(ephenidine) Effects of diarylethylamines on health and human biology

[Vastness]

Would anyone more knowledgeable than I about pharmacology care to speculate on the likely short and long term health impacts of using diarylethylamines?

I know there is precious little to no actual research (I have looked, but if you know of anything relevant please do mention it anyway) hence why I'm asking for speculation.

I am most interested in Ephenidine since that's the one I've used, and probably is the only one I'm going to use, but given the relative novelty of the entire class speculation about any of them is welcome. I understand that diphenidine has been involved in a few deaths but I am a little hazy as to the specifics of these fatalities and the exact biological mechanism by which they occurred. Really, any information or speculation at all is welcome.

The first time I used Ephenidine I felt like I'd taken some industrial chemical and like I could actually feel my body struggling to process it. Retrospectively, I think this is highly likely to be more to do with the power of suggestion and my preconceived suspicions about the Chinese lab from which it likely originated. That said, I was drawn to Ephenidine after reluctantly having to quit using Ketamine after a couple of bladder scares as well as lingering negative psychological aftereffects that I could no longer pretend were not happening, and my impression so far is that apart from the inconvenient duration, it does not share the dreaded bladder-toxicity of arylcyclohexylamines, and the psychological aftereffects are a little easier, especially given the longer duration.

Of course, I recognise that reduced psychological and immediately obvious physiological aftereffects are not by any means a reliable measure of the severity of any real, neurological or physiological changes, BUT I mention this only really because arylcyclohexylamines are my only frame of reference. If there is a more structurally congruent class of chemicals that it would make more sense to compare with then please do share also.

 

[markosheehan]

sorry there is not much info on this but from a french vigilance study there was no physical dangers jumping out.

I would recommend looking into the new NMDA antagonists in clinical trials as a alternative to k. e.g cp101606

 

[ecstacylover]

In my subjective experience with ephenidine it seemed more toxic than any ACH I've used, but that may have been a result of my taking extremely reckless doses and/or batch impurities. Personally I would never use it again.


Pharmacologically it seems pretty similar to ketamine, selective for NMDAr while blocking induction of long-term potentiation. At higher doses it may have action on monoamine transporters and/or sigma receptors. Taking it frequently may cause hypertension though which is going to play hell on your kidneys in the long run, among other things. But perhaps due to structure or increased potency it isn't as likely to cause acute kidney injury, bladder or liver damage as ketamine.


If you're going to use NMDA antagonists, my advice would be don't use too frequently (<once/month), avoid high doses, and avoid using other drugs concurrently.

 

[Vastness]

Thank you both for your responses.

I would recommend looking into the new NMDA antagonists in clinical trials as a alternative to k. e.g cp101606

I had a look at the Wiki for that particular chemical, Traxoprodil, and it does not look particularly appealing given that development was abandoned due to the incidence of cardiac side effects. Do you have any experience with this substance yourself?

If you're going to use NMDA antagonists, my advice would be don't use too frequently (<once/month), avoid high doses, and avoid using other drugs concurrently.

Yeah, no doubt this is the most sensible advice. I really need to just not do any dissociatives for at least 6 months or so which I am going to try to stick to.

I think for most people there is a very narrow window of benefit for these substances, which quickly closes, and the prospect of ever opening the window again is just an illusion. Not that I ever did them for anything other than hedonistic reasons if I'm entirely honest with myself... but the idea that there might be something at the bottom of the fabled, class-spanning Hole that's actually worth finding is a really seductive feeling. I guess all drugs have this "chasing the dragon" aspect to them to some extent and dissociatives are no different... except that this quite ordinary, bog-standard neurological rewiring, compulsive redosing, and habituation is hidden behind a facade of psychedelic magic that makes you want to believe it's something else.