Questions for experienced Oxycodone / opiate users

[fallbondler]

Hi, I'm new here and couldn't find a thread with what I was looking for. If there are any rules I'm not following etc let me know.

I'm experienced with drugs of almost all categories except opiates. I've tried oxy twice recently (40mg both times) and had a few questions about it as well as other opiates:

Immediate vs Extended Release
I've used the ER version but I know that the peak effects are much stronger with IR, which seems much more rare. I've heard that some types of ER pills can be crushed into powder which basically turns them into IR, but some can't. I'm only really interested in oral dosing, rather than insufflating etc. My questions are:

1) Are crushed ERs basically the same as IRs?
2) Does crushing IRs increase the intensity even further?
3) How can you tell whether an ER pill can be made into an IR or not? (I saw something about dissolving it in water?)
4) Surely crushing an ER pill will always increase the intensity of the effects regardless?


Combinations
The second time I used oxy I cut up the pill into small pieces, I noticed a faster and stronger onset with a higher peak. I also vaporized some cannabis which seemed to enhance the effects. The first time I was 'nodding' towards the end but fought the urge to sleep for as long as possible. When I went to bed eventually I had terrible insomnia, itching, gurning etc and didn't get anything resembling sleep until about 6am. It was similar to trying to sleep after using a stimulant like amphetamines or MDMA, where I would usually use around 30mg of valium. The second time wasn't as bad but I still didn't get to sleep until around 7am. My questions are:

6) Are there any other pleasant combinations with opiates which aren't dangerous?
7) Is it safe/helpful to take an antihistamine (something like benadryl) to reduce the itching?
8 ) Would it be safe to take 10-30mg of valium to fall asleep?

Sorry for the long post, or if these questions have been answered elsewhere. Any help would be great!

 

[Keif' Richards]

Hey there fallblonder! I would like to give you a warm welcome to the forums! We always appreciate new blood around these parts. Thank you as well for taking the time to create a fairly concise thread, given the depth of information you're seeking. I'm going to combine your first 5 inquiries into a more succinct answer than if I were to attack them individually.

Basically, there are different manufacturers who make different products and have different mechanisms meant to produce extended/controlled/delayed release. These mechanisms range from the relatively simple (think, original Oxycontin), to the fairly complex (think, Concerta-brand of Methylphenidate). I know you're not into Methylphenidate, but you can examine the complexity of this mechanism to give you an idea of what is out there. The former, can simply be crushed to render it 99% instant release, whereas the Concerta requires a specific process that might not even render it completely instant-release.

Oxycontin was reformulated several years ago to make them more difficult to defeat. For each pill, there is going to be a slightly different process that might work better, but the main take-away is that it will vary. You are right that crushing these pills, whatever the mechanism, will most likely defeat the mechanism to a certain extent, but the question of how well you have defeated the mechanism is difficult to answer. There's not a lot of "science" or "statistics" behind it. One person might do a more complete job of defeating the mechanism then the next etc. For the sake of Harm Reduction though, it's important to always assume you have defeated the mechanism.

Now, we will attack your next block of questions one by one, but please be aware, not all are totally suitable or appropriate for the forums, but no worries!

6. Combinations are something you will need to investigate on your own time. Many folks, myself included, don't mind a sedative antihistamine a la Diphenhydramine (Benadryl) with our Opioids to both reduce itch and increase sedation. Basically, the world is your oyster and the only drugs you need to be concerned with are other Central Nervous System Depressants; Ethyl/Drinking Alcohol, Benzodiazepines, Barbiturates, Non-Barbiturates, Z-Drugs among others. If you choose to experiment with combinations of CNS depressants, I would recommend consulting us beforehand, otherwise, your preferences are yours to develop my friend.

7. Yes!

8. Until you understand the nature of your own physiology and how you tolerate the combination of Diazepam (Valium) and a given Opioid, you must start with a small dosage. I wouldn't exceed 10mg Diazepam equivalent to start and wouldn't exceed 30mg under any circumstances if we're keeping Harm Reduction philosophy at the fore.

I hope this helps and let me or any of the other staff know if you have questions, concerns or unwanted children.

 

[fallbondler]

Awesome, thanks for the fast and very detailed reply - I really appreciate it and it has definitely helped a lot! I guess I'll do some research on the specific ER mechanism used in the particular brand of pill I get next time.

You mentioned that some of my questions weren't entirely appropriate - could you please clarify this? Wouldn't want to make the same mistake again.

Thanks

 

[Static-77]

I only have experiance with instant relief and i always chew them but i have gone through my fair share of various opiods, but i do have good knowledge on combos and synrgys. Adding any other cns deppresant does increase the risk of death and none of these combos are "safe" but im am still alive and have tried them all just be careful friend. I have had alot of fun mixing some 80proof vodka (lower amounts just a couple shots), you might like pot with opiods but i feel it taints the high, and muscle relaxers add nice sedation but also a heavy body load and sometimes a hangover, taking benzos and opioids simultaneously can be dangerous and usually just knocks you out and wastes them both. antihistamines like promethyzine and benadryl go great with opiods to add sedation and reduce itching but make sure when taking codiene to administer them 15mins after because you need all your liver enzymes to focus on codiene and turn more into morphine. As for benzos for sleep, if youre intolerant id lower that valium dose from 30 to 15mg but if your tolerant its up to you, also if you dont have any benadryl should knock u out don't take much more than 50-75mg though or you'll feel icky.

 

[fallbondler]

Thanks for the tips! Definitely going to use some Benadryl next time. I deliberately don't use any drug regularly enough to have any noticeable tolerance, so my benzo tolerance would hopefully be at baseline. I'm not planning to take the valium at the peak anyway, I'll probably have 10mg when I go to bed as a last resort if I can't fall asleep, but I should be mostly down from the oxy/morphine.

 

[Pickledlemons]

What kief said.

Also, I've heard that leaving the new formulation oxys in an acid like vinegar or coke (a cola) overnight destroys the extended release mechanism. I've never tried it myself however.

 

[Lorne???]

Onky problem is opioids do NOT like acidic environments ; this is why antacids enchance absorption,, and even increasing urine ph slows methadone elimination; however 7-12 hours may well be harmless

Kief pretty much got this one, will say that if you can grind it finely enough, you have done something, and, morphine tablets seem easier to break down (ya know, OxyContin is BAD! Worst than other pain pills )

Benadrly, or similar first gen antihistamines for nausea, and can also potentiate opioids, and help put you to sleep before the oxy nod starts to wear off

And OP, one thing that isn't really appropriate is usbtelling yiu what pills you should get, regardless of price. As you may know, specifics price discussion isn't allowed, though you weren't specific, so that's fine; still, we can't run around really making recommendations like that-a more specific question might be different- he may also have been referring to discrection

CAREFUL WITH BENZODIAZEPINES AND OPIOIDS, unless hopelessly dependent, even then, you can't really jut abuse both simultaneously, at least not safely. However, 5-10mg of Valium Shall
kick in fast, and wear off fairly quick; however oxy itself has a short-intermediate Duration, sonif your fighting the nod, after a few hours, you may need like, say 25% of your initial dose to sleep and not crash, although again, relatively low dose valium should be ok - Again, Welcome to BL!

 

[fallbondler]

Thanks for the tips, amended.

 

[marklevin]

hi there

new member here

you mention

Kief pretty much got this one, will say that if you can grind it finely enough, you have done something, and, morphine tablets seem easier to break down (ya know, OxyContin is BAD! Worst than other pain pills )

i have the oxycontin ocs's by mundipharma, these are the oc stamped out to them and not the op
how does one crush these properly
as i still cant crush them into a fine powder using a coffee grinder
does one have to hold the in ones mouth first and then peel the cover off and then crush them?

best wishes
mark

Onky problem is opioids do NOT like acidic environments ; this is why antacids enchance absorption,, and even increasing urine ph slows methadone elimination; however 7-12 hours may well be harmless

Kief pretty much got this one, will say that if you can grind it finely enough, you have done something, and, morphine tablets seem easier to break down (ya know, OxyContin is BAD! Worst than other pain pills )

Benadrly, or similar first gen antihistamines for nausea, and can also potentiate opioids, and help put you to sleep before the oxy nod starts to wear off

And OP, one thing that isn't really appropriate is usbtelling yiu what pills you should get, regardless of price. As you may know, specifics price discussion isn't allowed, though you weren't specific, so that's fine; still, we can't run around really making recommendations like that-a more specific question might be different- he may also have been referring to discrection

CAREFUL WITH BENZODIAZEPINES AND OPIOIDS, unless hopelessly dependent, even then, you can't really jut abuse both simultaneously, at least not safely. However, 5-10mg of Valium Shall
kick in fast, and wear off fairly quick; however oxy itself has a short-intermediate Duration, sonif your fighting the nod, after a few hours, you may need like, say 25% of your initial dose to sleep and not crash, although again, relatively low dose valium should be ok - Again, Welcome to BL!