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Opioids I think I need help please - suboxone

L

LCat1978

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Joined
Apr 14, 2016
Messages
17
I think I need some help. I read some other threads here about suboxone, and still don't understand. I did call my doctor and his assistant said the doctor isn't available, even to just answer a question till Wednesday and said I should go to the ER if I can't wait. I think maybe there is something wrong with me or how I am taking it.

1. Does it hurt to take it? I have been on it for 4 days, and the largest dose I took was 2mg. Underneath my tongue feels burned, is red and sore and painful and slightly swollen. I keep trying to find a new place to put it but the whole area hurts now.

2. It definitely stopped my withdrawal, but after taking it, I feel light headed, impatient/a little irritable, occasional blurred vision, bouts of nausea, etc. It is not withdrawal, and feels totally different, like a drug reaction. As it wears off I feel better. Someone told me here I should just take more - 8mg. How would that make it better though?

3. Can I just stop? Would it be really bad? I read some comments on other threads that it can be really nasty to just stop.

I don't know what I should do and don't want to go to the emergency room over this for several reasons.

Thank you for any help or advice.
 
That's not a normal reaction. You may be allergic to the bupe or the nalaxone.. I think something like 5-10% of people have these reactions. I would stop taking it, and go to the er if it's severe enough.
 
It could be a possibility you are having a reaction to the suboxone tablet. The flavoring or coloring agents in the medication could be irritating your tongue. Some people may disagree but I could definitely see it causing an unpleasant reaction for some sensitive individuals. Switching medication formulations to the suboxone strip or generic bupe may help but it may not.

At one point in time it felt like the large flavored tablets were hurting my teeth so I changed to the generic buprenorphine tab and the problems quickly got better.

It also sounds like your dose is to high. If you are having uncomfortable side effects but no WD symptoms it could be time for a dose reduction. You also have to take into account that sub doctors routinely deal with drug seeking clients who try to get changed to the bupe mono believing it has a higher potential for abuse. They make up side effects like a headache as they have heard about that online. Mind you some people are actually sensitive to the naloxone. Just remember the bupe mono products have the same recreational and narcotic effects as the sub even if it is IV'd or snorted.
 
Welcome to Bluelight Lcat. Just a friendly reminder. When the subjects are close/same subject/same ballpark, you need only start one thread. We will be glad to help you, any way we can.
 
I have heard a lot of people are allergic to the naloxone they put in suboxone and when they switch to subutex(buprenorphine tabs without naloxone) they don't have anymore side effects. or its possible you are allergic to buprenorphine? Try switching to subutex and see if it works better for you with no bad side effects, there aren't as many bad fillers/binders in subutex as suboxone and they are just plain white pills with no flavoring, which is another thing it could be causing you to react that way, the coloring or orange flavor in suboxone. No one on here could really know, only you and your doctor can determine what is really going on and fix the problem the best way possible. Hope you find a better solution than the suboxone you are one, I personally prefer subutex over suboxone it has a slightly different feeling to me. I know most people say they feel exactly the same as suboxone but I actually get a really nice feeling from subutex compared to suboxone.
 
It does sound like some kind of hypersensitivity to something in the suboxone product. You never mentioned if you were on the suboxone pills or strips.

If it's not hypersensitivity and an allergic reaction to something in it, and if it is making your tongue or throat swell up. SEEK MEDICAL HELP RIGHT AWAY. Swollen tongues and throats can block air from entering your lungs...

When I take some sub, I actually like that chemically burning sensation under my tongue after the pill or strip has dissolved. It tells me it was absorbed properly. I also notice a lot if I shudder hard and get a deep chill from the nasty taste I know it is about to work pretty well.
 
I'm aware of people who are actually allergic to the Bupe rather than the naloxone.

What opioid/opiate are you going on maintenance for and how much were you taking?
 
LCat1978 said:
2. After taking it, I feel light headed, impatient/a little irritable, occasional blurred vision, bouts of nausea, etc.
Click to expand...

Some describe their opioid high in this manner, Hence why I'm interested in not so much what you were addicted to but how much. Cos if you're replacing say 120mgs of codeine then you're getting high on the Suboxone cos taking 2mg's of Sub to offset a moderate or low dose opioid habit is like cracking a peanut with a sledgehammer - AND the Dr that put you on Subs is b


LCat1978 said:
Someone told me here I should just take more - 8mg. How would that make it better though?.
Click to expand...

They may have thought you were experiencing Precipitated Withdrawal - if so then even though it seems counter intuitive to take more it does work but It's recommended to take more in 2mg increments until you feel right.

Though It sounds more like an allergic reaction than PWD. Hope you're feeling better.
 
Thank you all for the help! I apologize Speed King - Am new to forums in general. I will be careful not to start multiple threads on the same topic again!


All this input has been really helpful - and now I have an idea what is going on, which helps a lot! And at the moment I am at a loss as to what I should do now. My doctor who prescribed the suboxone cannot be reached till Wednesday, so my choices are to go to the ER or try to find another doctor, which I will try to do today.

To answer some of the questions asked in comments, in the hope someone may be able to give me some input to help me decide what to do - I was taking oxycodone for about 2 and 1/2 to 3 months, and my daily dose was probably on average 45mg-60mg, and the most I ever took in a day was 80mg.

I got ill when I tried to stop taking it, so saw a doctor who prescribed the 8mg/2mg strips of suboxone. I was told to take one full strip each day, but I didn't do as told. I have been on it for 5 days now, and have not even used an entire one strip, as I have been cuttting it up into small pieces. I took 2mg the first day and it really made me loopy. I dropped it to 1mg the next day and felt a bit better, though still seem to have a strange reaction.

Unfortunately, I don't know if I can even keep taking it now. Something is wrong. Perhaps as some have suggested I am sensitive to something in these strips, or to the medications. Under my tongue is SO painful and red now. Though my throat isn't swollen or anything like that, and the rest of my mouth seems ok, even moving my tongue to talk or when I brush my teeth is painful, and the idea of putting more suboxone on it....well, what a choice I have.

But I have also read that just "jumping" can really be nasty too. I suppose in the worst case I can go to the ER. It is just frustrating since I don't feel like this is really an emergency as I think of an emergency, and the co-pay is a lot, and it is a little embarrassing to discuss this in emergency room situations as I never feel like there is really privacy - the last time I went to the ER (unrelated to addition - for an injury) I had to explain what happened to a doc with other patients just feet away and they even commented on my situation, so it isn't going to be fun to talk about addiction issues. I know I shouldn't be ashamed, I haven't hurt anyone or done something awful, and just have a problem, but it is hard for me to talk about this to people.

Not sure what to do. It's clear something isn't right. I just am not sure what.
 
LCat1978 said:
Thank you all for the help! I apologize Speed King - Am new to forums in general. I will be careful not to start multiple threads on the same topic again!


All this input has been really helpful - and now I have an idea what is going on, which helps a lot! And at the moment I am at a loss as to what I should do now. My doctor who prescribed the suboxone cannot be reached till Wednesday, so my choices are to go to the ER or try to find another doctor, which I will try to do today.

To answer some of the questions asked in comments, in the hope someone may be able to give me some input to help me decide what to do - I was taking oxycodone for about 2 and 1/2 to 3 months, and my daily dose was probably on average 45mg-60mg, and the most I ever took in a day was 80mg.

I got ill when I tried to stop taking it, so saw a doctor who prescribed the 8mg/2mg strips of suboxone. I was told to take one full strip each day, but I didn't do as told. I have been on it for 5 days now, and have not even used an entire one strip, as I have been cuttting it up into small pieces. I took 2mg the first day and it really made me loopy. I dropped it to 1mg the next day and felt a bit better, though still seem to have a strange reaction.

Unfortunately, I don't know if I can even keep taking it now. Something is wrong. Perhaps as some have suggested I am sensitive to something in these strips, or to the medications. Under my tongue is SO painful and red now. Though my throat isn't swollen or anything like that, and the rest of my mouth seems ok, even moving my tongue to talk or when I brush my teeth is painful, and the idea of putting more suboxone on it....well, what a choice I have.

But I have also read that just "jumping" can really be nasty too. I suppose in the worst case I can go to the ER. It is just frustrating since I don't feel like this is really an emergency as I think of an emergency, and the co-pay is a lot, and it is a little embarrassing to discuss this in emergency room situations as I never feel like there is really privacy - the last time I went to the ER (unrelated to addition - for an injury) I had to explain what happened to a doc with other patients just feet away and they even commented on my situation, so it isn't going to be fun to talk about addiction issues. I know I shouldn't be ashamed, I haven't hurt anyone or done something awful, and just have a problem, but it is hard for me to talk about this to people.

Not sure what to do. It's clear something isn't right. I just am not sure what.
Click to expand...
In my opinion you are way overmedicated for a 2-3 month addiction to 40-60 mg of oxycodone. Some of the side effects you describe are from the buprenorphine which is causing a moderate narcotic effect. In my experience for a small habit like that 2mg or less should be plenty to completely hold you for 24 hours.

It angers me a doctor would find it appropriate to prescribe you that much suboxone. Did you tell him your level of tolerance and time of use? The other side effects you are describing from what I read sounded like you had a sore under your tongue. Correct me if I am wrong. Are you having swelling or is it sore under your tongue.

If you throat or tongue is swelling like others have said you should see a doc or go to the ER ASAP. Having a slightly swollen spot under your tongue with burning pain sounds like a reaction that can also happen say from eating something acidic and then scratching that area of your mouth. as well It can happen from a reaction to the sub strips and tablets/flavorings. They are slightly acidic and holding meds under your tongue 2x each day can also cause irritation. After awhile it gets sore slightly puffy and red. This differs from the allergic reactions that come along with naloxone or bupe but it could also be caused by that though it is much rarer.

Suboxone can also be used bucally and in the packet handed to you usually with the sub strips it will describe how to administer the strip or tablet in that manner. Take the strip/tab and place it on your inner cheek. Let us know if that also causes a reaction comparable to what happened under your tongue. If you get desperate enough you could use your meds rectally though that is twice as strong.
 
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This is why they should induct clients who have short histories of opiate use in the doctors office. Not having the doc/nurse available to speak with quickly on the phone during your first few days of ORT is also kind of lame. Ow well it's better then nothing.
 
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If you can't see a doctor soon, try asking for help at your local pharmacy. Pharmacists usually know a lot about allergic reactions.
 
Thanks you all for the ideas/input. It's helpful. I really don't know what's going on under my tongue. I don't see any sores or anything - just the entire area under my tongue and the bottom side of my tongue is really red with swollen patches and it hurts. But there's nothing in my throat or the rest of my mouth. I don't know if it is sensitivity or maybe a mild allergy, or what - But it makes taking the medication really hard. I took today's dose between my gum and cheek, as it said I can try that on the paper that came with the strips.

It's interesting Prescottdave, that you think I am on too much - and reassuring actually. I really don't know lots about this medicine, but had heard of it and read a little about it and it seemed like a lot to me when he prescribed it. I had explained to his assistant what I was taking and for how long and assume she'd conveyed that to him, but he was not interested in hearing much about it from me - or any history really. He scolded me a lot about it and then told me what I was to take - it was a short visit and then he was off. I had hoped I could explain - tell him the history and details and even why I had begun taking it, etc. It felt like he just had some assumptions about anyone who has such an addiction and they are all the same to him so didn't want to hear the details. Well, that's how it felt at least. But I am thankful he took me as quickly as he did, since I struggled to find doctor to help.

As I am sure many in my position can relate to, I have things I must do - work and people and animals that need me, and I can't just disappear indefinitely in withdrawal. I thought I could get some medical help to at least be functional and to get through it. I didn't realize I was going to end up where I am now and would need long term maintenance. That said, I know the doctor was trying to help me, and maybe this really is the best path. I really don't know. It would have been great to take the medicine there at the doctor's office as suggested in the comments here! Or even if I could have called to talk to him after I took it. But in the end, it did stop the awful withdrawal and I am able to work and do what I must now, so I suppose I should not complain so much.

But here I am, so I will do this maintenance plan as best I can, but I am going with my own instincts, and the feedback I have gotten here. I think I agree with the idea that 8mg is just too much for me. I was so uncomfortable on 2mg. 1mg is still a little odd feeling but I'm not super uncomfortable as I was on 2mg. I might try to cut it down more. Also, if the tongue thing gets too bad to take it, then I am going to have to just stop, and I would expect the lower the dose I was on the less unpleasant that withdrawal would be....

I wish I could talk to my doctor but will have to wait till he is available. I will ask the pharmacist too about my tongue situation, as suggested - that's a good idea. Thank you all for helping. It is so confusing trying to figure this out!
 
2mgs seem to be the magic number in which buprenorphine starts helping anxiety and elevates mood. If you suffer from these you should discuss your Dr about the dose.

Here getting on suboxone means a getting through comprehensive visits to Drs and nurses as well as atleast one unsuccessfull quitting attempt. Induction is started inpatient and the dose is increased according to a schedule.

I consider handing out buprenorphine like candy to be malpractice as it seems to lead problems.
 
That's interesting MrRoot. For me there was almost no process. I found a doctor on my plan who was listed as working with addiction, among other things. I went and explained my situation to a physicians assistant, they took some blood and urine. Then I saw a doctor for probably less than 10 minutes and he prescribed suboxone and that was it. I didn't ask for it, and there was no process or discussion really. In retrospect, though I am thankful I got help, I think I agree that there should be more to it than that. At the very least some discussion, I think, and a bit of follow up, at least.

Prescottdave, or anyone who can help, I wanted to follow up on the suggestion of other ways to take this. I just looked and it appears now that the skin under my tongue is pealing. I didn't know what it was at first. I looked and instead of being bright red, it was kind of white. I touched it with my finger and realized it is the skin that is pealing off now. Whatever this is, either allergy or sensitivity, clearly under my tongue is causing some real problems. This morning I did the idea of putting it against my inner cheek, between my gums and cheek. I took the same dose - 1mg. I feel a little different today though, and the first couple hours I wasn't as light headed and didn't have as many blurred vision episodes - not that I have many, but it does seem to be a side effect with me. So I am wondering if maybe it didn't get absorbed as well. Could that be the case? You'd mentioned taking it rectally. I've never taken anything that way, but not sure what to do here. So if I tried to do that, I would need to take less? I was just reading elsewhere about people who stop taking this medicine and apparently the withdrawal can be nasty. So it looks like I am going to face that no matter what. I am going to schedule a few days off from work for that soon, I think. Till then, I need to take this.
 
A lot of people and doctors as well underestimate how powerful buprenorphine actually is. Bupe is a very, very strong opiate. Some 28x more potent than morphine iirc. Maybe even ½mg would even hold you, and cut down on those negative effects.

Drugs like suboxone and methadone are supposed to be for maintenance and treatment for long term/chronic opiate addicts.

In your case OP, I don't think suboxone is right for you. A 40-60mg/day oxycodone habit, could IMO, be kicked easily with some OTC meds, and a couple easily acquired prescription meds. Some being:

Immodium/Loperamide (OTC for GI issues)
Motrin (OTC for aches and pains)
Clonidine (Rx General opiate withdrawal symptoms, especially sweating)
Gabapentin/Neurontin (Rx this medicine works great on the worst of almost all WD symptoms, especially restlessness/RLS, and anxiety, therefore helping with sleep issues too.)
Take these meds for 1 week at appropriate doses that make you feel OK.

Though I am not a doctor, I think going that road would have been a better bet for you instead of just jumping straight to a POWERFUL medication like suboxone at your level of addiction and length use.
 
Thank you sm0kestack. I think I have to get off this suboxone. I had thought I will wait and see, and just deal with these symptoms, and just be glad I am not in withdrawal. But as the days pass, more and more I am thinking this was a mistake. I shouldn't have taken it. Yes, I am glad I am not in agony with withdrawal. But this isn't a good solution.

Yesterday I took the medicine between my gum and cheek, because under my tongue is so inflamed and painful and peeling now. Today my gums on that side hurt like crazy - the pain is like having an infected tooth and in fact at first I was really dismayed as my teeth are not in bad shape and I haven't had any problems. Then I remembered and looked and the area I took it is swollen and painful.

Plus I feel lousy for the first few hours after I take it - light headed, a little irritable, episodes of blurred vision, edgy. I dropped it to .5mg today in the hopes of diminishing that. But I checked out some other peoples' reactions and I don't see others having these symptoms or feel bad.

I wish I could reach my doctor. I can't wait, I think, till Wednesday. I wish I had not taken it this morning. I know that it will be awful to just stop, but my mouth is killing me now and I am worried. I think I should stop, and try some of the other suggestions I have gotten for other methods of dealing with withdrawal. It is a bad time for me to go missing from my company - but I may have no choice. This can't be right and it isn't going away and I kind of wish my doctor had chosen some other option for me.

Thank you all for helping.
 
One more question - has anyone ever "jumped" from suboxone? How bad is this going to get for me? I wish I had listened to those who suggested I stop taking it a couple days ago. Hopefully this isn't going to be too bad. I have been on it now for 6 days, I think... Not looking forward to what is about to come. How bad should I expect it to be - anyone know?
 
I was in a buprenorhine assisted rehab when I kicked my oxycodone habit first time with serious intent. On first day I received 2mgs + 2mgs later, then 4mgs + 2mgs later, then 6mgs for three days, 4mgs for three days, 2mgs for three days, 1mg for three days and then quitted.

No withdrawals and no need for comfort meds except imodium although a lot would have been available as it was inpatient rehab. I had gabapentin for pain although.
 
On subs for a 3-4 month oxy and codine habit? Do yourself a favour and dump the subs and sweat it out. Wd shouldn't be to bad with a low habit like that. You take subs and you'll get a habit you don't want. If you think the detox from codine is bad you'll want to blow your brains out if you have to detox of subs
 
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