go over anyone's head.

 

[Fresco]

you're suggesting that a bunch of neo-nazis turning up and marching around as a mob with burning torches is not an act of intimidation?

i totally disagree.

are you familiar with the history of nazi/kkk/white supremacist violence and murder?
intimidation is their sole tactic. they're not known for engaging in civil political discussion or demonstration. they are very well known for killing people (especially non-white people and those that oppose them), acts of violence and terrorism.
that's intimidation. it's what they do.
especially when they show up kitted up with guns, knives and other weapons.

would you feel intimidated by a mob of armed nazis turning up in your neighbourhood? does that sound like a nice way to spend a Saturday?

None of this matters if what the nazi's are doing is NOT illegal. Do you not get this??

I would be inclined to cut Fresco some slack since Fresco's profile says they're from Toronto and Amsterdam, therefore not American, and by extension not from the American south and not understand the symbolism behind flaming torches. On the other hand (I'm assuming you're from the Melbourne down under), you get it. And even if the symbolism of the torches went over one's head, the symbolism of openly carrying around automatic assault rifles shouldn't go over anyone's head

But is carrying a bunch of torches an illegal act?? Answer the question, please

the symbolism of openly carrying around automatic assault rifles shouldn't go over anyone's head

Virginia is an open-carry Sate. Perfectly legal to walk around with an AR-15

 

[LiquidMethod]

i've never met a polsci graduate that claimed "liberals" (libtards as you so maturely call them) are pro-communist.
it's a laughable suggestion.

Yes believe it or not some of these libtards revere and promote communism. The hammer and sickle has featured frequently among images I've seen.

i never called you a nazi, you've put yourself in that box.

Another member tried to paint me as a neo-nazi

you've engaged in lots of ad-homs - that's why lots of people here say your are disingenuous. a harsher way of phrasing that is to suggest you're a liar.

How does ad homs = lying? What have I lied about exactly?

i'm sorry if you don't like my bluntness. you're going to have to live with it.

I don't care about your bluntness just your irrationality and deception.

you don't start a mob with flaming torches, descend upon a town (with heavily armed militias in tow) and expect to meet no resistance.

It is completely legal. They were engaged in their legal right to gather and protest

There were no police around when the two groups started (surprise) clashing violently. Where were they?

The Left are completely unable to take any responsibility for their actions.
The ACLU supported the Right rally as they stated that freedom of speech applies to everyone equally irrespective of their views.
The factions from the Left are at fault here for escalating this conflict. If a group is saying stupid shit then just laugh at them. As soon as you decide to preemptively attack a group (because you've decided in your head that they will commit violence in the future) YOU are in the wrong. Let them march with their torches who the fuck cares. I personally think white supremacists are pieces of shit but getting offended is not a crime.

These people are not going to go away. You need to eventually address them. They do deserve to have their problems considered. The more you hate and suppress them the stronger their movement will get. You have created these people. If your movement demonizes white people then don't be surprised when white supremacy grows.

 

[spacejunk]

I would be inclined to cut Fresco some slack since Fresco's profile says they're from Toronto and Amsterdam, therefore not American, and by extension not from the American south and not understand the symbolism behind flaming torches. On the other hand (I'm assuming you're from the Melbourne down under), you get it. And even if the symbolism of the torches went over one's head, the symbolism of openly carrying around automatic assault rifles shouldn't go over anyone's head.

yeah, i'm Australian.
we tend to get a lort of news from the US and i think this made international headlines the world over.
i don't watch tv, but i was in a store this evening that had a screen showing the news. there was a pretty long news story, and i stood and watched quite a bit of content i hadn't seen yet (a lot of what i've seen is video uploaded to twitter and so forth - so i'm not familiar with how much this stuff is featured in the mainstream press, because i follow a lot of activist social media sources, so i see a lot of it firsthand. it's a very different and less filtered version of what folks see on the news.

this idea that the left caused this by daring to oppose these people makes me feel kind of ill, to be honest.
just because this is "legal" does not make it ok.

i'm going to be accused of invoking godwin's law for comparing neo-nazis to hitler (hey, liquidmethod) - but everything hitler did was legal.
from his election, right up to the gas chambers.

makes ya think, don't it?

sadly neo-nazi terrorism isn't confined to the USA - a white supremacist get charged with planning bombing attacks on left-wing groups last year, and neo-nazis have been active in continental europe for decades.

sadly it is an undercurrent in a lot of places, but the difference here i think is the symbiotic political relationship between the president and the nazis.
that's deeply fucked up, especially in the post 9/11 world where terrorism is the big folk panic, with huge amounts of government focus and resources being put into preventing it it.
"muslim ban" anyone?

trump's shameless hypocrisy on this issue speaks volumes, and it really confirms a lot of the concerns a lot of us have about trump's despotic potential.
he reminds me of a geriatric mussolini. things really didn't pan out so well for that guy.

 

[Fresco]

Yes believe it or not some of these libtards revere and promote communism. The hammer and sickle has featured frequently among images I've seen.


Another member tried to paint me as a neo-nazi


How does ad homs = lying? What have I lied about exactly?


I don't care about your bluntness just your irrationality and deception.


It is completely legal. They were engaged in their legal right to gather and protest

There were no police around when the two groups started (surprise) clashing violently. Where were they?

The Left are completely unable to take any responsibility for their actions.
The ACLU supported the Right rally as they stated that freedom of speech applies to everyone equally irrespective of their views.
The factions from the Left are at fault here for escalating this conflict. If a group is saying stupid shit then just laugh at them. As soon as you decide to preemptively attack a group (because you've decided in your head that they will commit violence in the future) YOU are in the wrong. Let them march with their torches who the fuck cares. I personally think white supremacists are pieces of shit but getting offended is not a crime.

These people are not going to go away. You need to eventually address them. They do deserve to have their problems considered. The more you hate and suppress them the stronger their movement will get. You have created these people. If your movement demonizes white people then don't be surprised when white supremacy grows

Well said. For the most part I agree.

I also wanna add neo-nazi's represent less than 1% of the population, so why worry about them??
Its not like they're suddenly gonna become popular and represent the majority

 

[-=SS=-]

antifascist activists only exist because of the increase in nazi trash on the streets.

They exist because there are people out there, such as yourself, who happen to disagree with the political opinions of others and do not even want to allow them the air of free speech or the space of lawful protest and gathering. Which all in all tells you who the real fascists are.

In the UK we have 'Unite Against Fascism', who's sole purpose it seems is to turn up whenever there is an event being held by the BNP, EDL or other designated "far-right" group, and basically prevent them from having a peaceful protest or march by instigating violence in order to detract attention away from the actual protest or march.. which inevitably happens and is subsequently blamed on the "far-right" group despite people who were actually there reporting that it was the counter-protestors who threw the first punch.

I suspect your condemnations and support only goes one way. What do you have to say for the Black Lives Matter group? Or for the Antifa thugs? Do communities not have a right to not be intimidated by those groups also?

From what I've seen the anti-fascists are just as hateful and prone to violence as the so called fascists, and the only difference between them being that the fascists aren't the ones trying to silence the opposition. It's all back to front.