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If God knows everything, how can there be free will?

God is dead. God remains dead. And we have killed him. How shall we comfort ourselves, the murderers of all murderers? What was holiest and mightiest of all that the world has yet owned has bled to death under our knives: who will wipe this blood off us? What water is there for us to clean ourselves? What festivals of atonement, what sacred games shall we have to invent? Is not the greatness of this deed too great for us? Must we ourselves not become gods simply to appear worthy of it?
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Nietzsche.
 
Spaznot said:
No my friend He (Jesus) is not ?dead?. Jesus was witnessed by hundreds of men not to mention women and children after the crucifiction. Also, just to clarify, I don?t say what I do to be antagonistic or argumentative I honestly do it out of love. I believe that Jesus is the only way to eternal salvation for me to not share that with non believers would in my opinion be hateful. It would be much easier to stand by quietly and leave others to their misguided beliefs. The truth (at least for me) is I don?t want anyone to spend eterenty in torment. That?s my objective. Not to appear superior or in some regards silly. What true Christians want is to share Gods love. How can one not at the very least respect that premise? With that in mind...NOT dead, not at all. In the end everyone will know this as fact but it will be too late for most.
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Exactly. Jesus is very much alive. He was resurrected and is seated at the right hand of God in Heaven right now. If people think the spiritual world doesn't manifest into reality, they are mistaken. Anyway, I agree with you, but I won't continue going back and forth with non-believers in this thread.

The goodness and mercy of Jesus is that even though many people may not be following His path yet, He is still protecting them from the devil's harm and ready to receive them as citizens of Heaven when they decide to get saved and accept Jesus into their heart. Again, that comes down to free will. As I stated earlier, Jesus will even let people go to Hell if that's what they choose and continue to deny Him.

The Holy Spirit will do the rest of the work when the time is right. We did our part at least letting them know the truth. :)
 
I think it's the insistence on capitalization of the masculine pronouns and speaking as if reading from a script. It doesn't creep me out, personally, but I was raised Christian. However it does come across rather cultishly and it turns off people who aren't already in that mindset. Just being honest about it, having been on both sides of the "fence".
 
Shadowmeister said:
I think it's the insistence on capitalization of the masculine pronouns and speaking as if reading from a script. It doesn't creep me out, personally, but I was raised Christian. However it does come across rather cultishly and it turns off people who aren't already in that mindset. Just being honest about it, having been on both sides of the "fence".
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Ok. Maybe it's easy to focus on the capitalization rather than the entire message being about love, but hey, I can't control what people want to dwell on.
 
@Shadowmeister: well said. i think we were on the same side of the fence and didn't cross paths. probably best for the establishment.

@CoastTwoCoast: not all christians believe in it being about love. like anything there are two factions though it's nice to see the one with the most growth seems to be more about accepting and love. (insert bible thumping jpeg here)
 
^ Yes and that's a shame that many people are feeling like God doesn't love them. As a matter of fact, that is what kept me from it for like a decade or so. Some pastors make people feel condemned or ashamed. That's not the right way. There are the religious zealots who are anti-gay and anti-abortion, but it's not our place to judge people and put them down like that.

The Old Testament was based on law and following strict rules. The New Testament is based on grace and love because Jesus was sent to pay for Adam's mistakes. People need to listen to pastors who teach grace like Pastor Joseph Prince is awesome. Also, Joel Osteen and John Gray. I'm a Lakewood Church fan because they talk about love and grace.
 
I didn't mean to offend anyone, I'm just saying, the overall presentation comes across as very cult-like, sort of like you're all parroting the same exact phrases and manner of speaking/writing. I was just trying to explain to you what I think turns a lot of people off to that sort of attempt to persuade. I appreciate the message of love and I have a lot of respect for Christians who use the religion that way, like my mother for example. At its core it's a beautiful message although I believe heaven and hell are social control constructs. I like to listen to the words of Jesus from the New Testament, radical love and acceptance and helping others, and I agree with most everything that was written as his words. Especially as I investigate the Gnostic Christian texts, which were written the closest to his actual lifetime (and are not included in the Bible).

But yeah it's really a shame that some people/leaders have perverted the message and caused such suffering. Many people who are not Christian only see or focus on the bad side of the religion (any religion has a bad side, and it's brought about by people in power perverting it for their own purposes, like the Inquisition, or European imperialism).
 
Jesus was no more the son of God than you or I. He was full of unconditional love because he had reached a point that allowed him to be so, mostly on his own - mind you. But he had a lot of help and may have even traveled the world in his quest to gain his powers and become as spiritual as he did. I have a lot of disagreement with Christians because of the obvious flaws that they can't oversee in this book that has robbed millions and robbed them blind. Heaven and Hell? I agree with Shadowmeister. To suggest that I won't be joining along on this mythical journey to heaven because I don't accept Christ is kinda like saying you won't be going there because you don't accept the Buddha. They were pretty much the same in a lot of regards. The just worked differently at it.
 
Yes, in fact if you read the Gnostic texts, Jesus wasn't even claiming to be more the son of God than anyone else. My read on the whole thing is that he was a kind and enlightened soul and spiritual teacher who was trying to send the message that we are all part of the divine and if we love each other we can have heaven on Earth. He supported taking care of each other and he supported a departure from the current church of the time (ie, the Old Testament religion). The Roman Catholic church formed about 300 years after his death, and appropriated the texts they found fit into their mission, which was to regain control over the population who had decided to take on Jesus' teachings. Historically, the organized religion of Christianity was founded on social control and maintaining dominance of an empire. None of the books of the official New Testament were written very close to the actual life of Jesus. However, other texts were found with the Dead Sea Scrolls that offer other takes of his teachings and were written earlier, but they were not allowed into the Bible.
 
^ those gosh darn ecumenical councils screwing things up for the rest of us. (hrmph!) :!

wish i could get my hands on those scrolls and know how to read summerian? sanskrit? akkadian? aramaic?

whatever they used back then. if someone has a line on where i can buy moses dvd collection let me know, i'd pay top dollar for the lot.
 
There are translations... you can search online for them.
 
^ i don't believe it cause everything on the net is a lie! but i will look for them anyway cause i'm interested and you haven't led me ashtray.
 
It's true, it's like they say, "you can lead ashtray to water, but you shouldn't, because it'll make it smell worse"
 
God hates questions. Just believe, or else... He'll smite you. With His smiting. Because He's a jealous God. Thou shalt not and such...
 
now i'm just really bonkers.

first i bow down then i don't kneel but it's ok for jesus to wash my feet and now we're back to smithing and my smithing level is only 6.

i don't think i'll be able to get the fairy wand before the evil sorcerer rains fire and chihuahuas. time to hit the mountain dew and doritos for an all nighter. excelsior!
 
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