The "true nature" of the 2C's.

[freaktech]

I didn´t notice this mental disturbing effects on 2C-B, but is harder on the body than 4-aco-dmt. 4-aco-dmt is really a very beautiful chem, but it concerns me to take it outdoors because the "piss" side effect. During peak I can piss every 5 five minutes hundred times!

 

[Thorns Have Roses]

I'm also unsure as to why you find it so hard to accept that maybe 2C-E DOES pose more danger than other psychs to SOME users who are susceptible to

But this is exactly what I've been saying. I've just been complaining when the anti-2c crowd is generalizing their negative experiences and otherwise exceptionalizing this class of drugs.

Now the anecdotal evidence that they are more likely to cause HPPD is certainly a case in your side's favor, but I'm not certain of the truth of these claims. A lot of people will call increased visual static HPPD, and not have more serious issues like the people here, so the whole thing could be misleading. While it is possible that you guys are right, you may also be building up the next urban legend. I'm gonna need to see some hard data to be swayed away from my skeptical position.

I'll also agree that not all psychs are created equal in this regard, but I'm pretty sure that in one of my earlier post I specifically singled out the "deeper" psychedelics as being the relevant ones here, if not I should have.

(and no I have not experienced HPPD. As far as it could go though, 2c-e doesn't really fuck up the way I think about things normally, it just feels like a slightly exaggerated version of my normal self (it's unique flavor, not the general trippyness)...4-sub tryptamine-like permanent effects would be horrifying though. I think that's how we're different, intense analytic introspection is something that's fairly normal for me.)

Deep and jaded analyzing of social behaviors and relationships come to mind.

See, I do that normally! A more directly involved, personal narrative driven, emotional way of looking at things is very difficult for me though. I naturally gravitate toward some degree of abstraction and cynicism. Actually, 2c-e can sort of mitigate these tendencies in me in lower dose trips and bring me closer to socially normative thought.

 

[blackskirt]

I didn´t notice this mental disturbing effects on 2C-B, but is harder on the body than 4-aco-dmt./QUOTE]In my experience it has less of a crash than MDMA, very smooth return to baseline about six hours in, and the multiple rolling peaks of emotions, sensations and closed eye visuals really intensify erotic experiences

 

[Jakeperson]

Well obviously not or I wouldn't have to keep making the same points.

Not to mention that it's been well over a week since I started this whole thing and I don't even remember what I've already stated and what I haven't.

Maybe the drugs effect other differently so your opinion of them isn't valid to the other people. Just accept that other people have different opinions.

 

[freaktech]

I didn´t notice this mental disturbing effects on 2C-B, but is harder on the body than 4-aco-dmt./QUOTE]In my experience it has less of a crash than MDMA, very smooth return to baseline about six hours in, and the multiple rolling peaks of emotions, sensations and closed eye visuals really intensify erotic experiences

Yeah, in my experience, not only don´t have any crash but I just feel even the opposite. When 2c-b trip ends, I feel a slight sense of satisfaction and gratitude for 2-3 hours more. Someone experience this? Not ever happens, but is cool

 

[adamski10]

To the Orignial Poster:

think of any psy compoud to be an igniter, they spark the gasses in your brain- they dont create the sensation or the mood lift, your paticular brand of mind gass at any particular time will have a massive impact on your experiences. The 2C-X series can provide as mystical and thought provoking experiences as any other tripper but the ease of access and the fact that tolerance is easier (and cheeper) to overcome than say LSD or Magic Mushrooms (and it's stimulant edge) makes it more prone to abusive cycles. Any psych will become your worst enemy if you abuse them.

 

[adder]

The chemical may be lab grade pure. But still if a person develops some negative connotations with a certain drug, this is going to be that way. It didn't have to be a bad trip but psychedelics are powerful tools to look deep inside oneself. They're not only nice toys to play around and smile like a psycho watching open-eyes and closed-eyes visuals. It's possible that people with some personality types and characters just tend to feel bad after some time after the ingestion.

I have taken various synthetic psychedelics including a lot of PEAs and amphetamines and I've never felt the way the OP described. The attitude is very important here.

 

[Humboldt]

I think that some people might experience strange trips on 2C-X (especially 2C-E), due to the fact that it is very sensitive to set and setting. Maybe even more than LSD, but not in the same - mostly mentally - way. The negative side-effects wrong set/setting-situations can create, are more physically pronounced which means you might feel poisoned. Even the mentally aspect is stronger in a way, for example I experienced that these compounds pushed me more to solve some actual problems than most "classics" did, which act in a more spiritual way for me. I would say that 2Cs require more integration when it comes to a strong trip as the trip is more down to earth and more related to everyday life and actual behavior.

I think this might be one reason for the concerns about them not being "natural" and think to call this effects unnatural is more a question of wording as not few "natural" drugs can produce even heavier side-effects.
But on the other hand it might just be my impression and individual reaction.

 

[Benway189]

wow. glad i read this. I have like 10 hits of 2cE sitting around that I haven't used. I've never even tried them. I just bought them a while back. sounds like i should try to just trade them for some mushrooms.! thanks to the OP for this info.

 

[Benway189]

very true. attitude and set/setting are important......my best trips were ALWAYS ALONE!!!!!!. put parties or more than 1 other person in the mix, and bad trip everytime. (this was on paper lsd). Now mushrooms, i can do at any given time really.

 

[lolusername]

wow. glad i read this. I have like 10 hits of 2cE sitting around that I haven't used. I've never even tried them. I just bought them a while back. sounds like i should try to just trade them for some mushrooms.! thanks to the OP for this info.

You should give the chemical a chance before you just trade it away for something else.

 

[Powerup]

wow. glad i read this. I have like 10 hits of 2cE sitting around that I haven't used. I've never even tried them. I just bought them a while back. sounds like i should try to just trade them for some mushrooms.! thanks to the OP for this info.

See, this is exactly what people are concerned about happening when people read the OP. Personally, having quite a bit of experience with it, I find 2ce to be an exceptionally beautiful, "organic" (in terms of the visuals), and useful chem. Has it changed the way I think when sober? Actually, I think it has. But I like it. You just got to roll with these things. Having a new experience in sober life will change the way you think -- a new relationship, a new job, a new friendship, a new activity. So what's wrong with a trip changing the way you think? I welcome it.

 

[Benway189]

See, this is exactly what people are concerned about happening when people read the OP. Personally, having quite a bit of experience with it, I find 2ce to be an exceptionally beautiful, "organic" (in terms of the visuals), and useful chem. Has it changed the way I think when sober? Actually, I think it has. But I like it. You just got to roll with these things. Having a new experience in sober life will change the way you think -- a new relationship, a new job, a new friendship, a new activity. So what's wrong with a trip changing the way you think? I welcome it.

No, i totally understand, from my perspective.....i've done lsd and shrooms......at the end of the day, i'd choose shrooms. I went crazy on blotter back in 98.....yeh, it blew my mind and opened that third eye.....but i had to work to get back to being halfway non-conspiracy theorist again......All I meant to the original poster was that if it's a cold crazy insane trip; then that's not what i'm looking for these days. I'm 31 and have already let my mind unravel on real blotter.....i don't want that. I like a lighter controlled experience such as shrooms. Guess I'm just getting old. LOL> peace everyone!.

 

[Tunnelfission]

I've only tired 2C-I but it was very interesting engaging but with more a sense of being at a loss to control myself than ever before. does not flow with my body but some friends just love it and can tolerate it without issues whatsoever. some are neutral and enjoy it yet can't get over the body load. Very comparable to mescaline for me but would pick the cactus over 2C-I any day. 2C-
B seems like it might be more where I'm at

Not for everyone but it depends on your ability to tolerate the very strange and alien.

 

[Cyanoide]

No, i totally understand, from my perspective.....i've done lsd and shrooms......at the end of the day, i'd choose shrooms. I went crazy on blotter back in 98.....yeh, it blew my mind and opened that third eye.....but i had to work to get back to being halfway non-conspiracy theorist again......All I meant to the original poster was that if it's a cold crazy insane trip; then that's not what i'm looking for these days. I'm 31 and have already let my mind unravel on real blotter.....i don't want that. I like a lighter controlled experience such as shrooms. Guess I'm just getting old. LOL> peace everyone!.

Are you familiar with 4-substituted tryptamines?

 

[Benway189]

Are you familiar with 4-substituted tryptamines?

Nope; can't say I am. But i'm guessing they might be up my alley if you are mentioning them. I checked and it sounds like they are much like psilocibin.? Please expound and enlighten me.

I would like to learn how to make my own psilocibin on filmstrip......the so-called 'sea of psilocibin'.......sounds like it'd be easier than dealing with the contamination issues related with making straight up shrooms.

Peace.
Benway189

 

[Styrofoam Jones]

No, i totally understand, from my perspective.....i've done lsd and shrooms......at the end of the day, i'd choose shrooms. I went crazy on blotter back in 98.....yeh, it blew my mind and opened that third eye.....but i had to work to get back to being halfway non-conspiracy theorist again......All I meant to the original poster was that if it's a cold crazy insane trip; then that's not what i'm looking for these days. I'm 31 and have already let my mind unravel on real blotter.....i don't want that. I like a lighter controlled experience such as shrooms. Guess I'm just getting old. LOL> peace everyone!.

It was not my intention to scare anybody off of trying these drugs, please don't let me do that. If you have some 2C-E and you're interested in it, at least give it a try before writing it off. I just think they deserve a lot of extra caution is all. If you're into more ethereal trips and less analytical trips then you probably won't like it (tryptamines sound way more up your alley, I highly recommend 4-AcO-DMT and aMT), but everybody reacts differently. I've only had LSD once, but I personally loved it. It seemed to me to have the heavy analytical nature of the 2Cs but in a much warmer, more protective, and much more useful way.

 

[Benway189]

It was not my intention to scare anybody off of trying these drugs, please don't let me do that. If you have some 2C-E and you're interested in it, at least give it a try before writing it off. I just think they deserve a lot of extra caution is all. If you're into more ethereal trips and less analytical trips then you probably won't like it (tryptamines sound way more up your alley, I highly recommend 4-AcO-DMT and aMT), but everybody reacts differently. I've only had LSD once, but I personally loved it. It seemed to me to have the heavy analytical nature of the 2Cs but in a much warmer, more protective, and much more useful way.

Word up. I wouldnt say Im scared away; Im just like mmmmm; do I really want another crazy blotter type trip?? Actually, i did like blotter, it made me who i am today....for some reason i only ever had bad trips on 2 hits. Weird huh? I could take 1 or 5 or 7 and be totally fine....especially gel tabs....but any time id take 2 hits of paper; bad trip city!!!!!!! Guess 2 is the magic number. (not three) lol

 

[adder]

I don't think presence of a some person during the trip means a bad trip inevitably, it's not a rule definitely at least. I have taken relatively strong psychedelics not being alone and sometimes it was as great as it could be alone, just different. Also, having somebody by you when you're on any drug is always some policy (even if person(s) beside are also high, sometimes you can be of help...). It's a matter of preference. And also it's a matter of what psychedelic one ingested like e.g. 2C-B/2C-I is something that may be consumed in presence of other people and their entactogenic properties help communicate with other people, 2C-E is on the other hand something with more body-loading and bringing more insight into oneself (not mentioning 2C-E's cousin 2C-P: longer acting, body-loading and lasts forever - this one is definitely to be chosen to be ingested being alone by most people, I guess). Of course that's just for me.

 

[Bi0hazardOpeth]

Thanks to the OP for posting this thread. Credence to what he is saying:

The major fuction of this forum is to discuss and inform people of the possible consequences and help them be as safe as possible in their psychedelic consumption. Of course, people respond differently to the same chemical - But just because you haven't had similar adverse effects as described here - doesn't mean you should write off the many others who have experienced it and are concerned. The only reason they are taking the time to write up about their experiences is to help inform others so they can be informed of the possible adverse effects before choosing what they ingest in their body. I think this is the principle of why this forum was started in the first place. I also understand some of the complaints of users about "over-generalizing", which are valid - but as far as 2C-I - I can confirm a lot of what the ops and others have experienced. It may not happen to everyone, but my glaring obvious, almost daily obstructing effects have lasted over 2 1/2 years! and are just now starting to get better.

First off, the only psychedelics I have ever done are Shrooms (30+ times over 5 years) and 8 Doses of 2C-I in a little under half a year - most doses were between 18-22mg - always at-least 2 weeks apart. The problems started right after my 4th or 5th time using 2C-I and got worse the other couple times I tried it. Although I have to say, 2C-I was always a beautiful trip for me.

My effects were not as much visual changes but rather a persistent perception/body chemistry change like the OP is discussing. The left over effects had both negative and positive applications, which are all similar to the plus and minuses while on 2c-I itself.

1) For 1 and 1/2 years straight, I felt like I was on a medium dose of stimulants, non stop. Even in my sleep, I would jolt from laying on one side over to the other - with the speed and intensity of being on 30mg of Ritalin. I ended up having to take neurontin to help slow my body down and get past the awkwardness of feeling like I was on stims for weeks on end - with a feeling very similar to the 2c-i bodyload, but in ways worse and more "off". My mental bandwidth was also that of being on 30mg Ritalin - it was flying much faster - connecting thought after thought sometimes too fast for the conversation I was in, which would create a jittery anxiety in social situations. This stimulant effect is just now starting to slowly reduce itself 2 1/2 years later! I also felt very mentally / personality wise "off", for a period of time a lot of my personality disappeared - the only thing that would bring it back fully at the time as Neurontin (Gabapentin). However, this is finally back to normal - but for awhile I would feel "locked up" - my personality felt frozen my body and muscles at times would freeze up - like my face in social situations.

2) Spasms and Energy jolted through my body randomly. I've never had this before in my life, at first it was just these jolts of energy I would get through my body - like an overload release of stimulant energy that would make part of my upper body twitch strongly like a spasm. After a year of having the symptoms - the spasms got much much worse. Similar to a couple or users on this forum had. I began having hand and body temors, I would wake up in the morning and within 15 minutes I would have hand spasms/termors consistently - it even had this "are my hands coming or going" feeling like people discuss with Parkinson. My legs and hands then went through an 8 months period where they would get stiff, and lock up at period of time. Even while I was speaking my muscles would just lock up, and I would have to wait for them to unlock before I could finish talking at times. This lasted for 8 months and finally FINALLY is gone. I would wake up every morning, hoping not to have to deal with the tremors and muscle lock ups - but it would be clear as day

I went to two doctors, my mom is a doctor at a big hospital so I got access to some of the best diagnostics Doctors in the US. I didn't mention 2c-i use at all until after the diagnostics - because I was worried it might be something else or the 2c-i had triggered some other problem. After analyzing me, they said everything showed up fine on my tests, and the doctor said it looks like it was caused by Stimulant use, like the Ritalin I was on 9 years ago. Although, I clearly didn't have any symptoms like this in those 7 years of not taking ritalin before taking 2c-i, and all these symptoms started the Day after my 5th 2c-i experience. All of the 2c-i came from the same vendor so there was no different in synthesis. I then told the doctor about the 2c-i use and that it started right after then, and he told me it sounded right down the alley of what could cause these types of symptoms.

3) Also Right after that 4th or 5th dose, my metabolism seemed to go haywire. I would get incredible hungry out of nowhere, no build up or warning leading towards being kind of hungry - just a jump to feeling like I hadn't eaten in a day. Sugar really helped correct this as well. I also lost control of the sense of my bladder, all of a sudden I would have to pee like I held it in all day - with no warning or build up. It was never a real big issue =P but my monitoring of build up for it was completely gone for 2 weeks after.

(CONTINUED BELOW)


Bi0hazard