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Are opioids the next antidepressant?

Pill2Chill said:
Very high. Smoking weed atm, and constantly smoking H. Got a g of nice tan powder. And some from another batch. Also bought some furanyl fentanyl and another analogue but I won't mess with those unless I need to. (got liquid dosed furanyl fent, and the other one is cut with caffeine. But I still don't feel to comfortable with those substances.

So I'm smoking H. Also ate 80mg oxy, xr. Think I'll add 12mg bromazepam now. And then I'll smoke more H. :p
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Oh my gosh... Please may I live with you? ?
 
One of the most interesting substances in this regard is Tianeptine. It is chemically classified as a TCA, but lacks many classical effects of that class, and moreover it displays opioid activity at the MOR with 383-768 Ki.

Hence, it is technically an opioid, and higher dosages (normal dosages are between 10mg to 30mg) such as 100+ mg produce an unmistakable opiod-like buzz.

The antidepressant pharmacodynamics are quite complex and not well understood, the opioid receptor affinity definitely plays a role.

Here's a link to the Wikipedia article.
 
I don't believe in antidepressants in that I think depression is psychological (thought pattern based.) I think it is a general response to life not going your way and also thinking about things the wrong way. CBT is probably the best treatment.

For short term use (death in family etc) I think opioids would be far better than SSRIs. For long term use medication is not the answer IMO.

It's pointless to speculate, in 5-10 years you probably won't be able to get opiates for an amputation.
 
kazure said:
One of the most interesting substances in this regard is Tianeptine. It is chemically classified as a TCA, but lacks many classical effects of that class, and moreover it displays opioid activity at the MOR with 383-768 Ki.

Hence, it is technically an opioid, and higher dosages (normal dosages are between 10mg to 30mg) such as 100+ mg produce an unmistakable opiod-like buzz.

The antidepressant pharmacodynamics are quite complex and not well understood, the opioid receptor affinity definitely plays a role.

Here's a link to the Wikipedia article.
Click to expand...

Chemical structure written on paper can be deceiving. What matters is the spatial orientation and placement of certain functional groups. For example, the difference between an NMDA antagonist and an opioid can be as little as which enantiomer (optical isomer) it is - morphinans: DXO (a metabolite of DXM) is an NMDA antagonist while its levorotary isomer levorphanol is an opioid chemically similar to desomorphine, which itself is similar to morphine.

Phenibut can also be viewed as a substituted phenethylamine even though it has practically no pharmacological similarity to amphetamines and endogenous phenethylamines.
 
I haven't read many posts so forgive if it's been said.
But NO, I do not think opioids should be used for depression ( or as an anti-depressant).
Trust me, I love opiates/oids and i'm just saying that i think they serve their purpose for physical pain and should be left at that.
Have I used opiates for depression? yes, but it's not wise. it makes me feel better temporarily but any use longer than a few days will no longer be used as a tool but a crutch. Plus, its medicine is usually used as a bandaid (but not for every situation). but a lot of situations could be fixed without pills at all, man.
it's not natural or hitting the proper receptors to cure depression.
plus the addiction is insane.
 
Yeah classic opioids were used for depression/anxiety until it became painfully clear that the user will up their dose constantly, with or without the consent of their provider, just to achieve antidepressant/anxiolytic effect.

Buprenorphine is an opioid, but this is not too far away from stating that salvinroum a is an opioid, meaning they have atypical effects on opioid receptors.


Buprenorphine has a super high affinity for the mu 1 opioid subtype (that associated with euphoria), meaning it will muscle away agonists like morphine and heroin. In addition, it has enough efficacy to stop people from getting high, but to also stop people from going too low.


Furthermore, it blocks the kappa subtype, creating euthymia. It also has a long half-life, and metabolites with even longer half-lifes, so one dose lasts a long time (counter to kratom, ingesting plant guck multiple times daily, and paying a lot). I know there's much more nuances on how it works. Suffice to say, though, that the discovery of buprenorphine, its effects and mechanism, was nothing if not an amazingly lucky find. If there's any silver lining to the opioid epidemic, its buprenorphine.


That New York Times article title is painfully misleading. Some naive journalist looking for a story spent seven minutes on wikipedia and cooked up something about it. (no pun intended)
 
Tramadol is actually a potent SNRI and a pretty effective anti-depressant from what I can gather. Due to the high stigmatization of the "opioid epidemic" though, I highly doubt opioids will ever be considered for anything but last-line pain management.
 
Opioids have a paradoxical effect (at least for me), and it might be as a result of opioid use stigme/unavaliability, but as time goes on, I get more and more depressed when on daily or long term use, and the longer it goes, the worse it gets. I know benzodiazepines have a similar problem, increasing anxiety/depression with sustained use. When I've been on long term opioids, anything I didn't plan will make me panic, especially not having my opioids.................even when I'm not physically dependent on them. Besides, once you find a dose that works for your depression, 1 to 3 months later you'll probably need to raise that dose. And again, and again, and again, and again, etc
 
I have been self medicating with dihydrocodiene for over a year now. By dosing 120mg every morning Monday through Friday with weekends off I have managed to keep my tolerance fairly steady, and have not had to increase my dosage. I know for a fact without the small break each week my tolerance would be much higher, as the dhcs work noticibly better at the start of the week compared to thursday/Friday.
I'm definitely not recommending people try this as it can still be a struggle to not increase dose or redose if a bad or very stressful day occurs.
For me it has been a God sent though, and has nearly completely stopped all thoughts of suicide or self harm.
Has anyone else out there had any success using opioids on a schedule for depression??

Re: have also use oxys occasionally but have now stopped as the rebound depression the next day is fucking horrific
 
Haym said:
I have been self medicating with dihydrocodiene for over a year now. By dosing 120mg every morning Monday through Friday with weekends off I have managed to keep my tolerance fairly steady, and have not had to increase my dosage. I know for a fact without the small break each week my tolerance would be much higher, as the dhcs work noticibly better at the start of the week compared to thursday/Friday.
I'm definitely not recommending people try this as it can still be a struggle to not increase dose or redose if a bad or very stressful day occurs.
For me it has been a God sent though, and has nearly completely stopped all thoughts of suicide or self harm.
Has anyone else out there had any success using opioids on a schedule for depression??

Re: have also use oxys occasionally but have now stopped as the rebound depression the next day is fucking horrific
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Thats very interesting. Does that dose effect you all day or only for the morning hours? I've found the DHC duration to be quite short.
 
Tianeptine is possibly one of the worst candidates for an opiate antidepressant. Very short duration, rapid tolerance growth and strong compulsion to redose.

From my personal experience i can't say i'd endorse anyone using opiates as an antidepressant even though i commonly use them to help with my own depression.

I think the antidepressant effects come solely from the recreational aspect of opiates, i.e. euphoria. If you are talking about using drug induced euphoria as an treatment for major depression then you could make the argument for pretty much any recreational drug to be used as an antidepressant, and that scenario usually doesn't play out well.
 
I can say from personal use that I was so absolutely beyond depressed by the end of my addiction that I just had to get out. I would say that inevitably you'll only feel good for about two hours and then extremely depressed for the remainder of the day (sometimes even if I redose). Perhaps bupe or a longer acting op would work better.


Opiates used to have a nice afterglow but in longer term you sort of feel sick by the end of the high. These pills definitely have a sort of crash and its not as immediate as adderall.. more like a slow decline into depression later in the day.
 
Pickledlemons said:
Thats very interesting. Does that dose effect you all day or only for the morning hours? I've found the DHC duration to be quite short.
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I'm using the xr version which I find lasts longer, I find it is completely worn off nearing the end of my work day which is alright. Even once iv come down I'm still quiet happy, so it seems for me to have a lasting effect directly related to my depression. Although if I go longer than the weekend without it I start getting very, very down.... and angry .
 
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There is no way opioids will become antidepressants. Not in this climate. Psychedelics and MDMA on the other hand looks promising.
 
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