Micro/Low Dose Psychedelics vs Taking Nootropics

[indigowizard]

After some trials with microdosing psychedelics, I started reading about nootropics. I don't believe the psychedelics are sustainable for long-term use, especially when a daily boost is sought after. They helped with clearing up brain fog, providing energy, elevating mood, enhancing creativity, enhancing focus, inducing flow, increasing awareness, etc.

One thing I found to dislike about microdosing is that it reduced or almost eliminated the magic of normal psychedelic doses. After enough time, it almost felt like abuse. I would prefer to save those for special occasions, when deeper mental and spiritual work is needed.

Low doses of psychedelics helped the most when I had a project to work on and could prevent distractions. I would just sit for hours and be very productive. I've been reading about people doing similar tasks after taking things like racetams, Hydergine, and Noopept.

What are some differences, similarities, advantages, and disadvantages to either approach of improving mental health and well-being in general, not just for enhanced productivity?

Something that concerns me about the nootropics is the number of grams and variety of powder I may have to ingest on a daily basis, vs a microdose. Although, I already take about 6g of L-Arginine in orange juice every morning to help keep my blood pressure within a normal range. It probably wouldn't hurt to add more to that, anyway, and develop a supplement stack.

I already eat fairly healthy, lots of fresh fruits and veggies, fish. Simple foods that I make mostly from scratch. I don't really exercise but trying to get myself back into it.

As an example of what I've been doing with psychedelics...

Lysergamide Starter
Drinking coffee everyday became a bad habit that started to negatively impact my health. It stopped giving me a boost and instead made me tired. It gave me heartburn and upset my stomach. Not to mention the damage to my teeth/gums. Instead of drinking coffee, I would take anywhere from 10-25mcg of ALD-52, 2-3 times a week, though my usual dose was 20mcg. Any other lysergamide could be substituted, but I found the most benefit from ALD-52. That, combined with 5-6g of L-Arginine in orange juice would give me enough physical and mental energy for the next 8-12 hours. I would continue to go about my day as needed. It didn't impair my ability to do any tasks, but actually increased my awareness. It didn't negatively affect my appetite and rather made me crave more natural, raw foods.

There is a nice feeling on the comeup, as it has a mood enhancing affect on me. There is also a noticeable comedown, which usually happens before a normal bedtime. The time in between is enhanced, more playful, more intense, used to solve problems, find answers. Otherwise, just makes me feel like an improved version of myself. It also gives a good dose of weird as is natural to the lysergamides, in my experience.

The only downside I see in this is the impact it has to tolerance, given the way psychedelic tolerance works in general. I like these things at micro, low, normal, high, and very high doses. The low doses don't work as something that you can use to recover after a high dose of it. I could see it helping after a night of drinking or something like that, however. On the plus side, it makes it okay to have lazy days, off days, rest and recovery days, etc. Just make sure to pack as much as you can in while under the influence, because you won't get it everyday.

Tryptamine Boost
On my "productive" days, or days that I started with a lysergamide, I would sometimes get an extra boost in the evening from a low dose tryptamine. More specifically, anywhere from 10-15mg 4-AcO-DPT, or 5-10mg 4-HO-MiPT, depending on what I needed to do and how long I wanted to stay up. If I went over those doses it could produce too much psychedelia for me to be highly productive, but I would try to use it to my advantage. For example, only taking a higher dose when I really needed to think outside the box.

This boost would give me more energy and a different perspective on whatever I was working on or thinking about. The mentioned tryptamines, in general, provide me with great mental clarity and enhanced mind-body connection, allowing me to almost go on auto-pilot and watch ideas flow through me.

Opposed to the lysergamides, these do decrease my appetite. I would be sure to eat light and healthy 2-3 hours beforehand.

The only downside I see with repeated use of this is again, tolerance. I like experimenting with tryptamines for deep mental and spiritual work. Using them for the purpose of enhanced productivity at low doses 2-3 days per week nearly destroys their potential for deep mental and spiritual work. However, I've produced some of the best work of my life using them in this way.

Marijuana Habit
I don't drink alcohol anymore. I used to drink everyday and it nearly killed me several times. I vaporize marijuana now, which I actually used heavily before my bad habit with alcohol. Normally, I vaporize about 100mg of dry herb at a time, and I'll do 3-5 of those a day. I use it for stress and anxiety relief, as a mood enhancer, creative tool, appetite stimulant, muscle relaxer, and pain reliever. It also synergizes nicely with the lysergamides and tryptamines for me. The indicas and indica-dominant hybrids help me sleep.

There are more downsides to this part than the other two. Marijuana clouds my head, makes me groggy/fatigued, impairs my memory and focus, makes me daydream more often, and it occupies a lot of time. If I have 4-5 hours to use for a project I'm working on, I might spend 1-2 of those hours grinding, packing, vaping, and cleaning up the marijuana. I enjoy doing all of that, however. It allows me to be lazy, to take it easy, to relax, take my time. I think that's important. It also makes me want to stop and eat, which is also important, but then occupies more time.

The mental clarity from the lysergamide and/or tryptamine is somewhat impaired by this. However, I've been willing to trade that for all of the other benefits this plant has to offer.

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Now I'm back to drinking coffee _almost_ everyday, and using micro/low dose psychedelics less often. I would like to save my tolerance for higher doses of those. I've been trying green tea again instead of coffee since the coffee doesn't seem to agree with me. I just don't get much of a stimulating or energizing effect from green tea. I'm also going to try taking an extended break from marijuana use, to clear my head up, relieve fatigue, and relieve my dependence on it's mood enhancing qualities (I need to find something with less side effects).

Anyway, I'm going to start exploring racetams, Hydergine, and Noopept. Possibly adding other supplements to my diet. I'm interested to see how they compare to my experiments with micro/low dose psychedelics. I'm curious to see how they interact with psychedelics, as well. I'll probably report back here after several months about my own experience. I'd like to find a supplement stack that works as well or better than the micro/low dose psychedelics, if possible.

I've already read through:
* The Big & Dandy Nootropics Thread (Stack 2)
* The Big & Dandy Psychedelics and Nootropics Interaction Thread
* Nootropics/racetams that pair well with psychedelics

I'm more interested in comparing micro/low dose psychedelics to taking nootropics. Has anybody tried both and found pros/cons of using these things in any sort of routine?

Ultimately, my biggest issue seems to be fighting fatigue, primarily mental. I feel burned out and can't find anything that works to combat that effectively on a consistent basis. Sleeping 10-12 hours helps, but I can't get away with that too often... maybe once a week or once every couple weeks. I'm hoping that taking a break from marijuana helps as well.

 

[indigowizard]

Here I am several months later. I've been experimenting with different nootropics and supplements and would like to share the experience as it relates to this thread. For the most part, I've found a combination that appears to be sustainable and highly beneficial for me that I use on days that I work. On my days off, I let my tolerance recover. I'll get into more detail about all of that later on.

Both of these approaches to enhancing cognitive performance have unique roles, and I don't believe that one can replace the other. In the most basic terms, I would say that psychedelics are for thinking and nootropics are for doing.

Micro/low dose psychedelics are much better for creativity and examining an idea from different perspectives. I also feel more witty on them, like I come up with the right thing to say at the right time more often. They make me feel more in tune with the world around me. They also help me understand and piece things together faster than nootropics do. However, on that note, I think the nootropics will become more effective in the long-term.

Nootropics are much better for routine tasks, memory recall, and attention span. They also make me feel much more in control of my thoughts and impulses. One immediate benefit that I've realized from taking nootropics is that my stress and anxiety levels have dropped dramatically. I'm able to perform as needed under pressure and stay in the moment. I'm able to maintain a logical process in my mind and follow it without losing track of what I set out to do. I'm also able to change direction and create a new foreseeable path with ease.

I believe they can be mixed synergistically, though the psychedelics should be reserved for special occassions. When it comes to developing a routine, the nootropics are much more suited for that. I am still working on tweaking my own routine and researching other supplements, but have discovered that Adrafinil is a key player for keeping me going throughout the day. I can limit myself to one cup of coffee per day, but usually have two because I enjoy it, and it no longer gives me heartburn.

After experimenting with how each of these affected me individually, I am currently using the following combination effectively. As stated earlier, I only do this on days that I work, which is four 10 hour days a week. On my days off, I stick to just L-citrulline for regulating blood pressure, and coffee.

Within the first couple hours of my day, I work on consuming the following:

1. 3g L-citrulline mixed with orange juice. If I have powdered Adrafinil I'll mix that in as well, otherwise...
2. 600mg Adrafinil + 500mg Rhodiola Rosea in capsules
3. 1 k-cup of coffee
4. 750mg Oxiracetam and 750mg Aniracetam mixed into a smoothie (frozen triple berry blend, hemp seeds, chia seeds, greek yogurt, 1/2 banana, milk, sometimes peanut butter).
5. Breakfast that always includes eggs.

That's usually good enough for the entire work day, though, as mentioned earlier I'll have a second cup of coffee after breakfast just for the enjoyment. I eat 2 eggs with my breakfast everyday and try to otherwise keep my diet healthy with homemade food and fresh produce.

On the latter half of my work week, I like to have 200mg Phenylpiracetam after lunch. I may pair that second cup of coffee with this as well.

After sticking to this for a few months, I can report the following.

In the first few weeks, I was still battling fatigue on my days off and was taking more Adrafinil than I should have. I was also taking racetams everyday. After I introduced Rhodiola Rosea into the mix, my fatigue went away, even on days that I wasn't taking it. So now, on my days off, I feel quite normal. On the days that I work and take this stack I just operate on a higher level.

I'm no longer using marijuana on a daily basis and quite enjoy the feeling of sobriety and a clear head throughout the week. I will occassionally pick up and go through a sack or two, but then take a month off, or more.

My use of psychedelics has also reduced. I haven't microdosed since my original post, and have enjoyed much deeper and profound macrodoses. I've had some experiences that were stronger than when I first started getting back into psychedelics over a year ago now. However, I no longer really crave the psychedelic experience, so I can use it more as a spiritual and psychological tool than something to get high with. In many ways though, the psychedelics helped me to overcome my desire to escape sobriety. It just took awhile to get there. I needed something more mentally stimulating than coffee for my routine days, which is where the nootropics fit in.

Overall, I feel that my life is much more balanced at this point than it has been in probably 15 years, and continues to improve. Nootropics helped me to regain myself as the high performance workhorse that I was in my younger years. Psychedelics helped me evolve.

As I continue using psychedelics for personal growth, I'll eventually find better ways to use those and will write some literature that will hopefully be beneficial to others.

Like a healthy diet for both mind and spirit, there are psychedelics.