• N&PD Moderators: Skorpio | thegreenhand

The CsA act, the importance of supporting Isomer Design & safer raves

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Bluelighter
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Apr 12, 2013
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First I want to make it clear that I am not affiliated with Isomer Design, do not represent them or reflect their beliefs. I suggest supporting them because they provide the clearest, bast and most up-to-date situation regarding the drug laws in the USA, Canada & The United Kingdom. I did buy a poster off them about 7 years ago (I was the first, I am told) to support them and I know they are doing a lot of work used by lawmakers, lawyers, scientists, the media and many, many other groups and it's FREE.

So, that out of the way - the CsA


U.S.C. ? 802(32)

(i) the chemical structure of which is substantially similar to the chemical structure of a controlled substance in schedule I or II;

(ii) which has a stimulant, depressant, or hallucinogenic effect on the central nervous system that is substantially similar to or greater than the stimulant, depressant, or hallucinogenic effect on the central nervous system of a controlled substance in schedule I or II; or

(iii) with respect to a particular person, which such person represents or intends to have a stimulant, depressant, or hallucinogenic effect on the central nervous system that is substantially similar to or greater than the stimulant, depressant, or hallucinogenic effect on the central nervous system of a controlled substance in schedule I or II.


A few years ago, before the UK brought in the Psychoactive Substances Act so on-line sellers now sell items in a hugely different manner and test outside the UK, I did a little study.

After reading Bmchemd Pharmacology. Vol. 32, No I. pp. 1267-1273. 1983 (INDOLEALKYLAMINE AND PHENALKYLAMINE HALLUCINOGENS EFFECT OF a-METHYL AND N-METHYL SUBSTITUENTS ON BEHAVIORAL ACTIVITY)

I had one of our suppliers send me about 12g of the 2 isomers of AMT and from the price, I suspect they were not 'skilled in the art' of using d-(+)-IO-camphorsulfonic acid and had to repeatedly resolve a much larger batch to obtain the >97%ee I had specified. Never mind, boss convinced, time to book a day off if things get out of hand.

Initially I smoked tiny amounts off foil and had my wife use the dark-room/pupillometer method of checking for dilation. While I couldn't FEEL any subjective difference at low doses, the (R) enantiomer reliably increased pupil size, the (S) isomer did not. A test they cannot readily use on rodents. Even these low doses made me nauseous so next day I resolved to find out more about (S) AMT. At about 10:30AM I swallowed 50mg in a glass of cranberry juice to help mask that awful flavour. Then I did the worst possible thing. I worried. As it turned out, I didn't have too much to worry about. For the first 30 minutes I had a few heady moments and learned that the (S) isomer causes nausea. Then an improvement in mood and energy overcame me. I would liken it to about the same dose of (S) MDA but lacking the body-rushes and 'sledging' effect i.e. I wasn't taking deep breathes and mouthing 'wow' every 60 seconds for the first 30 minutes. It was very good. Not great, but very good. MDA good, not MDMA good. Also, importantly, not like racemic AMT.

If people delve into the 1960s Upjohn patents (Jacob Szmuszkovicz, Jackson B. Hester, Daniel Lednicer - Upjohns CNS 'dream team')) dealing with AET, 7-methyl AET and for the lone article on α7-DMT then they might discover something to their benefit. Their research showed that the methyl-->ethyl lead to a serious increase in MAOI activity so forget AET & 7-methyl AET. The least studied (due to existing patents from the 50s) one was α7-DMT which a group of Russian scientists looked into as a potential antidepressant. Don't forget, Russia prescribed AMT for depression way back then. I don't speak Russian but from the few OCRed Acrobat papers give a briefing on their work. They had concluded that it was the (S) isomer of AMT that was responsible for most of it's antidepressant action and what is more, the introduction of a 7-methyl grouping resulted in a dose only 25% of the existing agent was as effective.

In their rather cloistered medical research periodicals, they were by the standards of the day VERY positive. I wondered firstly why this compound hadn't been researched in the west (and is still unresearched - Shulgin never went for 7-substitution AFAIK and Nichols may well have, but won't be publishing his findings after the 4-MTA debacle.

So I am left with the question. If, as I suspect, (S)-α7-DMT is a derivative of AMT BUT subjectively significantly different to AMT (having if anything a lower potency and only VMAT-2 activity and no 5HT2a affinity) then how on earth does the CsA law deal with it? I'm not asking because I seek to test this law. I'm asking because it's a HUGE hole. I'm sure that if people take a look around, they will be quite amazed at how drugs have been classified by their subjective effects and NON-chiral naming, doesn't the law just fail in these circumstances?

My only thought is that the people who are still producing 'bath salts' operate the 'gray market' using the classic black market business model (higher profit margins, victims cannot go to police, monopoly of supply, associated criminal activity and lack of media interest in a 'bath salts' death when compared to MDMA death story, acceptance of bribery of law-enforcement and politicians.... I could go on but it's now been over 100 years since the first drug was outlawed. Heroin was made illegal under then 1916 DORA (Defense Of The Realm act) law to stop soldiers sat in trenches being gassed, bombed and blasted from taking heroin, morphine or cocaine to alleviate the unconscionable conditions that the public were shielded from (we call it propaganda when another country does it). Until 1916 Harrods sold tin boxes containing a hypodermic syringe, blocks of morphine and pouches of cocaine. The strap-line?

'A Welcome Present for Friends at the Front'.


So have fun and play legal.
 
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So I am left with the question. If, as I suspect, (S)-α7-DMT is a derivative of AMT BUT subjectively significantly different to AMT (having if anything a lower potency and only VMAT-2 activity and no 5HT2a affinity) then how on earth does the CsA law deal with it? I'm not asking because I seek to test this law. I'm asking because it's a HUGE hole. I'm sure that if people take a look around, they will be quite amazed at how drugs have been classified by their subjective effects and NON-chiral naming, doesn't the law just fail in these circumstances?

Although defendants prosecuted under the Controlled Substances Act have successfully argued that two substances are not "substantially similar" in chemical structure, there has not to my knowledge ever been a successful defences based on the argument that two substances are not "substantially similar" in effect. Of course this is problematic - there is at least one lower court decision which threw out U.S.C. 802(32) for being "void for vagueness." I think, however, that the law is intended to be vague. The more vague it is, the wider net it can spread - especially in the United States, where successfully defending a prosecution using an argument of law is exceedingly rare.
 
What do you expect from theresa may? she's a mental case bitch and the devil incarnate. Needs shooting for the good of humanity. 'Nuff said. Well, other than that she is a complete and utter cretin, and totally incapable of even comprehending the law she shat out.

I can't see a negative proof that two (any two) substances are not 'substantially' similar in effect. For one, 'substantial' is, in terms of a psychoactive, totally subjective, only one who has taken themselves, any pair of substances with psychotropic effect can tell whether or not they are similar.

Using AMT as an example, which I have experienced, I could compare it to psilocybin, to buttfuck-plain 'phet/meth/ethphet or MDxx.
tHere are derivatives that are structurally similar and have NO similarity to each other and vice-versa, one would near enough have to have a judge and jury all take a given compoud pair AND agree that they are 'substantially' similar.

Personally I'm just waiting for the end of the PSA, happy in the knowledge that any copper stupid enough to come buggering about in this lab is more than likely to gas themselves to death/blast themselves to pieces.
 
I could compare any controlled drug to any other organic chemical on the basis that they have carbon and hydrogen atoms, a melting point, CAS numbers, etc.

Interpreting laws literally leads to some crazy headaches.
 
Yeah, quite. Its why I don't bother and just say 'fuckitall, and keep it under wraps, the lab serving for..well..you get the idea. :)

I can't follow the CSA, and won't even pay it lip service other than to befoul the name of the styx-beshitten torrent of paedophillic zoophile scatological rape spawn that is theresa anus or whatever the bitch's name stinks of.

Fucking whorebegotten, feculent pestilential gorgonslut, rapesprog and canine cumdumpster bitch needs to piss off back to hell already. Only valid purpose for that slagchops canid cumdumpstress twatmongrel is a bullet-sump for target practice.

I could call theresa may 'substantially similar' to the fucking devil, and have her burnt at the stake for being substantially similar to a satan-serving evil old witch, sucking the pups of hellspawned abominations like herself on the milk of evil, lapped from the abscess-riddled, pus-dribbling tit she has for a face by the dregs of Perdition that not even the styx could do ought but vomit forth in disgust.
 
Relax, labs dont even exsist. I know personally i am on zero drugs structurally or subjectively similar to illegal drugs. I dont even know what a drug is. Sometimes the most valuable information is best kept secret. You cant argue with stupidity.
 
So basically everything illegal.

You took amt? What happened.

I took the resolved isomers on separate occasions. It's just an interesting wrinkle that while the (R) and racemate are true hallucinogens but since the (S) is an entactogen, it doesn't display 'similar or stronger activity than the controlled drug. (S) 7-Me AMT is basically an exact MDA mimic. So it's legal position is uncertain.

The UK law is stupid. Nutmeg should be illegal and I will enjoy seeing that case fail.
 
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